" PA didnt sound much different from what was going on in southeastern Illinois in terms of the numbers of deer seen and the size and number of bucks seen or killed.

LMAO!:lola bove:

Sure it is. See the polls. See the polls done by legislators...Youre not telling the truth.

Lmao. Yeah, the environmentalist/pgc board! What would you have them say? lol...Gee fellas, our program stinks! lol Heck even their poll in the hr/ar forum, on page 2 now, asking about too much hr the majority voted they "were not happy with it"....73%. Imagine how much higher it wouldve been without opinion cleansing? Seems many are afraid to speak up for fear of banning. But that didnt stop them from voting anonymously.

BTW, here is what the owner of hpa had to say the other day:

""Welcome to one of the biggest concerns i have as an Admin of this website. 2009 will go down in my book as a year way more complained about hunting then celebrated it here. This site is all about the pulse of hunters though, and maybe that is the real pulse out there?? it is just not the pulse I personally want feeding the heart of HPA. "



Yeah, theyve banned hundreds if not thousands in the last several years Ive been a member. All in the name of damage control. Hardly a "good" thing. And all just to put on a show for some of the legislators that occassionaly stop by.

Yeah Illinois has better densities in areas, and BIG bucks galore. Pa? It offers you the chance to hunt in sub-par conditions. lol...and see plenty of trillium while doing so.

Yes, LOL indeed!

Course not. But last I checked no state in the nation was even comparable in that regard. Not even wisconsin. We have more dissatisfied hunters, and last I checked the agency is being sued, prevented a fee increase, audited and the lil' bald guy was afraid to go in public without a bullet proof vest and body guards...and all polls internet or done by legislators show low satisfaction with this failed plan.

Yeah, thats all just par for the course nationwide....just the normal same old stuff! lmao.


Glad i could clear these misconceptions up for you. .

QUOTE] Sure it is. See the polls. See the polls done by legislators...Youre not telling the truth.


Quote:
The all PA site has a lot different tone."
Lmao. Yeah, the environmentalist/pgc board! What would you have them say? lol...Gee fellas, our program stinks! lol Heck even their poll in the hr/ar forum, on page 2 now, asking about too much hr the majority voted they "were not happy with it"....73%. Imagine how much higher it wouldve been without opinion cleansing? Seems many are afraid to speak up for fear of banning. But that didnt stop them from voting anonymously. [/QUOTE]

Convenient how you failed to mention several pages of protest that the poll contained only all or nothing type of choices and that several peole siad there was no choice that fit their opinion.

You also left out the fact that another poll, worded much more fairly and even endorsed as more fair by the first polls very creator shows substantially different results from what you claim.

T'aint me not telling the WHOLE truth here




Kinda busted yourself here. On one hand you call it the environmentalist/PGC board bent on damage control but on the other hand you point to polls on that very site and a quote by the owner that by their very existence, say different.

It's not dissent with the DMP that gets you banned there, it's things like screaming liar simply because someone has a different opinion than you that gets you banned. Theres plenty of debate but the mods keep it civil and don't allow blatantly inflammatory posts designed to incite flame wars. they don't allow repititious blanket charges without backup.

They also dont let banned and dumped members to come back again and again under new names, at least not once it's discovered and exposed.


Didnt say they were equal or even very close. One is great and one is pretty darn good. That means both have a lot to offer to a deer hunter


got anything other than your opinion to back that up.

(hint: saying "it's obvious" or "already proven" won't cut it)


Saw the little bald guy more than a couple of times before he left and BTW, he's been gone for YEARS and never saw him with bodyguards or a vest. I guess folks are different down your way

Now to get back on topic, this afternoon the deer were out everywhere!!! Had a doctors appointment this afternoon an hour from home so getting out with the bow was not an option today but I took the long way home and saw deer out in good numbers on many of the south facing slopes I drove by.

The next couple of days are lookin pretty darn good too!!!

i miss days here in WMU2G of pa that you could take ride and see deer.bob its so bad you cant see 1 deer on ride of over 30 miles in best area.i went out to remove my treestand today with toby.we flushed 2 grouse.i saw 1 set of deer tracks around my stand.on road driving down to highway, its about 4 miles long,i saw 3 sets of deer tracks. only 1 set at 3 of our feeders which we filled on sunday.
i placed a nice big note for s.o.b that steals my salt licks each year. this time i smashed the salt lick on ground in pieces around feeders.i spend 100 dollars on salt licks around our public feeders and you a holes that steal corn/licks.......

it was real nice out there,i think i am going to take more walks to get in shape this year.my deer cart almost killed me in snow,i learned something there,the plastic sleds are much better in snow than cart.that homemade cart is great without snow...........

