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NYSDEC is a joke

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NYSDEC is a joke

Old 12-02-2005, 07:38 PM
  #1  
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Default NYSDEC is a joke

Just keeps getting worse and worse around here. Deer numbers are so low that even the clowns at the DEC had to come clean and admit it because they heard the rumbles of an all out revolt by hunters statewide. Of course they blamed it on "harsh winters".......you must be freakin' kidding me. Harsh winters??......anyone who has lived in this state knows very well that the last couple years have been no better or worse then our run of the mill NY winters. I can't friggin stand when I see them force feeding this BS to NY hunters with a straight face and expecting us all to just nod our heads in agreement like idiots who don't know any better and will believe anything.

What a coincidence that these "harsh winters" just happen to fall right after record slaughters of deer in NY due to the DEC giving out permits by the truckload........they were either too stupid to realize they were giving out too many permits and really had no idea of the actual herd count or they were too busy counting the money from extra license sales to care. Now that deer numbers are so low that you have entire camps not even seeing deer they want everyone to ride out the storm for a few years until the numbers get back to a respectable level.

I have hunted for over 6 weeks now........perhaps more then I ever have in a single season before. At least 5 days a week with an average of probably 5-6 hours a day. I would say I have been in the woods for over 150 hours easily with bow and gun combined and there is still 19 days left to hunt including ML season. I have seen 1 racked buck in all that time.......that's right......ONE.....and he was a 4 pointer. I saw pitifully low numbers of deer......mostly does and 6 month olds. The rut was an all out joke. It hit right in shotgun season (which made the DEC happy I am sure) My brothers, friends, father, other hunting club members, and 99.9% of the guys I have talked with this year have had similar experiences.

This is not a public land sob story either. I hunted private land more this year then I ever have. It is just an all out joke..........and it's not funny at all.

I just can't believe they have screwed this place up so bad. The Saturday opener backfired right in their face even though they would never admit it. A lot of guys that used to take vacation for opening week didn't this year because of the opener on a weekend and thanksgiving on thursday. They hunted Sat and Sun morning and then went home and didn't come back until thursday (if at all). I have NEVER seen so few shotgun hunters in the woods after opening day..........I really think guys are just saying F' it after not seeing anything or hearing any shots on opening day and going home.......or not even going out at all.

I hunted 90 acres of private property in Stueben county for opening weekend and all the surrounding property is is stocked with the orange army.........heard about 6 shots all opening day and 2 were from my dad and brother.......sunday we heard and saw NOTHING. What a rediculous and embarrassing example of what the DEC has managed to do even to private hunting land in it's big buck capital. Truely a sad situation.


I cannot believe how hard I had to hunt this year to put meat in the freezer......I feel so sorry for the average Joe in NY that can only get out on the weekends or a few days here and there.......seriously, they should save their money and not even bother.......may as well spend the $68 on the powerball because the odds aren't much worse.


Can't wait to go out all weekend and see nothing again...........just got back a few hours ago after walking for 4 hours through yesterday's snow and not finding one single friggin track. Thanks a lot NYSDEC........thanks for being so stupid and ruining the deer herd in NY. At least PA got a smokescreen fake story behind the destruction of their herd........our DEC wasn't even smart enough to come up with anything better then "harsh winter"


Morons.
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Old 12-02-2005, 08:28 PM
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Default RE: NYSDEC is a joke

Sorry to hear about your tough season so far. I too hunt in Steuben over by Bath - Savona. All people in my camp hated the Saturday opener. Alot fewer shot than normal too (and we border 6,000 acres of state land). I guess we were lucky as most everyone saw deer on opening day and many got shots - myself included but I hammered a maple tree instead of the doe. Only 2 doe tags for 7 hunters too. Only 2 guys saw antlers all weekend - small spike and a young 4 - left em to grow. We did find a beautiful 10 pt. skull (squirrels chewed the bejezzus out of it and 2 other buck skulls a nice 8 and "stumpy" a deer head with nice thick horns busted off about 2 inches from the skull as a result of a fight with a Pontiac we think. All in all a blah season so - we usually have alot more hanging in the wood shed by now.....
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Old 12-02-2005, 08:53 PM
  #3  
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Default RE: NYSDEC is a joke

