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RE: High Fence - Real Life Scenario
bigtim6656 its one of the biggest issues that the heritage of hunting has ever faced. bingo why is it ok to bait a deer with corn cemeere deer. and not do so with in a 5000 acre fenced area. In a 5000 acre area not sure how the fence would matter. if it doesn't matter - take down the fence i meant when deer have 5000 acres to roam around there not in a small area where you say hey can i shoot that one. Now i would hunt a place where they had 5000 acres used a fence to do the best they can to keep deer with good genetics in and deer with bad genetics out. why would genetics matter ? why a fenced area ? genetics is a big part of hunting if you see a buck with bad antlers year after year you kill him if you spend thousands growing big deer you want to keep deer that are not big do not have big antlers out. be it a fence or shooting those deer. ahhhhhhh so you can be more guaranteed to kill a big racked buck - horn porn, selfish "look at the big rack I killed" kinda thing huh ? horn porn 90% of you anti fence guys care only for the rack on the deer. I hear people say i hate high fence opts. only reason you hunt one is for a big buck. Alot of you guys hunt for bucks only even in public land. the world's biggest bucks from Jordan to Zaft to Johnson to the Hole in the Horn and MN Monarch .... they were pretty good genetics and didn't have fences ... So people can charge money to other people who find them desireable? and it aint hunting - ever [/quote] |
RE: High Fence - Real Life Scenario
ORIGINAL: quiksilver I really don't see anything wrong with it. Let's face it:this canned deer hunt isn't going to be a life-altering event that leads the child into a downward spiral of drugs, prostitution and welfare. It's a deer hunt for chrissakes. He goes out and shoots a deer. So what? Maybe it's half-tame. Maybe it's not the "ideal" set of circumstances. Rarely in life are circumstances truly "ideal." Let's be real here. Look at it for what it is: A chance to go hang out with the boy and maybe bond a little bit. Maybe he gets one, maybe he doesn't. Maybe he backs off the trigger at the last second. Maybe he gets there and realizes right away that it's not for him. Making your own decisions is part of becoming an adult. By putting him in a situation to make a decision and live with it - you're giving him an opportunity to grow as a human. For the sake of argument, let's say thathe shootsa deer inside the pen, then feels a little bit of remorse about it later. This willeither re-affirm his zeal and desire to hunt truly "wild" game in the future. At worst, he may discover that hunting isn't for him.That's his decision to make. In sum, I don't think it will "make or break" him as a hunter. I think it will give him an opportunity to make his own choice as an independent adultand live with it. It will give him the opportunity to experience compassion for his quarry and maybe open his eyes to the brutal beauty ofour game. Hunting isn't all butterflies and rainbows, whether it's inside a fence or 100% fair chase. Part of being a hunter, and more importantly, an adult, is making your own choices with regard to setting a heading on your own moral compass. As a father and a guide, you can present the opportunity to find himself as a man and a hunter. All too often, hunters make a consciencious effort to try to get their family "into hunting"by putting them in a position to have a good time.Sooner or later, the honeymoon ends, andFather Time puts these people in a position where they fail. In hunting, you fail more often than you succeed. Some people just can't swallow failure, or lack the discipline to put in the actual effort necessary,so they just throw in the towel. I don't agree with that at all. I think you're setting them up for failure. Let people make their own decisions. You've said it before - hunting is very personal - and I agree 100%. Let him make the call.  |
RE: High Fence - Real Life Scenario
who are you to say what is moral right ethical or good. heck one day having black slaves was the right thing moral and ok. but not know. thank God they did too i meant when deer have 5000 acres to roam around there not in a small area where you say hey can i shoot that one. none of that is hunting genetics is a big part of hunting if you see a buck with bad antlers year after year you kill him if you spend thousands growing big deer you want to keep deer that are not big do not have big antlers out. be it a fence or shooting those deer. horn porn 90% of you anti fence guys care only for the rack on the deer. I hear people say i hate high fence opts. only reason you hunt one is for a big buck. Alot of you guys hunt for bucks only even in public land |
RE: High Fence - Real Life Scenario
One man's baiting is another man's HF hunting.
