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Old 10-29-2002, 06:38 AM
  #21  
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: hartland wi USA
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Default RE: I want to become a hunting guide, what must I do?

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Now Schmalts what is this B.S. about &quot;not becoming a guide if your not a good hunter&quot; Some of the hunt instinct is natural but a big part of it is learned. Or did you hit the ground bugling those 400 class bulls in on your baby rattle? Give the kid a break...everybody has to start somewhere.


Edited by - surestrike on 10/27/2002 13:57:44
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I agree, but should a guy who is just starting as a guide who is NOT a good hunter be taking out clients on lets say, expensive private land hunts? I think your not getting my point. Like i stated, you need to match up the right combo of hunter and guide. Also need to match the right guide to the right hunt. Do you really think this kid should learn about guiding on a hunt that a client is paying big money for a once in a lifetime hunt? I think he would start on a different level of hunt, and work his way up. Some guys are not rich, and spend a couple months of take home pay on a hunt and deserve to have a better guide than a newby thats learning, and may have less expertise than the hunter himself. If you think that anyone who has a guides liscense is qualified ,That would be BS in my opinion.
I know guides put up with a lot of fat out of shape high rollers, but not all clients are that way. Its funny, every time i used a guide thats all the guides did was rip on the past hunts clients. Maybe they should consider a new line of work if they cant handle the reality of the fact that not all clients are good fit hunters.
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Old 10-29-2002, 08:58 AM
  #22  
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Default RE: I want to become a hunting guide, what must I do?

Onliest thing you'll git from a guide school is a lighter wallet. Cain't teach what needs to be knowed in a 6 week school. Better to go hang with an' old timer fer a season.


BJ
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Old 10-29-2002, 10:53 AM
  #23  
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Elizabeth CO USA
Posts: 68
Default RE: I want to become a hunting guide, what must I do?

Schmalts,
Sounds like you got this thing all figured out why the heck do you even need a guide? I think you should take up your problem with the outfitter who put you with the guide child in the first place.

I was refering to the poor kid whos asking for advice on how to become a guide. Thats the one who needs a break not the little punk or the outfitter you got stuck with.

Next time you book a trip why don't you inform the outfitter of your superior skills and abilities that way he'll know what your special requirements are. And if he can't or won't accomidate you don't book the trip.

And my point is that hunting guides are made not born. It's the outfitters reponsibility to use competent guides. If you aren't atistfied then talk to him and if you don't get any satisfaction report him to the regualting state and file a formal complaint. Those stay on the outfitters record.

But don't take it out on some kid who wants to become a guide!
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Old 10-29-2002, 12:16 PM
  #24  
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: hartland wi USA
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Default RE: I want to become a hunting guide, what must I do?

Surestrike , your the type of guide/outfitter me and many others dont need, and some do. You either dont listen or read. If you read my post earier you would have read my reason for using a guide/outfitter. Yes i do have it figured out how to hunt, and dont need a guide for the most part but having a caller is help while bowhunting. I stated before, that some guys pay for having a good area or private land pre-scouted before they get there due to limited vacation time to pre-scout. And just so you know, i do tell the outfitters that i am a good hunter and what i want from them.I also tell them to be up front with me on quality of the animals because i would be pissed if he was lying, and if i could do better on public land. not everyone need you to hold their hand,or cook fancy meals to make up for poor hunting land. Every time i go on my own i find big animals, but spend the first 5 days of my 10 day hunt scouting them out. My time is valuable and i would rather pay to have those 5 days for hunting, and i know a lot of guys who are in the same boat. Thats what i need a guide for, any more questions Mr Pro guide? Beaver Jack sounds far more knowledgable than you, by realising that the guide/ hunter match is important, and to have a good time. For me that means hunt hard, find game, eat anything, spike camp if needed to do so. You sound like the guy who only wants fat lazy clients who dont know anything . There are a lot of crooked Outfitters out there who hire any body with a guide permit, and will lie their asses off just to get your money, so if you take offense at that it makes me wonder what side of the fence your outfitters ride on.

Edited by - schmalts on 10/29/2002 13:21:16
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Old 10-30-2002, 05:15 PM
  #25  
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Rancho Murieta CA USA
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Default RE: I want to become a hunting guide, what must I do?

