Keith,
I think I understand your point, but don't really agree that it should be addressed at the national level. The people you are refering to must first get hooked into the game at the local level. I don't think there are many clubs who get to stringent on the binocular issue. IBO sanctioned shoots is a different thing altogether. I have never had a problem telling someone that when they step up to state, national, or world level events, that the restrictions get tighter. Most that I have helped encourage along actually expect that. Those same people will sometimes need to modify other parts of their equipment as well to conform to a standardised set of rules, but then standardised competition rules is part of why this whole thing began anyhow.

My suggestion to you and anyone else interested is to start by inviting them to shoot with you locally. Have fun as friends first and let them know along the way how you enjoy the higher levels of competition. Help them sort out the rules as they appy to them. Encourage them to challenge themselves further than they have and to come teach us all a thing or two about shooting. At that point, if you've done all of that well, the binoculars will really be a small issue.

bluejacket, exactly my point. we have hooked people on 3d. they love shooting and are at every CLUB shoot every time a range is set. we just cannot convince them that they need to buy additional equipment to shoot in the ibo. most understand the classes and what goes along with that, they just dont want to buy binoculars...you see it as addressing things on a national level, and i see it as 1200 participants at an ibo event, millions of bowhunters....the 1200 participants are always going to be there, what we need to do is access the millions.......

Hi guy's
When i first started 3D i just wanted to see what it was about.At first seeing people with all the hip quiver ,new bows ,bino's ,collard shirts with sponsers all up and down ,made me feel like i was out of place as a deer hunter.But with me being a competitive type i was dragged in real quick.At our course where i shoot we also have a pro shop on the grounds.I was a bit intimedated at first but in time all those shooters gave me advise on both hunting and my 3D set up.Now i'm a top shooter at my home course and the serounding area.I see the same look in new peoples eye.Like there out of place.And the money for some just isn't there.We incourage all shooters to keep coming back and most do .I see some jump right into the sport of 3D and do it for the deer hunting season coming up and the competitive aspect of it.The new people just need some tender loveing care,Not dragged in by the hair.

They could put bino power for each individaul class lower power for HC higher for Open classes .I personaly would like other equipment but can't afford it .You won't see me spend high dollar on bino's.I spend to much just traveling to all the nationals and world.which kills my bank roll.But its a great time and is worth it.


As for using bino's for rangeing ,that doesn't bother me .Its not like someone isn't counting your steps to the target if they are up next to shoot that target when you go to pull .I don't try to use bino's in this fashion i consintrate more on other things and don't believe ranging with bino's are that accurate .If was to focus on a 20 yard then 40 it mite work.And i don't like people that count steps. so i Zig and Zag if they are watching me.Studer step.


I'll keep shooting no matter what rule changes are made[8D]

Hey Keith!! How Have you been? I must say I agree with all of the shooters that replied. Its all about what you prefer,what you hunt,and how you play 3-D. Here in PA. we have antler restictions. I invested in a pair of top qaulity binos for deer hunting, and they are sweet for 3-D also. We still have people saying ''binos dont belong on 3-D ranges,I dont carry them hunting!!'' well I've got a news flash,ANTLER POINTS ARE TOUGH TO COUNT !!! Fancy, or cheap, your scores and deer hunting will benefit from a pair of field glasses. As for magnification we prefer a 7 or 8 power. I believe large power binos are tougher to hold steady. I personally use a 7 X 30 for deer hunting....works very well.

From your PA roomies at Snowshoe Mountain! WWWAAAAHHHOOO!

I totally agree with Keith's thinking. The only IBO shoots I have shot are the Southern Triple Crown events (Have loved shooting them by the way). Those are smack dab in the middle of ASA country. There are a lot of ASA shooters I know who will not shoot becuase they do not want to buy another pair of binoculars.

I went out and bought a pair of sub $40 Walmart jobers. They are ok at best BUT the shooter who is on staff with a bino company etc definitely has the advantage. If you don't beleve it put the gobbling turkey at 36 plus yards and try to find the 10 ring with a pair of cheap binos.

I guess one compromise might be to drop the bino restriciton in the hunting classes or whatever IBO calls the novice class.

I understand the concept of "run what you brung", but unfortunately think it must be limited and controlled. Example: if a traditional shooter brought his bow straight from hunting in the woods to compete your argument says he should be allowed to compete. But what if he had hash marks up the bow which he could use in the woods to aid him at different ranges? Should he be allowed the implimentation of a system not approved of in the rules of competition? I don't really see it as any different as the bino's. I simply can not see how you can allow the possibility of 1 range finding devise and not others. The ability to see the target better is not problematic for anyone, but the ability to rangefind is. I don't see how you get past that.

the scores are higher than ever in the ibo. perfict practice makes perfict. good luck gents!

run what you brung is in reference to the binoculars, not a traditional shooter with notches on the bow......there is no way to eleminate cheating, you just cannot do it. the ibo says someone is cheating with the bino and decides to restrict them. fine, but why not get rid of the cheaters? they cannot be good for our sport. as for the guy with the coonskin hat and hash marks in his shorts, or rather on his bow, let him shoot. in the fingers aided class.

i am not trying to stir up a hornets nest here, and obviously you cannot see my point bluejacket. that is fine, opinions vary, but i will say and always will that the binoculars are not the reason scores are what they are in the ibo. binoculars may be a reason some people do not participate in the ibo. not wanting to change the world here, just trying to make my little part of it a little better for everyone.

as for the dead horse, there will be a brief ceremony for the dead horse at the 1st leg of the southern triple crown. how about saturday afternoon about 5pm at the practice range. drinks will not be provided, but make your own choice.....

hey pa buck hunter, shouldnt that read Paul, buck hunter? even us boys from ky can spell our names.......lol looking forward to seeing you in indiana. i dont want to hear all that stuff about money, just buckle down a little and save. a young unmarried guy like you should have millions bankrolled by now[8D] if we dont catch you at bedford, you know the deal at erie, just bring your beer goggles.....

Keith,
I know you are not just simply stirring the pot, and I do respect your opinion. Respectfull debate is always welcome and often the source for solutions to complex dilemas. I actually think that I do understand your point, and can for the most part, agree with you. I simply can not see a bridge between the 2 concerns at this point and just ignoring one or the other isn't right either. I hope to get the chance to meet you one of these days and talk in person. I know that you are looking to improve the sport and that is the kind of input we need.