good by Remington
03-05-2011, 05:15 AM
#141
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Huntin' In Colorado
Posts: 2,910
I don't believe everything I read or see. I'm not gonna start guessing and money he recieved if any.I know what he said.Remington interview with him in response to CNBC didn't convince me beyond a shadow of a doubt their was nothing wrong with the design to begin with. Remington did blow that other guys testimony out of the water
when they showed that he purchased a Remington. But the court settlements and losses speek for themselves. Remington needs better Lawyers to overturn these cases to convince me otherwise.
when they showed that he purchased a Remington. But the court settlements and losses speek for themselves. Remington needs better Lawyers to overturn these cases to convince me otherwise.
03-05-2011, 05:41 AM
#142
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 1,143
I didn't see the CNBC piece either but i heard about it. I might be wrong but from what i understood is the guns in question were ADL models and the gun discharged when operating the bolt to empty the magazine.If that's the case why wasn't the gun pointed in a safe direction?
Also i was under the impression that the safety on the gun couldn't be in the" safe" position when the bolt was operated??????? On my 700 the safety can be in the safe position and you can operate the bolt.
Do i have the facts correct or am i wrong? If what i said is true the unfortunately it sounds like operater error / careless gun handling.Didn't Marlin have a simular rap about accidental discharge on the 336 model prior to the introduction of the crossbolt safety?
Also i was under the impression that the safety on the gun couldn't be in the" safe" position when the bolt was operated??????? On my 700 the safety can be in the safe position and you can operate the bolt.
Do i have the facts correct or am i wrong? If what i said is true the unfortunately it sounds like operater error / careless gun handling.Didn't Marlin have a simular rap about accidental discharge on the 336 model prior to the introduction of the crossbolt safety?
03-05-2011, 05:50 AM
#143
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Orange county, NY
Posts: 2,949
Companies settle out of court all the time. It's cheaper for them to do that than to fight it. Right or wrong the companies save more money to just settle. Surely you know that. I can't be the first person in the world to tell you that. That's why all of these fake lawsuits are handled like they are. It's cheaper for companies to just pay the liars and cheats off than to go to court and that's why they sue them. You should google "lawsuit abuse", and read about it. It will amaze you.
03-05-2011, 08:26 AM
#144
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location:
Posts: 1,832
I have 3 full house custon rifles built on rem 700 actions, built by different big name smiths, when getting the info togather for my builds, I ask them all about what trigger to use.
All 3 gave the same answer, if its a hunting rifle, there is nothing wrong with a tuned 700 factory trigger, for target rifles a jewel would be better, but a 700 will adjust nicely down to 2.5# with crisp release.
These are guys who put they're reputation on the line every time they build a rifle, so I'll take they're word for it.
RR
All 3 gave the same answer, if its a hunting rifle, there is nothing wrong with a tuned 700 factory trigger, for target rifles a jewel would be better, but a 700 will adjust nicely down to 2.5# with crisp release.
These are guys who put they're reputation on the line every time they build a rifle, so I'll take they're word for it.
RR
Rem 700 rifle either using factory trigger poperly adjusted. Cause I know before it got handed to me it would be safe. The gunsmiths reputation is at stake.. I work for a manufacturing and installating company. We have gotten awards lots but the 2 precious to me are the 2 we got as the best exporting of manufactured goods in North America. That doesn't mean we don't do things wrong, design issues, or couldn't have been better.Does that mean we are the best there is? No, but it has alot to do with of acceptable level of tolerence is much much higher than our competition before it goes out the door.Before it is much higher than industry min specs acceptable in North American.These are stiff tolerences to live up to in the bare min level to make it higher is an achievement well above and beyond.Obviously there is an issue with Remington that goes alot deeper than what we are seeing on T.V.. I just don't trust the way
they are put together in that factory facility..It seems to me, it's production numbers at min factory standards. Our facility counts on production no question about it,min production numbers have to be met, but it's a very reasonable number to meet , but if the quality standard isn't up to our standards, it gets to meet our standards, and gets shipped.Are we making millions, yep, could we make more, yep
but I quarantee it would be at the price of quality and or company reputation.All Remington has to do is slow things down, cause there was a time when everybody agreed that Rem was and is and will continue to be a great hunting rifle.Right now, the percentage has dropped. That's a fact.
