Is there an argument for banning carbons for hunting?
06-01-2008, 04:10 AM
#1
Nontypical Buck
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: west central wi USA
Posts: 2,242
Is there an argument for banning carbons for hunting?
Ok, I suspect this is going to generate some dialog, so I'll preface this by saying up front that I have no antipathy toward carbon arrows personally. While I'm an aluminum shooter, I have no problem with archers choosing carbon arrows. It is not my policy to malign another's choice of archery technology. To each his own. Frankly I'm hoping that the discussion will put my mind to ease on the subject.
The problem I have is that in the last couple of years I've seen, and/or heard of, too many deer carrying non-lethal carbon arrows in places that they can't get at andthat they can't break off. With aluminum or wood, the deer seem to be able to break them off. the shaft inside the body is isolated by scar tissue and the deer goes on living. My concern is that the unbreakable carbon arrows will alwaysleave an open pathway for infection and the deer with die a slow death.If nothing else, the non-hunting public is seeing and reporting these animals which is not good press for bowhunting. Like I said, this has been bothering me for a while. I'm hoping someone can shed some light on it for me.
The problem I have is that in the last couple of years I've seen, and/or heard of, too many deer carrying non-lethal carbon arrows in places that they can't get at andthat they can't break off. With aluminum or wood, the deer seem to be able to break them off. the shaft inside the body is isolated by scar tissue and the deer goes on living. My concern is that the unbreakable carbon arrows will alwaysleave an open pathway for infection and the deer with die a slow death.If nothing else, the non-hunting public is seeing and reporting these animals which is not good press for bowhunting. Like I said, this has been bothering me for a while. I'm hoping someone can shed some light on it for me.
06-01-2008, 05:58 AM
#2
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Ohio
Posts: 7,876
RE: Is there an argument for banning carbons for hunting?
Well lead going by the way side so I guess carbon could some day if they find out something objectional about it.
As far as them not breaking, you did say you don't shoot them. There's no worrys there let me tell ya.
The arrow being the problem? I don't think so, and I don't think it occurs very often, butof course it would as more and more people use archery to hunt. I know Ohio has grown in numbers of archers.
As far as them not breaking, you did say you don't shoot them. There's no worrys there let me tell ya.
The arrow being the problem? I don't think so, and I don't think it occurs very often, butof course it would as more and more people use archery to hunt. I know Ohio has grown in numbers of archers.
06-01-2008, 06:05 AM
#3
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Michigan
Posts: 879
RE: Is there an argument for banning carbons for hunting?
aluminums just aren't as efficient for killing game as carbons are. I've never seen a deer running around with an arrow sticking out from it. I have seen plenty of missed shots with rifles and shotguns that have caused infections.
06-01-2008, 07:49 AM
#5
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Blissfield MI USA
Posts: 5,293
RE: Is there an argument for banning carbons for hunting?
ORIGINAL: Swift Arrow
aluminums just aren't as efficient for killing game as carbons are.
aluminums just aren't as efficient for killing game as carbons are.
Carbons are not going anywhere, take my word for it, as a matter of fact aluminum arrows will go by the wayside before carbons. It has nothing to do with which works better or what one has the potential to wound more game. It has to do with what people will and won't buy. Carbon arrows are way to popular now for them to go anywhere.
I'm not huge carbon fan either, but I don't feel they are responsible for wounded game. That is completely on the archer, if you make a bad shot you make a bad shot. Heavy aluminum arrows are just as tough as some carbons. As a matter of fact I have had more carbons break on me than I have aluminum ones.
Paul
06-01-2008, 07:55 AM
#6
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Dover, PA USA
Posts: 5,497
RE: Is there an argument for banning carbons for hunting?
Carbon arrows will take a tremendous amount of abuse head on.........laterally I don't think that they are any more durable than an aluminum arrow.
You wanna test that if it's bothering you go buy a 2315 aluminum shaft and a comparably spined carbon shaft and whip them sideways into a tree. See which one breaks first and how much force it takes to break one vs the other.
IMO (no offense) worrying about a deer being able to reach and "break off" a non lethal arrow is an extremely trivial notion.Think about just where an arrow has to be located to be a concern? Where can an arrow be lodged that it won't come out or break of through contact and movement that will also NOT kill the deer at the same time.
A shoulder hit that doesn't reach vitals is only going to penetrate an inch or so, the general movement and contact with brush is gonna break or dislodge that arrow in short order.
Where exactly are you picturing an arrow STUCK in a deer that except for rare cases is a concern for the non hunting general public? I have been bowhunting for 23 years and in my circle of friends I can tell you that NONE of us has ever seen or heard of a deer running around with an arrow stuck in it. That's ALOT of bowhunting experience.
I'm sure it can happen but you really need to find something else to worry about..........this one is of extremely little significance and relevance from my experience.
You wanna test that if it's bothering you go buy a 2315 aluminum shaft and a comparably spined carbon shaft and whip them sideways into a tree. See which one breaks first and how much force it takes to break one vs the other.
IMO (no offense) worrying about a deer being able to reach and "break off" a non lethal arrow is an extremely trivial notion.Think about just where an arrow has to be located to be a concern? Where can an arrow be lodged that it won't come out or break of through contact and movement that will also NOT kill the deer at the same time.
A shoulder hit that doesn't reach vitals is only going to penetrate an inch or so, the general movement and contact with brush is gonna break or dislodge that arrow in short order.
Where exactly are you picturing an arrow STUCK in a deer that except for rare cases is a concern for the non hunting general public? I have been bowhunting for 23 years and in my circle of friends I can tell you that NONE of us has ever seen or heard of a deer running around with an arrow stuck in it. That's ALOT of bowhunting experience.
