This thread is approaching lunacy.

Mr. Snook here has had the oportunity to invent something, market it, use it and ultimately, he was posting that his invention was successful. To that I say Congratulations NickSnook. You have created a successful product.

As to the head / neck / spine shot argument -- as archers, we have the responsibility to make ethical kills and promote the sport in an ethical manner. As previously stated, I would not take a head / neck / spine shot, nor would I allow someone hunting on my property to do so. However, Mr Snook successfully used a product to shoot a deer. He killed the deer. Perhaps it was lucky, perhaps it was skill, but the point of this whole post was that he used a Turbo Nock to successfully arrow a living animal.

BobCo: I agree completly with you. I think hunters need to be educated as to how to ethically kill an animal. Note I did not use correctly. You can correctly kill a deer by dropping a bowling ball on its head. Not ethical, but the deer is dead... I, for one, would like to see more rampant hunters education in order to educate hunters. But you can't force your views on them when you aren't there monitoring what they are doing on private land. Perhaps a different thread should be started along these lines to open up a discussion as to how to better teach ethical hunting.

Rob: I appreciate you stepping in when this thread was taking a negative turn. Having been a member here for around a month, I tend to notice that sometimes people's opinions tend to overshadow the purpose of the thread. This really doesn't accomplish anything.

And now, as this post is becoming off topic, happy hunting to all!

Thanks mjqgoodo

It is refreshing to see some input where constructive criticism is given without the name calling and such.

I talked today with a friend of mine, Tom Rowe, who is on the ATA board of directors. Tom Related to me that he once took a similiar shot as I did from a tree stand and hit the spine behind the shoulders and had to take several other shots to kill the deer as it dragged itself away bawling.
I could tell by the tone in his voice that this had affected him greatly.
I took his words to heart.
I have been shooting since age three and I do not consider myself an expert. There is always more to learn in this or any sport.
A great way to learn is by communicating with others on these forums.
I have learned a lot about hunting ethics. and hopefully others who read this will have a greater insight in making hunting decisions.

What saddens me is that we get all fired up on a hunting ethic issue , and yet look at the ethics we use when dealing with each other in expressing
our opinions.
I have heard some say I would not hunt with someone who would take a shot like that.
My question is would you hunt with someone who would treat his fellow man like dirt . Can we treat each other with the same reverence we profess to give toward animals we are killing?

New people to the sport who read this will certainly have a better opinion of archery in general if they see us discussing different viewpionts like
the last post . with some degree of respect for each other. and possibly agree to disagree.
During these bizarre political times we are going through , we see our leaders and potential leaders going at each other tooth and nail. and truth and lies and name calling from all sides . Think how the rest of the world must view our society if they are watching tv .
Here we are on this forum pretty much using the same ethics as our politics seem to dictate to discuss this ethics issue.
I have found that usually a voice of reason is listened to more than anger.

I have certainly learned a lot from this forum so far.

I have always been a ground hunter, and this was my first treestand hunt
When I saw this deer come under the stand, I drew on it and the shot just fell in place. Sometimes you just get a feeling . I took the shot and dropped the deer. After hearing all the points of view here I probably would not take a shot like that again. I am happy that at least this time the shot worked and the animal did not suffer.

Stories like that really make a person think. What we carry into the woods had the potential to injure and or kill. As much as we all enjoy hunting and the fun of it all, it is serious business.

Fair enough. Hunting has a bad name around here. I hate that. They view us as bumbling idiots with guns who go out in the woods and fire away at deer. And I can't actually blame them. During gun season around here, it sounds like people are shooting at running deer. All you hear is a string of 6 shots and then swearing. This really hurts the sport.

God I hope so. I hate getting angry as my wife will tell you. In fact, I usually get more pissed off that I lost my temper and totally forget about the thing which upset me in the first place.

Good. I think that's why we're all here. Otherwise, we'd be playing solitare or something on these computers...

Your shot placement is your own call. I think hearing other people tell stories of wounded crying animals makes me afraid to take questionable shots. But until your convince your heart of it, all the angry posts in the world won't change someone's mind. Relating first hand experiences is the only way to help another understand WHY the shot should / shouldn't be taken. In the end, it's up to the individual hunter.

Personally, I think these types of shots should be avoided for a few reasons. First the margin error is just so slim. Second, no hunter can completely eliminate all factors or variables of the shot on a live animal. There are many things that are beyond the hunters control or vision. There is always a short period of time between the actual decision of release (point of no return) and the time the arrow gets to the animal. Did you know that a deer can move over 7 inches traveling at just 2mph by the time a 300fps no decelerating arrow gets to it at 20 yards, if you'd like to see the math PM me. All a deer needs to do is pick its head up while someone is shooting at its brain. Could be the difference between an actual brain hit and blowing off a deer’s jaw even at 5 yards. Now you would have an unrecoverable deer that will starve to death over a long period of time. Talk about feeling bad on a gut shot that takes 12 hours, how about days or weeks to slowly die. It just isn't worth it to me. Yea, maybe I could make that head/neck/or spine shot 9 out of 10 times on living game or 100 out of 100 times on a target, but it just isn't worth it for that one that could possibly get wounded.

I think you made the right decision Nick, and I applaud you for keeping an open mind.

Great post mjqood0.

I would also say that we are in a forum where most of the archers are very or extremely passionate about their sport. I feel that is a good thing. When opinions vary, things may seem rough around the edges. But I never feel that we are at war against each other. JMHO.

I will give the benefit of the doubt and agree with that.

mjqooDo
You are a wise man! I feel like a weight has been lifted off my shoulders.
I am going to hunt with my brother and other family members in Potter county tomorrow after I vote . This little saga has been weighing heavily on me. If I get a chance to take a nice buck there will be a lot of extra thought going into the setup.

My grand nephew James Hunter Snook is going to also be my guide on a small game hunt , James Won his age group at the Pa Bowhunters Festival this year and is the youngest member of our Team TURBO NOCK
I wonder what I will learn from him?

Good luck hunting! Maybe you can score another Turbo'd Deer?!