Ok, so I'm pretty ignorant to the whole dog hunting debate...I tried learning about it from the Virginia Hunting Dog Alliance posts, but I just couldn't keep up...could someone please give me a short version of the arguments for and against hunting with dogs? thanks for any info, it will be much appreciated

The laws in VA are the problem and the fact that the dog chasers have learned how to abuse them is the second part.

Laws....... They originally were made for real fox hunters. Then in the 50's they added in all hunters and the deer hunters learned how to abuse them as time went on.
A person cannot train dogs on deer out of season in VA. However a person can train on foxes 365 in VA. No problem you let your deer hounds loose and if confronted by a warden all the lawbreaker has to say is the magic words, "they're chasing foxes". That's it, problem over. Well the problem of getting a ticket is over. The dog chasers train anytime they want to - even during bow, spring gobbler, Sundays, you name it, day or night.

The other law is that a person can continue the chase onto prohibited lands as long as they're unarmed. Prohibited = posted property = your property. What you say? Yes a person can state they're following fox (spelled d-e-e-r) hounds any day of the year onto posted lands under the guise of looking for dogs or following the chase and you the land owner can't stop them. Swell huh?

These 2 absurd laws are abused in other ways as well. Say you have a small piece and the resident dog chasers want to hunt your land. No problem they go to the far side drop off dogs, line their land and when the dogs chase the deer out they shoot them. Or they send in several guys hooting for "lost dogs" (that don't exist at all) to do a man drive of your land. All 100% legal.
Throw in the packs that run at large for hours or days on end that get away from the hunt and you can see what it does to still hunting or those that do not want dogs on their lands. Short is you can't stop them and your land is their land so to speak.


I called several game wardens to stop some dog chasers running deer and this is what I got back from them. They won't even bother to ticket them because the dog training law is the only law of it's kind that lets the criminal proclaim their innocence and go free. " I was running on foxes" is all they have to say and they get off. It's based on what the accused says, not the facts that the dogs were indeed chasing deer out of season. Imagine if all laws were that absurd? "I wasn't speeding", ok you can go now.

BB did you get that reply as a email or letter? It would be a good idea to hold onto it.

Bigg~BirddVA,

Thanks for the info. Now I can definitely see what all the fuss is about. Does this same problem occur with people running bears with dogs during the off season?

The dog training season in the western half of VA(around Aug-Sept) doesn't interfere with deer hunting, but I'm sure it can't be good for the deer.[/align]

I have the full emails saved. There are several from different people. I have phone and pager numbers too.

The bear hunters I can't say as we don't have them where I hunt. I would imagine there aren't as many of them as deer dog chasers. I think their seasons are different and they get a chase season. I don't think they create a mess like the deer doggers do. Just like real fox hunters don't cause issues. I've to date only ever seen one real fox hunt. Imagine that? 30 years in SE VA and only 1? But the dog chasers use them as a way to cause issues. I had every Sat. of bow screwed with by dogs from an adjoining club on the land I pay to hunt on. You can see how that might get old real quick.

I spoke with a retired game warden who asked not to have his name mentioned or printed. He suggested posting your property with "trapping in progress" signs and place as many traps as necessary to discourage unwanted guests. 0-1000, whatever it takes to get the message across. Dog hunters don't like to see their dogs in traps, so they stay off of the posted land. It's legal and it works.

Second he suggested hiring an attorney to prosecuted hunt clubs who trespass "off" or"from" timber company land. Many timber companies fold immediately when faced with lawsuits, frivilous or not. They simply do not want the bad press, and don't care to send employees to court to fight for something that earns them very little money, if any at all.

Many clubs are hunting onland that forbids use with dogs. Check with the timber company and see what restrictions they have placed on the holdings near you and inform the game warden. Illegal hunting occurs when dogs are released in violation of landowner permission. Dog hunting on non-dog land is illegal. The club beside you is probably hunting illegal if you check it out. I know I am writing letters as we speak and hope to publish what properties in my area are off limits to dogs. If VDGIF won'tenforce the law where I live, I will.

How about Sunday hunting? Are you for it?

Good idea with the signs I've heard the same thing. Most of the timber companies have it in their lease not to have stands within 100 yards of the property lines and to not disturb adjoining properties. The timber companies don't want the problems or bad press and they know if they have a club not following the rules they have people standing in line to lease the land. I'm sure other land owners feel the same way. This is a copy of Meadwestvaco's lease agreement.[/align]https://www.meadwestvacohunting.com/...HL_MEMBERS_DOC[/align][/align]

I'm for Sunday hunting.

WWOOOOWWWW,

I like the part that says the tenant is not to intefer or harass neighbors or other hunters in any way!! Ain't that a crock of luck. Take that one to court and win every time!!! Thanks, I'll keep that one in my pocket for a rainy day!!

Thanks, again.