I can't speak for all of NY, but I doalso agree that the deer pops in my areas of 6k & 7m are down. I knew heading into the season it was going to be a rough yr. Based on the low & no permits for these two areas, and my scouting efforts before the 9/27 archery opener. I took 20 days off from work, and hunted everyone of them plus my wknds off. I put in more hrs this year during archery then have in past. Not that its a bad thing, but I have zero deer in my freezer, 0! The Sat. opener in my 7m area, private surrounded by public, actually had more hunters then I expected with no permits for 7m. But no where's near the shooting. Sun. the woods was dead, and I've only seen 1 hunter around that area since, while out. Oh I saw 1 doe opening day. I began hunting this area in 7m in 1998, and we've noticed a significant decrease in the deer pop since then. The surrounding camps all are reporting the same to us in our conversations.
I too don't buy the harsh winter stuff. Our winters in NY are nothing like they used to be. When was the last time we got hit with a 4ft plus snowstorm, and stranded for couple days? Where's the 20plus below temps for wks on end I recall growing up.
The DEC issued too many yrs of double permits in 7M, and lowered the population significantly. 6k is still being issued permits this yr, by preference pt. But I know several that have them. Many were denied upon purchasing license's, only to recieve them in the mail at a later date. Last season the township in 6k I hunt had more bucks taken per square mile, than the township I hunt in 7m. This per DEC reports on their websight. So that explains their reasons for permits in 6k. But trust me the deer aren't here this year, and the permits in 6k should cease.
I also believe the DECALS system had alot to do with the population decrease. The first yr. I heard horror stories of machines kicking out numerous unaccountable numbers of permits to single persons. I know a guy who got 13 that year. I saw them! How could the DEC keep track of the population under those circumstances, when its own permit quotas were way off.
All in all I guess we just have to deal with it, and hope it gets turned back around. I'd like to see the DEC back off on permit numbers again across the state, and especially in 7m & 6k.
I do realize the 20-30 deer I used to see on the shotgun opener days, are in the past, and probably never be again. But I do think a happy medium above what it is now could be reached, and maintained. For now I guess some of us will have to get used to the fact of going deerless, and not seeing much in our efforts. I don't like it anymore then the next guy. But unfortunately were stuck with it for now. Trust me I'll be speaking out this offseason. For some reason the DEC is failing to realize what sells deer license's is big bucks, and lots of deer. NY has some nice bucks, but in all honesty we don't have alot of the 160's & up bucks you read about. Now we don't have the deer population in some areas either. I can walk around with a camera, and enjoy the woods for free. Why pay for it!!
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Old 12-03-2005, 06:53 AM
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Join Date: Oct 2005
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Default RE: NYSDEC is a joke

I hunt Northern and southern ulster county. The DEC has to stop giving slaughter permits to these apple farmers and letting all their buddies shoot the deer all summer long. They don't even pick the apples anymore.. I just dont get it. I can take anyone right now to a corner of one orchard and show you 15 dead deer.. it is sick.
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Old 12-03-2005, 07:22 AM
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Default RE: NYSDEC is a joke

I live in Herkimer County and we had2 bad winters, 2002 and 2003. In 2002 I found 37 dead deer and in 2003 I found 17. On top of the 2 bad winters, hunters are shooting more doesso there will be less deer. Every time an adultdoe is killed so are 2 unbornfawns. I have nothing against killing a doe but ifthere areno deer inan area don't shoot the adult does. Who is pulling the trigger? Not the DEC! Just because someone has four tags they don't have to kill four deer. It's impossible for the DEC to know how many deer are in each area. It should be up the the hunter's discretion how many deer they kill. If you have no deer inan area why wouldanyone then go out and hunt to kill the last one? On a brighter note maybe you are seeing less deer due to the warm weather. This fall has been unseasonably warm. Around here when it is warm it's like a ghost town and I swear there are no deer alive on this earththan when the temp drops below 30 it seems the deer appear out of nowhere. I hope thats theproblem. my site: www.pbase.com/mlo3135127 & www.wildturkey.smugmug.com
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Old 12-03-2005, 07:22 AM
  #6  
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Default RE: NYSDEC is a joke

atlasman, i would love to see the report. You know since i been there I never saw a buck in Northern NY, of course up there if it has antlers, even spikes it is fair game. And you are right, you can get one with muzzle loader, one with bow, one with gun, and if you are lucky or have land, you can get two permits for does! And that does not include using last years tag to shoot anything! Yes, I think about time the get new game managers at state. Really would like to see the report though where they mention it! [:@]
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Old 12-03-2005, 08:17 AM
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Default RE: NYSDEC is a joke

