WA Shooter

When you shoot a bare shaft to tune for arrow spine, how far left or right of the aiming spot is too much? I shot my 2413's at 26.25" and 72# and shooting across my garage at about 20 feet, they are hitting about 1-2 inches right. I also shot a couple Gold Tip XT 75/95's that are around 30" and they hit an inch or less to the right. I get a left tear and have narrowed it down to arrow spine or hand torque.

hunter9022

at 20 feet, thats not very far. I mostly like to have them within 1 or 2 inches at 30 yards, and ive robin hooded fletched shafts with bare shafts at 20. They need to be farely close. If they're within an inch or two, i would think that would be ok, that could just be your form showing. Try and get them to actually group with your other arrows though. Then they is pewfect!!!!

ewolf

Bare shaft groups will be bigger then fletched shafts, but the middle of the group should be the same. Its either spine or touque. What i would do is give the limb bolts half a turn in. It should bring the bare shaft to the left. I always shot bare shafts in practice, all the time. If you notice with time the bare shafts move to the left, it was hand torque(Assuming tourque gets better). Therefore you would have to take turns off the bolts. Do some reading on hand position, but the bare shafts should hit with the fletched shafts. 2 inches is good but none is better. Its all about how anal you are.

JOE PA

Bare shafts consistently hitting the the right of your fletched arrows and a left tear through paper would seem to indicate the same thing is going on when you release an arrow, just that your fletching is correcting what the bare shaft can't. It doesn't sound like you are too far off, but I would try to get them to hit together.

Do the bare shafts seem to be flying straight to the target?

Two things you could check without throwing your rest off would be changing point weight, or changing the draw weight by turning the limb bolts. Of course, if you are bottomed out, you can only turn them one way.

The other thing might be to try to be careful with your grip. I have had a few bows (with reflexed risers) that I could shoot bare shafts well, but only when I was extremely careful not to torque the bow or the string with the release. Your grip might be causing what you are noticing.

Personally, I don't like to bare shaft tune aluminum arrows. If they are not hitting the target straight point on, they can bend. Then your bare shaft tuning exercise becomes impossible, unless you have a straightener. I guess even with carbon, you should spin them frequently to check their straightness, although what can you do about it if they wobble?

WA Shooter

Thanks for the suggestions. I know some of it is torque being applied at the riser. If I concentrate on keeping an extremely relaxed grip hand, the left tear gets much better. I am shooting off the riser right now because the stock grip on the '02 Bowtechs were firewood. I bought a Loesch grip, but the delivery time is 8 weeks, I think I have about 4 to go. I'm hoping it will improve my hand position and correct the torque.

Elkcrazy8

All of these points are correct and good advice, all of this would depend if your arrow rest is properly set up. I like to paper tune and finish up with a bare shaft tune to make minor final adjustments to my arrow rest. And it is correct, it all depends on how anal that you want to be. When I am finished. My bare shafts will hit in the exact spot as my fletched arrows at 30 yards. This shows me that the fletches are only stabilizing the arrow and not correcting it. This will give you less arrow drop as the fletches are digging into the air less. I shoot in the HC at the IBO shoots and do everything I can to flatten my trajectory and increase my accuracy. Even the small things add up. I also turn my limb bolts until I get the optimum groups. When doing this you are adjusting the tiller on the limbs. Even tiller on the limbs is a good place to start. I have seen some bows shoot their best with one bolt a full turn different on each limb though. Good luck.

JOE PA

W A Shooter:

Which '02 Bowtech do you have? I had an '01 Pro 38 Dual Cam which I am thinking I never should have sold. You are right that the grips were not very good. I covered the grip area of the bare riser with fleece material, like moleskin, only black. That Pro 38 was the most solid, best shooting bow I have owned to date. I replaced it with a 2003 Pro 40 Wheely. I really like the draw and grip, and lighter weight of the newer bow better, but I think the older one was more stable and had less noise, vibration, etc. and shot better for me, at least so far. I'm sure I had to set my rest just outside of the center of the grip to get the bow tuned right. With the Wheely, the grip and centershot are not even close to lined up, with center shot (measured at the limbs) way outside of grip center.

I would really like to have a bow with the older, heavier, straighter riser, and those smooth "wheels" of the Wheely. Oh well, I can dream.

WA Shooter

JOE PA,
I've got the Patriot. I love the bow, but I put a Schaffer overdraw/rest on it with prongs like a TM, and I am getting a consistantly left tear in paper. I was only shooting bare shafts to determine if I was way off on my arrow spine. I'm shooting 72# with a 2413 at 26.25". I have a timing issue to correct, and I had put a Sims cable slide on it, but I don't like it, I think it pulls the cables alot further away from the string and puts undue stress on the idler wheel and top limb. We had to untwist my harness a little to correct the top limb, it was twisted a bit.
BowTech informed me that center shot on this bow is 13/16" from the riser, when I set it up for center shot, I still get the left tear, JOE PA, did you find that your '01 shot outside of center? I've tried everything to correct the tear and have had no luck. I have read in a few places that if you have a left tear you should move the rest towards the riser, this seems backwards to me. Easton says right, NAP says left, either way I'm not getting it to correct.

JOE PA

W A Shooter:

My usual tuning problem is a right tear (right handed shooter). I have had a few bows where moving a rest to the left straightened out the right tear. The tear I get can often be altered by my grip. I have lessened the right tear by putting a little side pressure with my left thumb on the riser, lightly gripping the bow, letting the bow grip make contact with the base of my thumb and using a loose grip. It just depends on the bow. To me, at least, some bows seem much tougher to get right. With a bow that has as much riser reflex as the Patriot, and an overdraw to boot, I doubt that I would be able to get the thing right no matter what. I had an MQ1 with a Muzzy Zero Effect rest on it that would shoot bare shafts nice and straight provided I was very careful with the grip, very careful to eliminate any torque on the string, and used a long heavy stabilizer. Otherwise, I had problems. The Pro 38 I mentioned shot best for me when the centershot was 1/16" left of center as measured from the cam/limb position. Maybe it was just me, but that position worked. I got great broadhead flight and accuracy out of the bow with only a Whisker Biscuit rest. I could even take the stabilizer off and it would shoot nearly the same sized groups and the same POI as with the stabilizer on. With the MQ, taking the stabilizer off meant 4" groups at 30 yds.[:'(] I don't really know what else to say. You could try backing off the draw weight and see if that makes a difference. If it were my bow, I would take off the overdraw, but then you wouldn't be able to shoot those aluminum arrows you have.