03-05-2011, 08:47 AM
#145
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Huntin' In Colorado
Posts: 2,910
Jeff, to make my point, whens the last time YOUR Remington went off without someone pulling the trigger? As far as that goes, when's the last time any of the people that are on this forum, YOUR Remington went off without someone puilling the trigger???
That's what I thought.
03-05-2011, 08:53 AM
#146
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Idaho
Posts: 1,081
I have never had it happen, nor has anyone I know had it happen. In my opinion, some people should not be allowed arround tools much less be adjusting on a trigger. You can not blame Remington for someone misadjusting one of their triggers.
03-05-2011, 09:32 AM
#147
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location:
Posts: 1,832
[QUOTE=Colorado Luckydog;3782349]You are finally right. Some have started to believe that Remington's quality is not as good as it was. The people that believe that are not smart enough to make their own decisions and are easily led. They believe whatever is said and in print, no matter who said or wrote it and what their agenda is.
Jeff, to make my point, whens the last time YOUR Remington went off without someone pulling the trigger? As far as that goes, when's the last time any of the people that are on this forum, YOUR Remington went off without someone puilling the trigger???
That's what I thought.[/QUOTE
I don't own a Rem. But I am in search of a new rifle.I have a Husqvarna (no longer made) a customn Sako and Browning A-bolt. Now the last time I bought rifle was in 91.As we all know things change through the years some for better some for worse. When I buy anything I take my time and make my careful decisions on what I had previously or if I have never had a certain product brand before, I look at other testimonials, I reasearch I come to my own conclusion based on the presentation that both sides give.
I gonna go out there and say it, when it comes to purchasing a product brand that I have never had before, I'm the one that can't think for himself, and make my self believe everything is A-ok. I am not able to put myself out, without doing some type of background knowledge of how it performs
today.If I was gonna buy a gun over the counter today, with all the other choices of Rifle Brands out there, it would not be a Remington.But I'm also
patient person and not easily led. I know Remingtons past, and know they are more than capable of making it right, I have held off for a couple of years, I can hold off longer and go with a custom Rem 700 made by a competant Gunsmith, or even wait until more people start believing in them again.I am in no hurry to buy, and I do believe in Remingtons outstanding history and in their future,but I am able to make a bias decision on them
at this moment because of court judgments and rulings and tesimonies of
of current owners, and their opinions plus their employees including their
own designer. I do this can I am wanting to purchase a new rifle I want
on that won't let me down.With Rem and the declining number of followers, and these current allegations and rulings, leads me to believe there is
better choices today. Not tomorrow today. But I am patient, and I do give them oppurtunities to prove they are a worthwhile investment. I like only buying once. Once I have I own for life and am proud to pass down.
Jeff, to make my point, whens the last time YOUR Remington went off without someone pulling the trigger? As far as that goes, when's the last time any of the people that are on this forum, YOUR Remington went off without someone puilling the trigger???
That's what I thought.[/QUOTE
I don't own a Rem. But I am in search of a new rifle.I have a Husqvarna (no longer made) a customn Sako and Browning A-bolt. Now the last time I bought rifle was in 91.As we all know things change through the years some for better some for worse. When I buy anything I take my time and make my careful decisions on what I had previously or if I have never had a certain product brand before, I look at other testimonials, I reasearch I come to my own conclusion based on the presentation that both sides give.
I gonna go out there and say it, when it comes to purchasing a product brand that I have never had before, I'm the one that can't think for himself, and make my self believe everything is A-ok. I am not able to put myself out, without doing some type of background knowledge of how it performs
today.If I was gonna buy a gun over the counter today, with all the other choices of Rifle Brands out there, it would not be a Remington.But I'm also
patient person and not easily led. I know Remingtons past, and know they are more than capable of making it right, I have held off for a couple of years, I can hold off longer and go with a custom Rem 700 made by a competant Gunsmith, or even wait until more people start believing in them again.I am in no hurry to buy, and I do believe in Remingtons outstanding history and in their future,but I am able to make a bias decision on them
at this moment because of court judgments and rulings and tesimonies of
of current owners, and their opinions plus their employees including their
own designer. I do this can I am wanting to purchase a new rifle I want
on that won't let me down.With Rem and the declining number of followers, and these current allegations and rulings, leads me to believe there is
better choices today. Not tomorrow today. But I am patient, and I do give them oppurtunities to prove they are a worthwhile investment. I like only buying once. Once I have I own for life and am proud to pass down.
