Advice from the "Pros"
01-25-2011, 01:17 PM
#21
Fork Horn
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location:
Posts: 313
All this is testament to what a small pond muzzleloading has remained.
Very few "mainstream" magazines publish regular MLer articles mostly because on a year to year basis there's not that many or any new guns out. Here on the internet a new bullet or sabot is fat to chew for a few weeks, in a glossy magazine, it's 500 words.
Having worked in the gun biz, and having products I was responsible for reviewed in print, I can say most writers only write about products they feel have merit. If a product doesn't perform, or is somehow defective, they just don't write about it. The industry, through it's advertising dollars, supports the published writers.
The confusion and consternation in regard to muzzleloading "writers" is largely because they exist on the far fringes of the "established" outdoor press. The publish articles and advertorials on the web "reviewing" products that they have a direct financial interest in, i.e. they are paid or receive a stream of free product to "review".
I could go on about the "B" team and backbench "writers" but, I best stop, before I can't stop
Very few "mainstream" magazines publish regular MLer articles mostly because on a year to year basis there's not that many or any new guns out. Here on the internet a new bullet or sabot is fat to chew for a few weeks, in a glossy magazine, it's 500 words.
Having worked in the gun biz, and having products I was responsible for reviewed in print, I can say most writers only write about products they feel have merit. If a product doesn't perform, or is somehow defective, they just don't write about it. The industry, through it's advertising dollars, supports the published writers.
The confusion and consternation in regard to muzzleloading "writers" is largely because they exist on the far fringes of the "established" outdoor press. The publish articles and advertorials on the web "reviewing" products that they have a direct financial interest in, i.e. they are paid or receive a stream of free product to "review".
I could go on about the "B" team and backbench "writers" but, I best stop, before I can't stop
01-25-2011, 01:41 PM
#22
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Yucca Valley,Ca
Posts: 2,496
The web is full of information on any product one can think of. example cabelas,gander mtn,real people with no financial interest a given product will give opinions on whatever thay buy from those sites,including rifles, bullets,powders ETC.then theres the old google search also lol. just type in what you want to know about anything.this is the best M/L site on the web, that i have been able to find. i am sure you will work the bugs out on your M/L rifle.. like i said if not return it to T/C. or maybe ask a forum member to have a look at it.. Ray
01-25-2011, 01:47 PM
#23
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Northern Chautauqua Co. N.Y.
Posts: 2,976
What really Defines a Expert? Now Im not bashing the Experts but to me there just out to sell or promote a Product and have a bunch of Manufactures who back them so they can Hunt all the Best Places that the Common guy will never be able to afford.
So we see these (Experts) Take the Biggest Bucks, Mulies, Elk, Bear, ect and believe that if we Buy their Products we'll be able to do the same as they do. But in the end the only one going to take more Big and Better Game are these supposed Experts, not us. We the Consumer of their good support their way of life and make it so much better for them so they can continue to Enjoy the Best Hunting out there that most of Us will never be able to afford.
Even if you have the Money to Book one of them Trophy Hunts do you think YOU, Jo Common Hunter are going to get a Booking during the Peak Rut, HaHa, nope the Experts will though. Them Experts are just sitting back Buying More Property to Hunt, that WE pay for so they can go on TV with there Fancy Show and Sell there Products and make Us envious as we look at the Animals they take. And deep down We the Consumer hopes that if we buy there Products we too can take the Animals they do, it does'nt happen. Sure we get Lucky once in awhileand take a Nice Animal but not as Many as they do because they go to all the Best Places in America to do it, or they already own them.
NO, Im not Jealous, but to me there Not Experts because they have more Money than I do or Hunt the Best Places. If WE could go to one of their Farms to Hunt we'd take them Big Animals too....to me them Experts are only worried about one thing, Our Money, simple as that.
To Me Most of us on here are Experts, so we dont need there Advice, I sure as heck dont. I get more and better advice on here and in my own experiences than any Expert could ever give me. Sorry Experts but most of you make me sick! How many of them Experts on T.V. are here on our Forum??? You got it, None.