HNI - I went on my first guided hunt this year and I can't understand why anyone would want that job. It's back breakin' work, up every day fore light for 2 months straight and half the hunters are a serious pain in the ass. The camp I was in in had a couple of guys that had obviously not spent a minute getting in shape and expected the world from the guide. The guide I had busted his ass climbing mountains (and nearly killing me) to show me some good elk. I truly appreciated the job my guide did for me, but that was not the concensus of all the hunters in our camp. This has got to be one of the worlds most truly under appreciated professions (and probably under paid) Thank god for the gritty bunch that have the sand and expertise to do the job and the patience to put up with candy assed hunters that don't want to work for it!!!
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Old 10-30-2002, 09:20 PM
  #26  
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Elizabeth CO USA
Posts: 68
Default RE: I want to become a hunting guide, what must I do?

Schmalts,
Now you've gone and done it! I'm going to have to consult Beaver Jack by radio before doing anymore hunting. Thanks for the tip Sounds like your full of good advice.
I don't take offense to anything except the fact that your back slaping some poor kid who asked how to become a guide. And that's what I'm refering to.

Edited by - surestrike on 10/30/2002 22:22:06
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Old 10-31-2002, 06:16 AM
  #27  
 
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Location: hartland wi USA
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Default RE: I want to become a hunting guide, what must I do?

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Schmalts,
Now you've gone and done it! I'm going to have to consult Beaver Jack by radio before doing anymore hunting. Thanks for the tip Sounds like your full of good advice.
I don't take offense to anything except the fact that your back slaping some poor kid who asked how to become a guide. And that's what I'm refering to.

Edited by - surestrike on 10/30/2002 22:22:06
<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote></font id=quote><font face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' size=2 id=quote> If you read your other posts that wasnt what you refering too, you specificly made a smart comment and asked what i needed or used a guide for so i told you, again . Maybe dont take offense so fast next time and start making smart comments, and read the posts a little better. I like a good debate as good as anyone but hate it when someone does not read the facts in earlier posts before making snotty comments that already had an answer.
The advise i gave to this kid was just that, and something to think about for him. I Just want him to realise some of the expectations that may arise from a client who is on what he referred to as the &quot;big hunts&quot; , and i assummed he was talking about high dollar hunts that he probably saw in videos, not some 1500$ public land drop camp special with low quality/kill ratio. Just rtying to help him as much as anyone else.
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Old 10-31-2002, 12:17 PM
  #28  
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Location: Rochester NY USA
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Default RE: I want to become a hunting guide, what must I do?

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Now wait a minute Smalty. I reckin' I got 'bout as good a success rate as any, but many of my clients complain 'bout me doin' all the huntin' an' they jus' git to pull the trigger. Bein' a good guide means bein' able to fill fellers out, but also make adjustments due to physical limitations an' preferences of the client. Give me an' ol' fart with a pacemaker an' a case of altitude sickness, who wants to shoot a 350 class bull only, an' I gotta try to accomodate 'im (or make him so sick an' sore he'll shoot any good 5x5). Guidin' is 50% huntin' an' 50% customer relations. Good people skills is impotent. Mind readin' an' miracle workin' don't hurt either.

