RE: please tell me just one negative to crossbows
 

You are right, it can not define what a bow actually is, just the "legal definition" of archery. Nobody argues that a crossbow has a type of bow affixed to a stock with a trigger mechanism affixed to hold the string .. even I'll admit there is a "bow" in there. But the crossbow isn't "just a bow" .. it is a bow that has been altered to be something else through the use of a stock and trigger mechanism. That makes it not archery equipment, or requiring archery skills to shoot.

So your crossbow is legal in Arkansas and not legal in Missouri during archery season, but even in Arkansas it is not archery to shoot a crossbow. They just let them use them there during archery season, not unlike allowing the disabled to use them in our state. It appears they even differentiate their kills as evidenced by Grizzly. I wonder of they break the kills down among by bows sauch as compounds and traditional? I'll guess not, that is probably because they are considered different weapons.

RE: please tell me just one negative to crossbows
 

So can you find a firearm in there too? Because I can't.

Yes they are and I never said they weren't. What I have said is that they are more "bow" like than anything else....and apparantly so have you.

By the way all crossbow kills in Illinois are included in the archery kills and not separated. So here we go again...different states different categories. Dosen't change the fact that a crossbow is a form of a bow.

RE: please tell me just one negative to crossbows
 

MA Jay

You are partially right. Yes Arkansas does break out crossbows seperately from other archery, but in the AGFC definitions of archery equipment there are two categories;
Long, recurve, and compound bows and Crossbows. The only difference I can see in these definitions is the minimum draw weight (40 for the first category, 125 for the second category) and the requirement for a mechanical safety on the crossbow.

The deer harvest numbers for crossbows is approximately 3,000 per year compared to a total harvest of around 110,000 per year for all methods. I don't know what the numbers for total harvest run in your home state. We had our archery season shortened last season by two weeks, but it wasn't because of crossbows.

RE: please tell me just one negative to crossbows
 

Good for you I feel the same way but I don't feel that I have the right to dictate for everyone else how they should be able to hunt just because I feel that way personally.

You don't and I don't but I bet those kids in data's pictures do. I know a lot of people that could care less whether it was killed by a gun, bow, crossbow or whatever, the method is simply irrelevant to them. Everyone doesn't get the same sense of accomplishment from the same things.

You're trying to force you own preconceived notions on everyone else and it just doesn't work. We're not all the same we put value on different things.

Only thing is that all the people being left out of the woods aren't laughing[:'(] Unfortunately you are laughing at them:(

It wouldn't matter if someone did put a report out here, you wouldn't accept it. But isn't the true measure of the effect of crossbows measured but the hunters they share the woods with? I think so and I can tell you that it's a non-issue to the majority of the hunters in this state. That opinion comes from having lived here for over 30 years and heard an OVERWHELMING majority of people supporting other hunters right to use crossbows. Now I give people a ribbing about using them and I encourage them to try trad or compound equipment but I don't think I have the right to force my views on them. There's a big difference in choosing not to shoot one and telling others they shouldn't be able to shoot one because you don't want to[&:]

Exactly, just like it would do for those women and kids and guys with shoulder problems that don't qualify or feel like being qualified as "disabled".

Well I provided those numbers and AR does break down the numbers of animals taken by crossbows. You can get that info by clicking hereDeer Harvest Report just click on deer harvest report.

RE: please tell me just one negative to crossbows
 

But I thought crossbows wouldn't add any new hunters to the ranks? Arkansas has allowed them for 30 years but you guys think that your going to be overrun by them in 1:eek: Actually it works out to a little over 2% of the overall harvest so using those numbers the additional harvest in your state would go up by approximately 270 deer. I already did those numbers for you once;)

RE: please tell me just one negative to crossbows
 

Well we differ there, as the stock, trigger and safety mechanism are the firearm part. I agree though, they are more bow like than they are gun like. I just don't think they are bows. Yes, a form of bow, but not A BOW. As was written-
I happen to think there was a reason Arkansas lumped all the bows together, and then added another weapon to be allowed in their season. That's cool guys. I agree with Arkansas .. the bows are seperate from the crossbows, they have their own qualifications in terms of being legal and they count the deer killed seperatly. If this was allowed in every state I would tell you that there are BowHunters and Crossbow hunters. Not better or inferior.. just different. Arkansas lumped them together .. other states seperate them, but they are still considered different.

RE: please tell me just one negative to crossbows
 

Wait a minuet here. You don't know it will add 30% to the archery kills in your state. You are using the same deduction reasoning that you dismissed us for using. How do you know exactly how much more crossbows will add to the archery kills in your state? You don't do you? You are not taking into consideration crossbows have been used for 30 plus years in AK. You think you will get the amount of crossbow hunters that AK has percentage wise in the first year it's allowed?

I don't know about your state but are you telling me deer populations are in the decline? seems like every other state they are in the incline. The deer population may demand the need for additional hunters in your state in the future and crossbowers could be the answer.

If you are going to use one states stats to bolster your argument then you must allow them to bolster ours....oh wait that won't be good for the anti's would it now. Because Arkansas is a prime example of ALL TYPES of bows existing just fine together.

RE: please tell me just one negative to crossbows
 

Well, it is less skillful a weapon to use, as is a compound HOWEVER .......... is the challenge of the weapons REALLY what makes bowhunting bowhunting ? Isn't the fact you have to trick a whitetail and get within 20 yards count towards anything ? Its not easy to kill a deer with a crossbow or a compound - though both are vastly easier than a recurve.

I'm guessing they monitor the effects of the legalized crossbows to decide IF they're having a negative effect ?? I wish they would break down compounds/recurve/longbows though

That might be, but theres not any harm allowing them in archery season - you see that now, don't you ? Because soon, the modern compounds will have to be regulated too - they're almost right now a vertical crossbow.

MA Jay - Look at these two "bows" and make some comparisons ..... or rather, tell me the differences, it'd be MUCh easier that way :D

RE: please tell me just one negative to crossbows
 

No I feel the same way. I never said those components weren't gun like. I just said a crossbow has more bow features to be considered a firearm.

Again I agree.

Again I agree...see we have more in common than you think.

The difference between us is because it's more bow than firearm I feel the logical season would be the bow season. It seem to me that you feel because it's more a bow than a firearm is should have it's own season or be included with the firearm season. As long as it's not the bow season regardless of the fact that it is more bow like than gun like as you yourself have admitted to.
Where am I wrong here?

RE: please tell me just one negative to crossbows
 

Hold the fort down Data, Silent and Griz. I have to run out for a while. I will check in later.