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The Mismanagement of the PA Deer Herd

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The Mismanagement of the PA Deer Herd

Old 10-27-2010, 10:14 AM
  #71  
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Originally Posted by Bionicrooster View Post
A friend of mine belongs to a camp in (I think Lycoming county?) PA and he said over the last 4 or 5 years they have seen many more mature bucks than ever in the past. Another buddy hunts in upper bucks county (black eddy?) and he manages a nice buck every year.

Both of these guys and there camps actually scout and spend time in the woods though.
that is true but not MANY more mature bucks.i guess you could say, 5 years ago i saw 2 eight point bucks out of 5 bucks and now see 4 eight point bucks out of 5.
that i agree on but you may not see buck for MILES and very few doe and little bucks.
allowing kids to shoot the little bucks is causing the program to not work.
crews are shooting at ANY buck and calling for kids to come tag the buck.
we had kid shoot 3 bear ,yes mother with cubs and call to DADs to BRING MORE TAGS DAD.

we must make the spike 3 point and under for kids just there first year,like 12.also the mentoured thing is joke.
6 year old shooting a 12 point and when asked what gun did you use. she said,WEE-O-8.what joke that has become but great thing for ones that are doing it.
i turned 2 crews for shooting spike bucks by adults, 2 crews..i told them to their faces i would stand in court to prosecute them.

these hunters are ruining our sport. you can see i am very mad
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Old 10-27-2010, 02:00 PM
  #72  
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Originally Posted by sproulman View Post
that is true but not MANY more mature bucks.i guess you could say, 5 years ago i saw 2 eight point bucks out of 5 bucks and now see 4 eight point bucks out of 5.
that i agree on but you may not see buck for MILES and very few doe and little bucks.
allowing kids to shoot the little bucks is causing the program to not work.
crews are shooting at ANY buck and calling for kids to come tag the buck.
we had kid shoot 3 bear ,yes mother with cubs and call to DADs to BRING MORE TAGS DAD.

we must make the spike 3 point and under for kids just there first year,like 12.also the mentoured thing is joke.
6 year old shooting a 12 point and when asked what gun did you use. she said,WEE-O-8.what joke that has become but great thing for ones that are doing it.
i turned 2 crews for shooting spike bucks by adults, 2 crews..i told them to their faces i would stand in court to prosecute them.

these hunters are ruining our sport. you can see i am very mad

There is no place where there's no bucks for miles.
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Old 10-27-2010, 03:21 PM
  #73  
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There is no place where there's no bucks for miles.
What data can you cite to support that claim? The PGC doesn't release data on the number of bucks PSM and they refuse to release data on the rack sizes of 2.5+ buck.
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Old 10-28-2010, 06:52 AM
  #74  
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Originally Posted by bluebird2 View Post
What data can you cite to support that claim? The PGC doesn't release data on the number of bucks PSM and they refuse to release data on the rack sizes of 2.5+ buck.
What data can you provide to say that there's miles of land on Pa with no bucks?
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Old 10-28-2010, 11:55 AM
  #75  
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Originally Posted by DougE View Post
What data can you provide to say that there's miles of land on Pa with no bucks?
there are MILES and MILES of land here in clinton county with NO DEER.not 1.
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Old 10-29-2010, 06:56 AM
  #76  
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No there isn't.The only areas that have no deer in 2G are the areas with the worst habitat and those areas still have deer.One area you claim has no deer has been proven to have over 20 dpsm over the winter in the way of actually counting the deer by infrared surveys.That doesn't get them all so that's a minimum count.You need to get out of your truck Sproul.
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Old 10-29-2010, 09:05 AM
  #77  
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Originally Posted by DougE View Post
No there isn't.The only areas that have no deer in 2G are the areas with the worst habitat and those areas still have deer.One area you claim has no deer has been proven to have over 20 dpsm over the winter in the way of actually counting the deer by infrared surveys.That doesn't get them all so that's a minimum count.You need to get out of your truck Sproul.
ha, get out of my truck!
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Old 11-26-2010, 10:42 AM
  #78  
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Originally Posted by bluebird2 View Post
The relationship of Alt and Eveland over 30 years ago is irrelevant. Let's see if you can refute the facts he presented regarding those that were behind the new DMP and the drive for extreme herd reduction. All of that information has been documented over the last 10 years and you can't provide anything to refute it.
This is typical of the replies I've seen on PA websites from people who try to promote these homemade videos as legitimate. I can't tell you how many posts I've read of hunters trying to find out who this Eveland guy is and no one seems to know of him. Not even people he claims to have worked for and with. He's not cited in any research. All he is known for is submitting a bid to do the audit and he didn't get that. Some say sour grapes and it really looks that way, from this sportsmans eyes.
So If the guy is spinning tales about his background, logic would dictate that his video claims are home spun as well. Especially after his claims have been debunked many times over the years. Some claims are very outlandish! He just seems to be recycling conspiracies. I guess that's why those videos fizzled out pretty quick.
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Old 11-26-2010, 01:14 PM
  #79  
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So If the guy is spinning tales about his background, logic would dictate that his video claims are home spun as well. Especially after his claims have been debunked many times over the years. Some claims are very outlandish! He just seems to be recycling conspiracies. I guess that's why those videos fizzled out pretty quic
That simply is not true. The 1998 SCS audit directed the DCNR to use political pressure to force DCNR to reduce the herd and even though the PGC didn't approve any herd reduction methods specifically for SFL, DCNR still got their forests certified. Furthermore, the PGC's own data proves there was no problem with the health of our herd and that reducing the herd did not produce the expected increase in forest health. In 2009 13 of 22 WMU's still had regeneration rates of less than 50% and regeneration rates under 50% are rated as poor.
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