BJ

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Well BJ, you're the type of guide that is exactly the reason I am very hessitant to book a hunt with anyone. I happen to be one of those &quot;ol farts with a bad ticker (no pacemaker thank God)&quot; and can't do a lot of strenous activity any more so I did get a little on the heavy side. Not by choice, you can believe that. But the point is, I still hunt hard but at a slower pace and I can't drag or pack out a kill like I used to. Your comments and those of some others here kinda set my perspective on hunting guides in concrete. If I ever booked a hunt, it's not because I'm rich (far from it) or think it's guaranteed that I take a 350 class bull. I would book a hunt because I want to take an good animal that I would otherwise never have a chance at living in upstate, NY. I would be perfectly happy with a decent size animal that I'd consider a trophy and not what some B&C or P&Y club thinks is a trophy. Too much emphasis is being placed on trophy animals that the love and excitement of just being there and having an opportunity is lost these days. That's what I'm all about. I could care less if I get a world record or not. With enough money, I could book a &quot;hunt&quot; on some ranch or preserve where the deer are fed high protein feed and take a world class deer or elkm then tell everyone I got it in some wild, remote place. If that's what other people want, go for it but that's not why I hunt or would book a hunt. You're lucky enough to be born in raised (I'm assuming) in a place where you can hunt great animals like big mulies, whitetails, bear, etc. I wasn't an neither were most of the &quot;pain in the ass Easterners&quot; you and others here mentioned. My question is if you don't like putting up with peoples' quirks and differences, why be a guide? The money can't be that good. Why don't you and your outfitters tell people the truth when they call or book a hunt and give them honest and reasonable expectations other than the typical &quot;Our success ratio for last yr was 99%&quot;. That's part of the problem. Outfitters advertise with a bunch of hogwash and naive people with money to book a hunt go there with the wrong expectations. So you'd lose a couple of clients if you told them there wasn't a 90% chance they'd get a record book animal. Those are the clients you don't need anyway. Me, I'd just be in it for the fun and excitement of the hunt. But I doubt I ever will because I'd fear that the guide or guides I got stuck with, think like you and some others here. I'm no candy ass and I wouldn't be just some fat guy sitting around watching you work. I'd help as much as I could. Hell, if I had to die because I overdid it skinning an animal or helping pack it out, so what? I'd die happy.

Sorry for the long post, but ya'll guides with the holier than thou attitude really fired my old fat ass up.


Edited by - Crowpecker on 10/31/2002 13:49:08
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Old 10-31-2002, 02:55 PM
  #29  
Typical Buck
 
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Default RE: I want to become a hunting guide, what must I do?

Crowpecker,
You got a good attitude. I'd be happy to guide you. I was jus' emphasizin' the near impossible task guides sometimes have. They have to please people, no matter what the circumstances. Consider this a minute. A camp is licensed and an outfitter runs maybe 30 hunters thru in a year. If he's good, and got a 90% success rate, that means that 27 hunters are goin' home with meat. Now consider that you can only realistically ride a maximum of 5 miles to your hunting area each morning (unless you get your hunters up at 2AM). Then throw in the fact that game in any given unit is captive game (no migration and reliant of feed grounds for winter feed). Now, considering all this, can you imagine all 27 of those hunters being able to kill big bulls year in and out? No, only one or two hunters in a camp will score a real trophy-class bull each year. Such a limited area will only produce so much. Yet every one of those fellers thinks they should have a B&C elk. Usually, they get a dose of how hard it is to hunt and end up settling for a lesser bull. You wanna know the real secret to killin' trophy class bulls? Get close. Don't tell anyone, but the real secret to killin' big bulls on a guided hunt is being prepared to go home empty handed. That's right. 99% of pay hunters aren't prepared for this, so they kill small bulls as the pressure mounts and they aren't seeing what they want, cause face it, it ain't that common. Time limitations, the big investment, and the fact that people can't bear to fail all work against the hunter realizing a true trophy. The most successful hunters are the ones that enjoy the ride, no matter what size bull's on the end of it.

BJ
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Old 11-06-2002, 08:46 AM
  #30  
Spike
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Rochester NY USA
Posts: 98
Default RE: I want to become a hunting guide, what must I do?

Ahh, BJ, that's what I wanted to hear. The real truth. I knew ya had it in ya! LOL.. I didn't mean to blast you or any other guide. I can only imagine how hard it is to try and please some of those people with out of whack expectations. I couldn't do it. For one thing, I'm not really a people person. I get along fine with most, but have a real hard time dealing with idiots. God bless you all for being able to put up with a lot of stuff. I just thought that maybe, if these prospective clients were told that their chances were slim of taking a record class animal but the possibility exists, then maybe they'd come with a little more realistic dreams AND have FUN at the same time. Even if it does mean you go home empty. Not all of the people booking these hunts are rich. I have friends that dream of it like I do and probably never will be able to afford it. I have other friends that have taken second mortgages or other loans and/or saved for years to be able to go. Maybe some day for me. That's what keeps me going.
Thanks for the reply.


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