There Not Experts, they just have More Money and the Best Places to Hunt so does that make them a Expert....
If I want Advice I'll ask the Common Guy who cares about the Common Guy, I'll ask My Questions on Here and get some of the Best Advice I'd ever find anywhere!
(BP)
So we see these (Experts) Take the Biggest Bucks, Mulies, Elk, Bear, ect and believe that if we Buy their Products we'll be able to do the same as they do. But in the end the only one going to take more Big and Better Game are these supposed Experts, not us. We the Consumer of their good support their way of life and make it so much better for them so they can continue to Enjoy the Best Hunting out there that most of Us will never be able to afford.
Even if you have the Money to Book one of them Trophy Hunts do you think YOU, Jo Common Hunter are going to get a Booking during the Peak Rut, HaHa, nope the Experts will though. Them Experts are just sitting back Buying More Property to Hunt, that WE pay for so they can go on TV with there Fancy Show and Sell there Products and make Us envious as we look at the Animals they take. And deep down We the Consumer hopes that if we buy there Products we too can take the Animals they do, it does'nt happen. Sure we get Lucky once in awhileand take a Nice Animal but not as Many as they do because they go to all the Best Places in America to do it, or they already own them.
NO, Im not Jealous, but to me there Not Experts because they have more Money than I do or Hunt the Best Places. If WE could go to one of their Farms to Hunt we'd take them Big Animals too....to me them Experts are only worried about one thing, Our Money, simple as that.
To Me Most of us on here are Experts, so we dont need there Advice, I sure as heck dont. I get more and better advice on here and in my own experiences than any Expert could ever give me. Sorry Experts but most of you make me sick! How many of them Experts on T.V. are here on our Forum??? You got it, None.
There Not Experts, they just have More Money and the Best Places to Hunt so does that make them a Expert....
If I want Advice I'll ask the Common Guy who cares about the Common Guy, I'll ask My Questions on Here and get some of the Best Advice I'd ever find anywhere!
(BP)
03-02-2011, 01:18 PM
#24
Fork Horn
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Texas
Posts: 143
Well said breechplug. They are not professional hunters. They get paid to go on guided hunts hunts. IMO professional hunters are people who guide for a living. I know, I used to be a guide in my younger years. The very best are in Africa, especially Zimbabwe.
I have shrunk my list of shows I watch by a bunch. That being said, if I could get a gig like theirs, I would do it. Not jealous, just trying to keep it real.
Paul
I have shrunk my list of shows I watch by a bunch. That being said, if I could get a gig like theirs, I would do it. Not jealous, just trying to keep it real.
Paul
03-02-2011, 04:56 PM
#25
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Yucca Valley,Ca
Posts: 2,496
Well said breechplug. They are not professional hunters. They get paid to go on guided hunts hunts. IMO professional hunters are people who guide for a living. I know, I used to be a guide in my younger years. The very best are in Africa, especially Zimbabwe.
I have shrunk my list of shows I watch by a bunch. That being said, if I could get a gig like theirs, I would do it. Not jealous, just trying to keep it real.
Paul
I have shrunk my list of shows I watch by a bunch. That being said, if I could get a gig like theirs, I would do it. Not jealous, just trying to keep it real.
Paul
03-02-2011, 05:42 PM
#26
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Colorado
Posts: 9,557
In 60 years of hunting i've never hunted for a trophy. I'm not impressed by trophy hunters. I'll watch them on TV for entertainment, but i've never wanted to be like them.
I hunt for meat. If my freezer stays full. I consider myself successful.
I hunt for meat. If my freezer stays full. I consider myself successful.
03-02-2011, 07:38 PM
#27
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Yucca Valley,Ca
Posts: 2,496
I don't either, but i value there input on products they use every day and test on a regular basis.. Ray
03-02-2011, 08:32 PM
#28
Banned
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Boncarbo,Colorado
Posts: 9,186
ive always shot small bucks mainly because i missed the big ones or they got away due to crap bullets but this year i put in for an out of state tag to bag a monster LOL. Meats meat but i'd like a set of antlers to hang on the wall next to my flintlock 4x4 i took some years ago.