Last edited by Jeff Ovington; 03-05-2011 at 11:21 AM.
03-05-2011, 01:26 PM
#148
Fork Horn
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Slippery Rock, Pa.
Posts: 393
I am able to make a bias decision on them
at this moment because of court judgments and rulings and tesimonies of
of current owners, and their opinions plus their employees including their
own designer. .[/quote]
From their website since you won't go there,
Roger James – Presented as the "Remington Insider"
Testifying in those cases under oath, he was specifically asked whether he had "any recollection of ever hearing anyone at Remington discuss alleged accidental discharges involving bolt-action rifles." His answer was, "No, sir."
Mr. James NEVER worked in the manufacturing or production of firearms; rather, he was employed in Remington’s ammunition plant.
Mike Walker - Designer
The 1948 design shown by CNBC was not even Mr. Walker’s, but that of another Remington engineer.
CNBC also did not note that Mr. Walker’s 1948 proposal would have left the connector in place, or that when Mr. Walker designed the Model 700 in the early 1960s, he maintained the connector and incorporated a sear blocking safety mechanism, consistent with prior designs.
at this moment because of court judgments and rulings and tesimonies of
of current owners, and their opinions plus their employees including their
own designer. .[/quote]
From their website since you won't go there,
Roger James – Presented as the "Remington Insider"
Testifying in those cases under oath, he was specifically asked whether he had "any recollection of ever hearing anyone at Remington discuss alleged accidental discharges involving bolt-action rifles." His answer was, "No, sir."
Mr. James NEVER worked in the manufacturing or production of firearms; rather, he was employed in Remington’s ammunition plant.
Mike Walker - Designer
The 1948 design shown by CNBC was not even Mr. Walker’s, but that of another Remington engineer.
CNBC also did not note that Mr. Walker’s 1948 proposal would have left the connector in place, or that when Mr. Walker designed the Model 700 in the early 1960s, he maintained the connector and incorporated a sear blocking safety mechanism, consistent with prior designs.
03-05-2011, 02:00 PM
#149
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Huntin' In Colorado
Posts: 2,910
Stapher1, I don't know what to think about these guys. They would believe Keith Olbermann, Nancy Pelosi or even Whoopi Goldberg, before they would go with the results of their own experience, or the experience of so many others.
Remington has probably made millions of rifles and shotguns. Their rifles and shotguns are in the hands of hundreds of thousands of hunters, shooters, lawmen and even our military.
Then the liberal media makes a news story that gives just a few examples of some BS stories and they believe them. It doesn't matter to them that this very same media outlet that produced the story is the same liberal media that is constantly trying to chip away at our rights as gun owners and Americans.
I can't believe that some folks have such weak minds and spirit and are so easily led and manipulated. It's sad and scary.
Remington has probably made millions of rifles and shotguns. Their rifles and shotguns are in the hands of hundreds of thousands of hunters, shooters, lawmen and even our military.
Then the liberal media makes a news story that gives just a few examples of some BS stories and they believe them. It doesn't matter to them that this very same media outlet that produced the story is the same liberal media that is constantly trying to chip away at our rights as gun owners and Americans.
I can't believe that some folks have such weak minds and spirit and are so easily led and manipulated. It's sad and scary.
03-05-2011, 02:59 PM
#150
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Idaho
Posts: 1,081
stapher1, i don't know what to think about these guys. They would believe keith olbermann, nancy pelosi or even whoopi goldberg, before they would go with the results of their own experience, or the experience of so many others.
Remington has probably made millions of rifles and shotguns. Their rifles and shotguns are in the hands of hundreds of thousands of hunters, shooters, lawmen and even our military.
Then the liberal media makes a news story that gives just a few examples of some bs stories and they believe them. It doesn't matter to them that this very same media outlet that produced the story is the same liberal media that is constantly trying to chip away at our rights as gun owners and americans.
I can't believe that some folks have such weak minds and spirit and are so easily led and manipulated. It's sad and scary.
Remington has probably made millions of rifles and shotguns. Their rifles and shotguns are in the hands of hundreds of thousands of hunters, shooters, lawmen and even our military.
Then the liberal media makes a news story that gives just a few examples of some bs stories and they believe them. It doesn't matter to them that this very same media outlet that produced the story is the same liberal media that is constantly trying to chip away at our rights as gun owners and americans.
I can't believe that some folks have such weak minds and spirit and are so easily led and manipulated. It's sad and scary.