I'm sure it can happen but you really need to find something else to worry about..........this one is of extremely little significance and relevance from my experience.
06-01-2008, 08:01 AM
#7
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Mont County, Pa
Posts: 7,368
RE: Is there an argument for banning carbons for hunting?
ORIGINAL: Swift Arrow
aluminums just aren't as efficient for killing game as carbons are.
aluminums just aren't as efficient for killing game as carbons are.
06-01-2008, 08:09 AM
#8
Boone & Crockett
Join Date: Oct 1998
Location: Hughesville, PA USA
Posts: 18,322
RE: Is there an argument for banning carbons for hunting?
ORIGINAL: early in
I don't know where you get this info from, but I thinkyou mighthear more chatter about this thanthe initial thread!
ORIGINAL: Swift Arrow
aluminums just aren't as efficient for killing game as carbons are.
aluminums just aren't as efficient for killing game as carbons are.
As far as carbon arrows, In the line of thinking of the original post, lead should be banned too then as it can stay in the body and cause infection etc. Sure carbon is tougher than wood or aluminum and when you (thread starter) say:
last couple of years I've seen, and/or heard of, too many deer carrying non-lethal carbon arrows
The material of the arrow is not the route of the problem. Carbon arrows, (I feel the heavier the better) have way too many pros than cons.
06-01-2008, 08:18 AM
#9
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Central Minnesota
Posts: 9,445
RE: Is there an argument for banning carbons for hunting?
ORIGINAL: Paul L Mohr
Really? Your going to have to do some serious explaining with some science and proof to back that one up. Carbons are popular because they are light and people believe they don't bend and/or are straighter than aluminum arrows, neither of which is true. And being lighter really doesn't help make them anymore efficient.
Carbons are not going anywhere, take my word for it, as a matter of fact aluminum arrows will go by the wayside before carbons. It has nothing to do with which works better or what one has the potential to wound more game. It has to do with what people will and won't buy. Carbon arrows are way to popular now for them to go anywhere.
I'm not huge carbon fan either, but I don't feel they are responsible for wounded game. That is completely on the archer, if you make a bad shot you make a bad shot. Heavy aluminum arrows are just as tough as some carbons. As a matter of fact I have had more carbons break on me than I have aluminum ones.
Paul
ORIGINAL: Swift Arrow
aluminums just aren't as efficient for killing game as carbons are.
aluminums just aren't as efficient for killing game as carbons are.
Carbons are not going anywhere, take my word for it, as a matter of fact aluminum arrows will go by the wayside before carbons. It has nothing to do with which works better or what one has the potential to wound more game. It has to do with what people will and won't buy. Carbon arrows are way to popular now for them to go anywhere.
I'm not huge carbon fan either, but I don't feel they are responsible for wounded game. That is completely on the archer, if you make a bad shot you make a bad shot. Heavy aluminum arrows are just as tough as some carbons. As a matter of fact I have had more carbons break on me than I have aluminum ones.
Paul
06-01-2008, 08:25 AM
#10
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Texas
Posts: 2,363
RE: Is there an argument for banning carbons for hunting?
ORIGINAL: Wingbone
Ok, I suspect this is going to generate some dialog, so I'll preface this by saying up front that I have no antipathy toward carbon arrows personally. While I'm an aluminum shooter, I have no problem with archers choosing carbon arrows. It is not my policy to malign another's choice of archery technology. To each his own. Frankly I'm hoping that the discussion will put my mind to ease on the subject.
The problem I have is that in the last couple of years I've seen, and/or heard of, too many deer carrying non-lethal carbon arrows in places that they can't get at andthat they can't break off. With aluminum or wood, the deer seem to be able to break them off. the shaft inside the body is isolated by scar tissue and the deer goes on living. My concern is that the unbreakable carbon arrows will alwaysleave an open pathway for infection and the deer with die a slow death.If nothing else, the non-hunting public is seeing and reporting these animals which is not good press for bowhunting. Like I said, this has been bothering me for a while. I'm hoping someone can shed some light on it for me.
Ok, I suspect this is going to generate some dialog, so I'll preface this by saying up front that I have no antipathy toward carbon arrows personally. While I'm an aluminum shooter, I have no problem with archers choosing carbon arrows. It is not my policy to malign another's choice of archery technology. To each his own. Frankly I'm hoping that the discussion will put my mind to ease on the subject.
The problem I have is that in the last couple of years I've seen, and/or heard of, too many deer carrying non-lethal carbon arrows in places that they can't get at andthat they can't break off. With aluminum or wood, the deer seem to be able to break them off. the shaft inside the body is isolated by scar tissue and the deer goes on living. My concern is that the unbreakable carbon arrows will alwaysleave an open pathway for infection and the deer with die a slow death.If nothing else, the non-hunting public is seeing and reporting these animals which is not good press for bowhunting. Like I said, this has been bothering me for a while. I'm hoping someone can shed some light on it for me.
I have shot both arrows over th last 10-12 years, I am not sure who told you that a carbon arrow "can't break off" but they probably have no experience with them either. I have experience with carbon and everytime that I did not make a pass through shot my arrows got broke. I don't think you will ever have to worry about the carbon's being banned b/c of it either. You need to check with who ever told you that carbons can't break and find out if they have ever shot them b/c it doesn't sound to me like your source has much experience with them. Again, I don't think aluminum's are bad arrows nor do I think carbon's are bad arrows...I think this is a option for the archer....