03-03-2011, 06:01 AM
#29
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: MN
Posts: 1,068
I'm sure my opinion is not the popular one, but I say more power to them. If somebody offered me money to go hunting everyday I would gladly be a paid hunter. Does that mean I take everything they say as gold? Nope. I don't buy a lot of it. But most of the "professionals" that are out there didn't get where they are because they have no clue what they're doing. Do they have more money than me? Yup. But then when I look around most people have more money than me. That doesn't mean I should be mad at everyone better off than me. Instead I'll hunt vicariously through their shows and take it for the entertainment that it is.
03-03-2011, 06:35 AM
#30
Dominant Buck
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 21,193
I have to agree with SuperKirby. If some TV show offered me a premo guided hunt where I stood a chance to bag a real monster wall hanger, I would go in a heart beat. If they did this with the understanding that I had to use brand X rifle, and brand X bullets, and brand X scope.. I would still do it. Free is free and I love free stuff.
I suspect a lot of these TV hunters do exactly that. You ever watch these hunting shows? 30 minutes of show has 15 minutes of them selling products. It is just the way it is, and if you want the free hunts and free gear, you have to play the game. But remember, this is to a lot of them their income. Where as I have a separate income. But if putting food on my table and my kids in college hinged on whether or not I hock their product.. it would be a hard choice.
Where I draw the line is if the product was junk, and they demanded I say great things about it. While I might try and be as nice as I could, I don't think I could sell my soul to them. But again remember, this is not my livelihood. When someone wants me to test a product, I always make sure to remind them, if it is junk, then that's the way I will call it. If the thing works, then I will be more then glad to tell my experiences and why I like it.
I can remember one item I tested and it was garbage. I mean a joke. I ended up giving it to a friend's six year old and told him to play with it. (it was a deer call) Needless to say the manufactures were not happy with me, and never posted my comments about the thing. The guy that did get posted must have had a completely different one then I had, because the one I had posed more of a headache then a help.
There actually is a lot of excellent information one can get from the "experts." Face it, these guys have been shooting and using this stuff for many years. They have gained some knowledge. But it is up to us to decide what is knowledge and what is salesmanship.
The funny thing is, I have learned more stuff from forums like this then any TV show or expert could have ever taught me. Even your mistakes that you post about.. that is a learning tool for me. I take your information and then try it for myself. It is what makes these forums such a great tool. Not only for the experienced shooter, but for the person just getting into the sport.
I suspect a lot of these TV hunters do exactly that. You ever watch these hunting shows? 30 minutes of show has 15 minutes of them selling products. It is just the way it is, and if you want the free hunts and free gear, you have to play the game. But remember, this is to a lot of them their income. Where as I have a separate income. But if putting food on my table and my kids in college hinged on whether or not I hock their product.. it would be a hard choice.
Where I draw the line is if the product was junk, and they demanded I say great things about it. While I might try and be as nice as I could, I don't think I could sell my soul to them. But again remember, this is not my livelihood. When someone wants me to test a product, I always make sure to remind them, if it is junk, then that's the way I will call it. If the thing works, then I will be more then glad to tell my experiences and why I like it.
I can remember one item I tested and it was garbage. I mean a joke. I ended up giving it to a friend's six year old and told him to play with it. (it was a deer call) Needless to say the manufactures were not happy with me, and never posted my comments about the thing. The guy that did get posted must have had a completely different one then I had, because the one I had posed more of a headache then a help.
There actually is a lot of excellent information one can get from the "experts." Face it, these guys have been shooting and using this stuff for many years. They have gained some knowledge. But it is up to us to decide what is knowledge and what is salesmanship.
The funny thing is, I have learned more stuff from forums like this then any TV show or expert could have ever taught me. Even your mistakes that you post about.. that is a learning tool for me. I take your information and then try it for myself. It is what makes these forums such a great tool. Not only for the experienced shooter, but for the person just getting into the sport.