What makes a cornfield planted for human consumption any different than an alfalfa field planted for deer consumption? Aren't both fields a natural food source in the mind of a deer? And don't the deer react the same way in both cases or does an alfapha field make the deer lose their instinctive nocturnal behavior when it comes to open fields?

I'm being serious. I really don'tunderstand the difference betweenthe two other than the fact that one is anative food source and the other isn't. To me it seems the deer should still react the same way, but they'll get more nutritional value out of the alfapha or whatever it is the landowner choosesto plant.



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OK here is the definitive question that answers the main issue, How many of you hunters go to a place where there is NO chance a deer will show up, no apple trees, no corn fields, no oak trees on watering hole no reason for a deer to be there at all?????
OK you setup you tree-stand or ground blind or walk around an area where the is "BAIT" something that draws deer to that area, food, water or shelter hoping the bait will be enough to bring in the deer. End of sentence.

Big John H:

How is that a "definitive answer?" The question asks what's the difference between baiting and planting a field full of deer food?

Many on here have tried to twist it by comparing to hunting near NATURAL FOOD SOURCES ... or even harvested agricultural fields. This is not what is at question.

The question is what is the difference between planting DEER FOOD & putting outa pile of DEER BAIT.

So far, the only legitimate answers trying to separate the two have been that a food plot (containing un-naturally occurring deer food) are larger, more expensive, they cover a larger area, and take more work to create than a single pile offood. ... Again, noone is arguing thatputting out any bait or food plot is a guarantee to fill a deer tag, turkey tag, or bear tag.

As far as I see it (& again, this is only my opinion) there is no difference. In bothinstances, you are using a deer's need for food to get the deer into a position where you can kill it. Granted, a food plot does not precisely position the animal like a pile of food does, but it does draw animals into the open for no other reason than the availability of food (hence, the reason my friend killed such a nice mature buck out in the open mid-day five days into the regular firearms season. He would have never seen that animal if he was standing next to a barren field of dirt that had no nutritional value to a post-rut animal that needs to put on weight fast before winter.)

I am not arguing that other animals do not get any added benefits from a food plot. I am simply saying that it is simply "selective idignation" to say that someone whom puts out a pile of corn/apples/salt is a despicable "bait hunter" while someone whom plants acres of deer food is a "conservationist." They are both taking advantage of a deer's need for food by MANIPULATING THE ENVIRONMENT THAT THE DEER LIVES IN AND FEEDS IN.

Hunting a stand of naturally occurring oak mast, beech mast, or other feeding area is not manipulating the animal's natural environment. It is simply taking advantage of the conditions in which the animal lives and feeds. Now, if someone were to walk around the woods, collect all the dropped acorns in the area, and put them in a single location, that would be the same as baiting, since they have manipulated the deer's environment and natural food availability. In PA, this would be regarded by game officials as unlawful baiting, yet when someone plants a field full of some non-native agricultural product for no other reason than to feed & kill deer -it is not illegal. Seems to be an incongrous situation if you ask me.

Also, for those of you questioning, how or where I hunt. My brother and Ionly ever hunt state game lands that are open to public hunting. There are no food plots in the areas we hunt, and we have never, ever used any bait to lure animals to our hunting locations. Yet, we have killed plenty of big bucks during the past few years by simply hunting hard and putting in lots of effort during the hunt. Please see my post for proof: http://www.huntingnet.com/forum/tm.aspx?m=1349520

Others feel that by putting in a lot of effort by planting deer food on the front end, they should be able to leisurely sit in a stand near that food and collect animals as they come to eat the "MAN-PROVIDED" food. I see this simply as a loophole that sadly allows a specific type of baiting to belegal.

Again, everyone is entitled to their own opinion, and all of this discussion is mute in states where baititng is allowed.

I was just curious as to what others feel about the situation.

- Gr8ful

Ocording to the DEC baiting is " a prearanged pile of food /or a salt lick used to bait an animal for the purpose of hunting it"

A food plot is a planted not piled food that is being used for that purpose. Now acording to the DEC you could be charged with baiting if for instance there was a pile of corn in the middle of a field after a harvest do to the fact they could NOT prove you didn't put it there. Just got off the phone with the DEC because their on line site says it is illegal but did not define what bait was.
Hows that?

We already went through numerous points...guess it is easier if we start with one fact at a time. Please let us now why you feel each one of these points is not a valid difference between Baiting and constructing a food plot.