You conveniently dont tell the truth. I told you it was the poll on page 2. Not the newer poll which you cite. It was the poll stating are you happy with the level of hr....AS I ORIGINALLY SAID. Convenient memory i guess. lmao.

First, you arent telling the truth again. The original pollster of the poll you are speaking of DIDNT say rsbs was fairer, he said he liked it BECAUSE IT WOULD REINFORCE exactly what was shown in his poll!! lol.

Also, Rsb's poll (the one you say i didnt mention) was just started a few hours ago by rsb and didnt even exist when i made the previous post! Guess you failed to realize that before telling your stories. lol
:happy 0157:

Not that it matters because it doesnt support the plan as is either. People voted for change no matter how you try to camoflauge it in rsbs answers!And the results arent any different. People want changes made. End of story. Funny how you have excuses for everything which doesnt support you, which is alot these days. According to you, the Polls are all fixed because none support your position. Others are misinterpreted because of the wording.... lmao. I think they speak for themselves. Heck even the guys over there dont try and argue against US being the majority. they now say the majority shouldnt be heard, because we hunters arent smart enough to make these decisions. Guess you are alone, or very close to it now in your "nonsupporters are a minority" argument. lol

Still didnt get your take on the legit legislator survey showing VERY LITTLE support for a fee increase for pgc! lmao.


"

It is what it is and its well known. Only reason any dissent has been allowed recently is because to prevent it, theyd have to get rid of 3/4th of the membership at one time, instead of a few per week like previously. Give it time. I hear they have been working on whittling them down some. Know of a few including one fairly long time member that bit the dust over nothing. lmao. Even some of the avid pgc supporters long term members that supported pgc for years have been turning. Guess thats bad news for ol' rooster, and he dont know how to cope.

"

Sure it does. Ever since new management took over. He even basically addressed it in his quote too. Anyone who knows anything of the site knows all about it. Can even see where several members have mentioned it on the site over there recently, though I dont suspect they'll be around much longer. Have been giving good arguments against the failed plan. That doesnt bode well towards board membership.

You mean such as yours on this site on a continuous basis? Funny how things are quieter and not even close to as argumentative when you arent around. Never fails.

As for hpa,I know many who've been booted on hpa who have never been booted from any of over 5-10 other boards. And they all had only one thing in common. Guess hpa is just special that way? lmao.

I wasnt talking about "down my way". I can provide links if you like, stating he wore them at his speaking engagements AND had bodyguards, Ive posted them before. Dont think he needs them out in Cali now that hes gotten about as far away from Pa in the nation that he could.

You also speak of "flaming wars" and thats exactly what you want, but you need to look elsewhere because you'll not find one with me. That might be your thing, but you'll not drag me into another. Not gonna happen.

Oh yeah....Now back on topic. Saw a deer today.

Hey Sproul, I do hear you. I dont get up your way often but I have seen how bad deer numbesr and some of the habitat is up there. Where I think we differ is exactly how much of it is habitat and predators and how much is tag allocations.

It's that way in parts of 2F too. We just moved. Nobody is fond of vacating a favorite old hunting spot full of good memories but sometimes thats what we gotta do. When I look back, I realize that we've had to move all around 2F for all the 40 years I've hunted. Hate trying a new spot on the opener and finding an orange horde all around, but we've been rewarded just as often by moving around.

You really have to take a look at waht DougE and a few others are saying. The PGC and DCNR aint gonna fix things for us. We simply have to get out of our comfort zone and find the spots where the deer ARE now. I know you know how and I know you aren't afraid of putting out the effort and I know you're willing to go wayback if thats what it takes. I'm under the impression your near Renovo. From waht I've seen you'll be putting some miles on the truck but thats what we've had to do too.

Same old same old.

I made a post to Lanse, you responded with the flames, I answered you. Once. Not gonna play your game all day. Have fun if you want to play by yourself.

You're right about that, but they sure did a great job of ruining things for many hunters while accomplishing nothing. Breeding rates and recruitment haven't improved and the breeding period remained the same. Worst of all there has been little if any improvement in regeneration even on DMapped SFL.

Are you suggesting hunters should find an area with a few deer, shoot it out and move to a new area with a few more deer and shoot that area out. That sounds like a great plan for ruining the hunting in more areas.

So much for new and improved scientific deer management.