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How much black powder in a 30/30 load?

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How much black powder in a 30/30 load?

Old 02-27-2007, 05:04 PM
  #11  
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Default RE: How much black powder in a 30/30 load?

ORIGINAL: TUK101

Ok, I cast up some 170gr lead bullets and am wondering what would be a good starting load with black powder? I have Goex FF and FFF and some Pyrodex FFF.
Being the first smokeless powder SPORTING CARTRIDGE ever loaded with SMOKELESS POWDER in the U.S., no FACTORY 30/30 ammo was ever loaded with black powder. For use with black, Winchester created the .32 Win. Special, a .30/30 necked up to shoot .321" bullets from a rechambered .32/40 barrel. It used slower rifling than the .30/30, so it supposedly could use BP without crudding up the bore as much!

IF I were going to load BP in a .30/30 w/a cast bullet, (which I woudnb't!!) I would use a case full up to within 0.25" of the case mouth of FFg and a heavy crimp.

With BP, ytou will not get more than five shots from that gun before the bore fouls up so badly that accuracy has gone to hell!
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Old 02-27-2007, 05:06 PM
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Default RE: How much black powder in a 30/30 load?

ORIGINAL: Roskoe

Obviously, the original load for this caliber was 30 grains (by volume) of black powder. I'm not sure if I would load black powder here, unless for some nostalgic reason, over smokeless. Create yourself a cleanup issue. There is abundant loading data for a wide variety of smokeless powders - including somereduced loads made for cast bullets.
No, it wasn't, Roskoe. They NEVER used BP in the .30/30! It was a smokeless powder load from day 1, as was the .30/40 Krag. The .30/30 used 30 grains of someearly smokeless powder, and the .30/40 used 40 grains of Pyro DG.
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Old 02-28-2007, 11:25 PM
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Default RE: How much black powder in a 30/30 load?

Thanks for all of the info eldequelo. You are always a wealth of knowledge and I appreciate all of it that you share with the rest of us.
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Old 03-01-2007, 09:19 AM
  #14  
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Default RE: How much black powder in a 30/30 load?

ORIGINAL: TUK101

Thanks for all of the info eldequelo. You are always a wealth of knowledge and I appreciate all of it that you share with the rest of us.
You're quite welcome! If you want to know where a lot of this esoteric info comes from, read Hatcher's Notebookby MG Julian S. Hatcher, and The Complete Guide to Handloading by Phil Sharpe. This latter one has a lot of info in it on making powder, etc.
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Old 03-11-2007, 08:24 PM
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Default RE: How much black powder in a 30/30 load?

That's correct about the 30-30 never being loaded with blackpowder.The 32 Win Special was designed with both smokeless and blackpowder in mind but the engineers failed to realize that with a 1-16" twist it fouled like crazy with the blackpowder.
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Old 03-12-2007, 05:56 AM
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Default RE: How much black powder in a 30/30 load?

ORIGINAL: Pioneer2

That's correct about the 30-30 never being loaded with blackpowder.The 32 Win Special was designed with both smokeless and blackpowder in mind but the engineers failed to realize that with a 1-16" twist it fouled like crazy with the blackpowder.
The reason for the 1/16" twist in the .32 Special was supposedly so it would not foul as badly as the .30/30's faster twist if BP was used. the 1/16" twist was the same as had been standard for the .32/40, a black powder target rifle cartridge originally developed by Ballard for use in Schutzen single-shot rifles and later adopted by both Winchester and marlin for their levr-action rifles. The first Model 94 barrels chambered for the .32 Win. Spec. were actually barrels that had been made originally to be chambered to .32/40. But after the .30/30 was introduced, hunters lost interest in the .32/40 chambering. However, if loaded with smokeless powder, the .32/40 can actually give about the same performance as the .32 Special or .30/30 - a 170-grain bullet at 2200 FPS.....
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Old 03-12-2007, 09:10 AM
  #17  
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Default RE: How much black powder in a 30/30 load?

The 32-40 rifles were prone to blackpowder fouling and needed to be cleaned after every shot to give target grade accuracy.Fouling was so bad that they developed a duplex load with a few grains of smokeless placed in the case first followed by BP that in effect significantly reduced barrel fouling and eliminated the need to clean between shots.The 30-30 was originally loaded with IMR 171/2 smokeless powder which was replaced with todays IMR 3031.Point being a worn .32 Special 1-16 twist will give patterns instead of groups while a worn 30-30 with it's 1-12 twist will still shoot.Nothing personal against the .32 crowd it's fact.
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Old 10-11-2020, 02:05 PM
  #18  
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Originally Posted by Roskoe View Post
Obviously, the original load for this caliber was 30 grains (by volume) of black powder. I'm not sure if I would load black powder here, unless for some nostalgic reason, over smokeless. Create yourself a cleanup issue. There is abundant loading data for a wide variety of smokeless powders - including somereduced loads made for cast bullets.
The .30 WCF was one of the first modern firearm. Marlin adopted the caliber and as a marketing tool name it the .30-30, which fit the nomenclature of the day where the caliber was followed by the black powder charge propelling it. However being a modern firearm it was the first firearm to use modern smokeless powder not black powder. In which case the second 30 did not signify a black powder charge but rather a 30 grain charge of whatever smokeless powder was than in use. You should be able to read about this by looking up the history of the .30 WCF.

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Old 10-12-2020, 06:27 PM
  #19  
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If you're going to load with black powder you will need to fill the gap between the powder and the base of the bullet. You can make a drop tube easy enough with some 3/8" copper tubing, a couple eyelets and a 1x4" board. Look on YouTube for what they look like.
Also watch videos on loading black powder cartridges.
BTW you do know the 30-30 was the first smokeless cartridge?
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