Cast 38-55 gas -checks?
04-27-2008, 10:43 AM
#11
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Hayes, Va.
Posts: 2,332
RE: Cast 38-55 gas -checks?
When I load my .45-70 cartridges with a 405 gr. RNFP Laser Cast bullet and about 68 grs of BP, I use a .030 fiber wad. This the same as a GC and a lot cheaper. I experience no leading and very good accuracy.
I shoot these rounds from my original '84 Springfield Trapdoor and my Pedersoli Sharps '74. I haven't run any rounds across my Chrono yet shooting the black powder rounds but will shortly.
I don't want to chide anyone for their actions, but I would not use a pure lead bullet in a cartridge gun unless I was shooting a cap or flint lock. Just my thoughts, of course.
I shoot these rounds from my original '84 Springfield Trapdoor and my Pedersoli Sharps '74. I haven't run any rounds across my Chrono yet shooting the black powder rounds but will shortly.
I don't want to chide anyone for their actions, but I would not use a pure lead bullet in a cartridge gun unless I was shooting a cap or flint lock. Just my thoughts, of course.
04-27-2008, 03:11 PM
#12
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Rivesville, WV
Posts: 3,192
RE: Cast 38-55 gas -checks?
When I wrote my second post I meant to write it with respect. I hope it was taken that way. I also write this reply with complete respect, so please accept it as such.
I have seen some nasty things done to barrels with improper wadding being used. That is why I said I would never consider a metal GC. IMO you are basically adding an additional projectile, and you are putting it inside the case. I avoid any filler's or even wads inside the case. Are they safe?? Yes-but only if applied properly. That is when I brought up beginner reloaders. I would hate to see a beginner "Ring" a perfectly good firearm due to inexperience. That was my only point.
I am sure you know of what you speak.
I have pushed pure lead up to 1650 fps without any leading problems. I do not think you would have any problem at all with 1300 fps. But this is just my opinion. Tom.
I have seen some nasty things done to barrels with improper wadding being used. That is why I said I would never consider a metal GC. IMO you are basically adding an additional projectile, and you are putting it inside the case. I avoid any filler's or even wads inside the case. Are they safe?? Yes-but only if applied properly. That is when I brought up beginner reloaders. I would hate to see a beginner "Ring" a perfectly good firearm due to inexperience. That was my only point.
I am sure you know of what you speak.
I have pushed pure lead up to 1650 fps without any leading problems. I do not think you would have any problem at all with 1300 fps. But this is just my opinion. Tom.
04-27-2008, 08:23 PM
#13
Fork Horn
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: NW Colorado
Posts: 199
RE: Cast 38-55 gas -checks?
I'd have to agree with the someone else here. Load it with Black Powder. If your afraid of BP, then use some Hodgden Triple 7. Its smokeless powder that is made to smoke more like Original BP, and cleans up with water.
04-28-2008, 05:24 AM
#14
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Hayes, Va.
Posts: 2,332
RE: Cast 38-55 gas -checks?
ORIGINAL: HEAD0001
When I wrote my second post I meant to write it with respect. I hope it was taken that way. I also write this reply with complete respect, so please accept it as such.
I have seen some nasty things done to barrels with improper wadding being used. That is why I said I would never consider a metal GC. IMO you are basically adding an additional projectile, and you are putting it inside the case. I avoid any filler's or even wads inside the case. Are they safe?? Yes-but only if applied properly. That is when I brought up beginner reloaders. I would hate to see a beginner "Ring" a perfectly good firearm due to inexperience. That was my only point.
I am sure you know of what you speak.
I have pushed pure lead up to 1650 fps without any leading problems. I do not think you would have any problem at all with 1300 fps. But this is just my opinion. Tom.
When I wrote my second post I meant to write it with respect. I hope it was taken that way. I also write this reply with complete respect, so please accept it as such.
I have seen some nasty things done to barrels with improper wadding being used. That is why I said I would never consider a metal GC. IMO you are basically adding an additional projectile, and you are putting it inside the case. I avoid any filler's or even wads inside the case. Are they safe?? Yes-but only if applied properly. That is when I brought up beginner reloaders. I would hate to see a beginner "Ring" a perfectly good firearm due to inexperience. That was my only point.
I am sure you know of what you speak.
I have pushed pure lead up to 1650 fps without any leading problems. I do not think you would have any problem at all with 1300 fps. But this is just my opinion. Tom.
I don't think I ever heard of anyone being worried about a wad in a BPCR shell. Thatis a standard way of loading BP cartridges. To actually load BP without a wad is asking for a leading problem. If I remember right one of the BP Kahunas, Mr. Sam Fadala, uses and recommends this method for reloading BP cartridges.
04-28-2008, 09:02 AM
#15
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Texas - BUT NOW in Madison County, NY
Posts: 6,270
RE: Cast 38-55 gas -checks?