Point #1..Nutrition: When it comes to nutrition, very few farm crops can provide the quality of nutrition that food plot forages can. For example corn provides 6-8 percent protein and, at best, is only available for one or two months each year. Imperial Whitetail Clover, Alfa-Rack Plus and Extreme can easily provide 30-plus percent protein for nine months in the north and the whole year in the south. So, Imperial Clover trumps corn at every turn.

Once you have a chance to respond to this point I will post another...

Gr8ful Deer, In your last post it seems that you know all of the answers, so why did you post the question in the first place? One of my answers waswith bait you canmake a deer go to an exact spot rather than anywhere random on a 60 acre planted field. Thats the difference and thats a big difference if you are hunting with a bow.

So if you get a small bag of mossy oak`s seeds ,which you can buy at Walmart, And it only plants a 10 foot X 10 foot "PLOT" would this be baiting? Does size of the food plot matter to make it not baiting?just wondering since alot of posts have 60 acre plots. Is there a difference?

stretchhunts, Yes it does make a difference. For one thing I have herd from other hunters who have planted a 10 X 10 plot they never saw a deer in it. Read the posts, the question said a 60 acre field not a 10 x 10 plot. It is obvious if a deer comes to a 10 x 10 plot you will be pin pointing him to a smaller spot (like baiting) the only thing is if the deer hit a small plot like this, itwould be gone before hunting season starts. With baiting you can keep adding bait as needed. Size of a food plot does matter, a deer has a much better chance of living if it comes out on the far side of a 60 acre food plot rather than the far side of a 10 X 10 plot.

Quote:

ORIGINAL: Gr8ful Deer

Many on here have tried to twist it by comparing to hunting near NATURAL FOOD SOURCES ... or even harvested agricultural fields. This is not what is at question.

The question is what is the difference between planting DEER FOOD & putting outa pile of DEER BAIT.

I don't think I was twisting anything when I asked youwhat the difference between a cornfield planted for human consumption and an alfalfa field planted for deer consumption was. I simply believe there is a question within your question.

But here's my answer to your exact question as I understand it. Which is what do I think the difference is.

To begin,in my opinion BAITING means to trick or take advantage of a deer's natural instincts.

A field full of DEER FOOD is still an open field and the deer will treat it the same way they would treat an agricultural field. They're not going to drop their instinctiveself preservationhabits and walk out into the field because the DEER FOOD tastes better than corn. If they do I think there is an underlying reason for it that has nothing to do with the DEER FOOD. So I don't see where a person is taking advantage of any natural instincts. They are simply hoping that the DEER FOOD will bring deer into the area because it's a good food source. They're not trying to trick them into doing something they normally wouldn't.

DEER BAIT is generally placed in the woods. In this case you are banking on the fact that the deer will be more comfortable coming to it because they are in the woods where they spend most of their time and feel secure. So you are tricking the deer into thinking they are secure while eating the DEER BAIT. You're clearly taking advantage of their natural instincts. Not the instinct to feed, the instinct that tells them they are secure in the woods rather than in the open in the middle of the day.

DEER BAIT in the form of a feeder also takes advantage of a deer's natural instincts. After a while the deer will gain a sense of security at the feeding station because they haven't been bothered there all year long. So their instinctive self preservation habits tell them that it's safe to come to the feeder whether it's in the middle of a field or the middle of the woods. In this case you're taking advantage of the deer by tricking them into a false sense of security.

In human terms.....if I'm headed out to buy some hunting gear and there is a Wal-Mart down the road in a niceneighborhood (DEER BAIT) I'm going to visit that one instead of the one in the middle of gang territory (DEER FOOD). My instincts tell me I'm more likely to run into trouble in the middle of gang territory (AN OPEN FIELD) than I will in a nice neighborhood (THE WOODS). If my car was stolen from the parking lot in the nice neighborhood someone took advantage of my instinctive self preservation habits.

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So why in NY you can plant a food plot ( doesn`t state a size on the DEC website) but can`t put a "Baitpile" out. I`ve also done the 10 x 10 plots where my wife hunts and it draws does in. She`s had does come within 5 feet of her next to this "PLOT". It just doesn`t make sence. We hunt on 58 acres so we can`t plant a 60 acre plot. This is why I went with alot of smaller plots. At first I thought I was making bigger RACKS on the bucks but then I started ?ing myself as far as baiting goes. So if it`s a small plot it`s baiting but if it`s a 60 acre or bigger more expensive plot it`s ok? I`m not trying to be an A@S here but just don`t see the difference in it.