Interesting that you're not impressed since the two outfitter pages you obviously were impressed with have one buck picture and one cartoon buck between em, from private ground

Pa Public land "Dinks"...........







Yup! public land dinks! LOL

We all know that AR on a statewide basis will never turn a state like PA into an Illinois, Wisconson or Iowa but it certainly has raised the bar and the results are indisputable.

Several of those photos are within 15 miles of my camp where my family has hunted for 5 decades. For 4 of those decades, a six pointer on the meat pole would slow traffic down. The number of good bucks harvested has increased dramatically over the last 8 years and it all started with letting those young bucks walk for a year.

[QUOTE]We all know that AR on a statewide basis will never turn a state like PA into an Illinois, Wisconson or Iowa but it certainly has raised the bar and the results are indisputable.[QUOTE]

The results are not indisputable as you claim. ARs are like HR in that they benefit a small group of stakeholders at the expense of a much larger group. ARs make it easier for a very small percentage of hunters to harvest a buck that is one year older, while preventing many more hunters from taking a buck of their choosing.

Until you can produce PGC data that shows the rack sizes of 2.5+ buck have increased, that breeding rates and productivity have increased and that the breeding window has decreased, then it is indisputable that ARS have failed to produce the predicted results.

How can you raise odds for one group at the expense of another group, when they are all hunting for bucks?
Are we not all out in the same woods? Are you claiming that dink shooters will not shoot a nice buck when they see it? Would you?
Not only has our group killed more buck since AR, but they are in fact BIGGER as well. That is MORE and BIGGER where I come from.

Check the title of this thread:

NYS public hunting land goes AR

It is not "lets have another thread about PA deer management plus/minus's".

That's exactly what it has become once again - you guys from both sides just can't help yourself's. Its one thing to post a comment or 2 with your thoughts on what has worked/not worked in PA. It is quite another to totally hijack YET ANOTHER thread for your interests.

SteveBNY

Sorry Steve. You're right. That wasn't the intent, at least not from here, but that has been the end result. Good luck to all you NY guys and I hope whatever happens works out for the betterment of your hunting.

Thanks BTB - and good luck to all you guys there.

One thing that can be said about Pa hunters - they are passionate about hunting!!

Yep...I forgot the title of the thread.
Good luck you NY'ers!
I like AR...hope you do too.

Nice pics of some nice PA bucks, just one problem, we kill the same kinda bucks here in NY on public land like sterling forest,west point,stewart airport, allegany st pk etc, w/ one minor little difference, that seems to keep getting overlooked...NO ARs!!!! Why cant the armchair biologists understand that deer can get big without state imposed ARs??????

I think its a great idea. AR's dont always mean bigger bucks, but for the most part it should help bucks to a more mature age. I don't see a problem with AR at all.

I was the speaker at Sterling forest that spoke before and after Peter Feduccia about QDMA.. Although I am an no longer active in the Association; I believe strongly in the biologic principles and management strategies that are supported by many professionals and hunters alike. Check out the NYSDEC website and how they have tracked the attitudes of the hunters in 3H and 3K in Sullivan County. Sorry Charlie (Ficella), can't help that the Sullivan residents have a stronger base of support than in Ulster. Also, KUDOS to those who showed support of spreading the AR's to Northern Sullivan County and to the fact that they are spreading throughout the Catskill Region in 2012!!

Gregg Taylor
Founder and Former President of Sullivan Orange QDMA Branch