"I have seen some nasty things done to barrels with improper wadding being used. That is why I said I would never consider a metal GC. IMO you are basically adding an additional projectile, and you are putting it inside the case. I avoid any filler's or even wads inside the case. Are they safe?? Yes-but only if applied properly. That is when I brought up beginner reloaders. I would hate to see a beginner "Ring" a perfectly good firearm due to inexperience. That was my only point."
I certainly did not take any offense at all to your post-as a matter of fact, I was aware that some people have apparently had barrel-ring problems from the use of some kinds of fillers,so I know it has happened. I am not exactly sure what the rest of their load consisted of, so I cannot guarantee that my use of an inverted gascheck would not produce such a problem-all I can say is that it hasn't done it YET in any of my guns. Guess that's little comfort, and certainly NOT a guarantee!
What I can say is that wadding has been used in black-powder cartridgessince at least the days of the .577 Snider, and probably before, with perfect satisfaction. But these max out at 25,000 PSI or less. When one gets into the field of cast-bullet smokeless loads, as Pavomesa commented, "alot of it is witchcraft"!
(I too have used gaschecks in handgun cartridges to malke shot loads-a GC under the shot charge, and one crimped on top. Worked fine in .45 Colt with 8 grains of Unique for the propelling charge.)
04-28-2008, 01:09 PM
#16
Typical Buck
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location:
Posts: 692
RE: Cast 38-55 gas -checks?
My Win 1894 is designed for smokeless so I won't be feeding it BP or 777.I won't use 777 in my .54 anymore Re:less reliable than FFG,just as dirty to clean and hangfires even with #11 mag primers.Oldtimers used to use old hornet/bee nest material for a wad.Lubed felt may be better..................Harold
04-28-2008, 03:41 PM
#17
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Rivesville, WV
Posts: 3,192
RE: Cast 38-55 gas -checks?
ORIGINAL: rafsob
With all due respect pardner and I say this with tongue in cheek, butyou may need to take up underwater basket weaving which may be a bit more safer - if you think this procedure unsafe!
I don't think I ever heard of anyone being worried about a wad in a BPCR shell. Thatis a standard way of loading BP cartridges. To actually load BP without a wad is asking for a leading problem. If I remember right one of the BP Kahunas, Mr. Sam Fadala, uses and recommends this method for reloading BP cartridges.
ORIGINAL: HEAD0001
When I wrote my second post I meant to write it with respect. I hope it was taken that way. I also write this reply with complete respect, so please accept it as such.
I have seen some nasty things done to barrels with improper wadding being used. That is why I said I would never consider a metal GC. IMO you are basically adding an additional projectile, and you are putting it inside the case. I avoid any filler's or even wads inside the case. Are they safe?? Yes-but only if applied properly. That is when I brought up beginner reloaders. I would hate to see a beginner "Ring" a perfectly good firearm due to inexperience. That was my only point.
I am sure you know of what you speak.
I have pushed pure lead up to 1650 fps without any leading problems. I do not think you would have any problem at all with 1300 fps. But this is just my opinion. Tom.
When I wrote my second post I meant to write it with respect. I hope it was taken that way. I also write this reply with complete respect, so please accept it as such.
I have seen some nasty things done to barrels with improper wadding being used. That is why I said I would never consider a metal GC. IMO you are basically adding an additional projectile, and you are putting it inside the case. I avoid any filler's or even wads inside the case. Are they safe?? Yes-but only if applied properly. That is when I brought up beginner reloaders. I would hate to see a beginner "Ring" a perfectly good firearm due to inexperience. That was my only point.
I am sure you know of what you speak.
I have pushed pure lead up to 1650 fps without any leading problems. I do not think you would have any problem at all with 1300 fps. But this is just my opinion. Tom.
I don't think I ever heard of anyone being worried about a wad in a BPCR shell. Thatis a standard way of loading BP cartridges. To actually load BP without a wad is asking for a leading problem. If I remember right one of the BP Kahunas, Mr. Sam Fadala, uses and recommends this method for reloading BP cartridges.
I would agree with you if I was talking about BP loads. However the post is not about BP loads. You injected BP loads. The author is talking about smokeless loads.
Basically when you do your BP load you are compressing the load and using a wad as a buffer between your powder and your bullet. Correct?? So therefore air space is not a problem.
Unlike a smokeless load where some reloader's try to use a faster burning powder so that they can save money by using a faster burning powder. When they are only putting a small amount of powder in the large 45-70 case they can create a powder position problem. Correct?? I would rather spend a little more on powder and try to fill the case(as much as possible). This way I can avoid using fillers or wadding.
Again I am not questioning their use, I am saying that it is not a good thing for beginning reloader's to try. Especially witout an expanded explanation?? Do you really disagree with this??
I am by no means a reloading expert. But I do have 4-45/70's, and I have been reloading, and casting smokeless and BP loads for more years than I care to talk about. I have been lucky and never had any problems. But I have also never used fillers, wadding or even wads. Even in my BP loads. But then I am no expert competitor either. Just an every day hunter and shooter.
I did try Puf-Lon one time, boy was that a mess. And I am fibbing a bit because I do use a filler for my Gallerey loads. Tom.