hi i hunt 3h, last year was pathetic, this year after passing a spike 6 times i took him he was the only buck i saw , the area i hunt to most would be the perfict set up , acorns so thick on the ground , that you could slip and fall on them if not careful , plenty of cover, playing the wind, i think the , lack of deer is compounded by coyotes , bad management, winter stress and to some extent unlawfull hunters who cannot stop hunting who just keep killing , killing is my term for sombody who cant stop hunting when hes done and tagged out. around 3h there were no management permits this year, so they apply for a different zone with a lot of permits and hunt 3h with them , whos to moniter where they were harvisted? and also permits can be transfered to such an outlaw , who can kill as many deer in our zone that he can put his sights on . i think the nydec needs to change there prioritys and crack down on these individules. just my oppinion
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Old 12-03-2005, 09:19 AM
  #8  
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Default RE: NYSDEC is a joke

I hunt 7F and I will say this is the worst yr since I started hunting in 1994. I also remember going out and any givin day seeing 20-30 deer. I saw 3 does and a 4 pt all bow season on the 58 acres I hunt.I don`t know what is to blame. I do agree that the DEC is giving out way to many doe permits, but we don`t need to shoot the does. In the11 yrs I`ve been hunting I`ve only shot one doe.The 6 guys I hunt with all believe that for every doe we shoot we could be killing one or two bucks. I also call in all my doe tags evanthough I didn`t shoot any. I just hope it gets better around here. I got 2 sons who want to hunt but do`t know if they will stick wih it if they don`t see anything.


Mike
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Old 12-03-2005, 09:42 AM
  #9  
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Default RE: NYSDEC is a joke

I hunted 90 acres of private property in Stueben county for opening weekend and all the surrounding property is is stocked with the orange army.........heard about 6 shots all opening day and 2 were from my dad and brother.......sunday we heard and saw NOTHING. What a rediculous and embarrassing example of what the DEC has managed to do even to private hunting land in it's big buck capital. Truely a sad situation.
Where in Steuben County were you hunting? I hunt in WMU's 8P and 8R. You may not believe this, but....I left the woods at 9:00 on opening day after counting shot #400 (granted alot were pretty distant). Yep, I didn't see any deer so I just sat there counting gunshots instead.

I don't know what to make of the past 3 years. In 2002 we had one of the best seasons that we've ever had in this area. In 2003 things were slower and the past two have plain sucked. What I don't understand is that I saw more nice bucks around the house this summer and fall than I have in the past several years combined. There were no shortage of does/fawns either. Once the end of October rolled around the deer just seemed to disappear. I saw plenty of nice bucks while out spotlighting too.

I agree that the whole "harsh winter" thing is a joke. If anything has lower the deer pop. its been issuing an overabundance of doe permits.I believe that the lack of access to hunting land is one of the major problems facing the state's deer management.The amount of land that has changed hands in this area over the past several years is unbelievable. In my hunting area I strongly believe that our lack of deer sighting thus far (despite numerous drives) has been that 400 acres or so of the best bedding cover in the whole area has been posted and put off limits completely. We've killed 7 bucks off of this one drive before and have pushed out over a dozen bucks in a single drive here. Without anyone getting these deer up and moving around...why would they leave the security of this cover during daylight? On Christmas day last year I went for a drive around and counted 72 deer in the two fields bordering this 400 acre block of cover. In fact, one of my neighbors said that all of the big bucks he was watching before season showed back uponce season ended.

Can't wait to go out all weekend and see nothing again...........just got back a few hours ago after walking for 4 hours through yesterday's snow and not finding one single friggin track.
That hasn't been the case at all here. We haven't been seeing the deer....but there's be a ton of tracks in the snow. Hmmm...maybe all the hunting pressure has created a breed of super smart deer??

In summary....I do believe that the deer pop. is definately down from where it was several years ago...but I don't believe that its currently at "desperation levels" in this area.

Good luck for the rest of the season.
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Old 12-03-2005, 10:08 AM
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Default RE: NYSDEC is a joke

ORIGINAL: salty

I hunt Northern and southern ulster county. The DEC has to stop giving slaughter permits to these apple farmers and letting all their buddies shoot the deer all summer long. They don't even pick the apples anymore.. I just dont get it. I can take anyone right now to a corner of one orchard and show you 15 dead deer.. it is sick.

I have seen that horrible sight once in my life as well.........a farmer with nuisance permits had a ditch full of dead deer just rotting away.

[:@]
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