Kill 'em all.....and let God sort 'em out.;) |
RE: High Fence - Real Life Scenario
ORIGINAL: Big Duane who are you to say what is moral right ethical or good. I don't like high fence stuff, but I just don't like it when people are so open to try to legistlate somebody to be a "good person". In other words, I see nothing but bad things happen when cars go over 70MPH on open highways, so in your logic, limit every car to 75MPH or whatever the limit on roads are in the region. My logic is, I want the freedom to make a slimey spot of myself on my motorcycle at 140MPH. Brad, you can't make people be good people or what you want or what you consider to be a good person. |
RE: High Fence - Real Life Scenario
i do think the fence is a little much. i would properly not hunt one. if it was free. i am not going to tell you i will not take a free hunt. not sure weather i would or not. but if i did go to a fence outfitter. i would not be on herethe next day telling you guys how i hunted down this big 180 class deer. because it is not hunting. but i do not see anything wrong with someone hunting on one. more then likely it will not be me.
The only different isee in hunting a high fence 3000 plus acres and qdmaisyou do not have complete control of what deer come and go from your area. and it doestake away from fair chase i think there is some fair chase left but not much. I think there is alot of reasons not to do it and not to many to do it. As for what the anti hunters think F*CK the anti hunters i could really care less what they think.and yes i mean every word of that. The days of me caring weather someone care weather i hunt fish watch rated r movies and play shooting video game end along time ago. We should not think bads about a type of hunting just because the antis dislike it or want to use it for a reason. to stop hunting. I have mixedfeelings about high fence. i have mixedfeelings about people hunting a outfitter where the guy says sithere over some bait and wait for the deer to come by and eat. To me you loose when you even hunt with an outfitter where they scout they hang the stand drag the deer out and gut it. ORIGINAL: Big Duane who are you to say what is moral right ethical or good. heck one day having black slaves was the right thing moral and ok. but not know. thank God they did too i meant when deer have 5000 acres to roam around there not in a small area where you say hey can i shoot that one. none of that is hunting genetics is a big part of hunting if you see a buck with bad antlers year after year you kill him if you spend thousands growing big deer you want to keep deer that are not big do not have big antlers out. be it a fence or shooting those deer. horn porn 90% of you anti fence guys care only for the rack on the deer. I hear people say i hate high fence opts. only reason you hunt one is for a big buck. Alot of you guys hunt for bucks only even in public land |
RE: High Fence - Real Life Scenario
thankyou. heck that was my moto on here for a long time.
hunt and enjoy it. nothing matters when you walk in the woods but weather that deer smells sees or hears you before you drop him. ORIGINAL: GMMAT One man's baiting is another man's HF hunting. Kill 'em all.....and let God sort 'em out.;) |
RE: High Fence - Real Life Scenario
i do agree but the speed limit thing comes down to safty of other people.
but all in all a good post bigcountry ORIGINAL: bigcountry ORIGINAL: Big Duane who are you to say what is moral right ethical or good. I don't like high fence stuff, but I just don't like it when people are so open to try to legistlate somebody to be a "good person". In other words, I see nothing but bad things happen when cars go over 70MPH on open highways, so in your logic, limit every car to 75MPH or whatever the limit on roads are in the region. My logic is, I want the freedom to make a slimey spot of myself on my motorcycle at 140MPH. Brad, you can't make people be good people or what you want or what you consider to be a good person. |
RE: High Fence - Real Life Scenario
Taking a kid to a high fence so he can find out what's it's like to hunt is like taking him to a brothel to find out what women are like.;)
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RE: High Fence - Real Life Scenario
Taking a kid to a high fence so he can find out what's it's like to hunt is like taking him to a brothel to find out what women are like.;) |
RE: High Fence - Real Life Scenario
Again, is this fair chase??? Still it would be hard to say this is not "fair chase" Right, Hillbilly?;) |
RE: High Fence - Real Life Scenario
Probably the Playboy mansion woulda been a better analogy Brothel you pay you get what you pay for HF same thing. |
RE: High Fence - Real Life Scenario
Your not going to gat one of those racks. Ummm.....Why not? Captive audience......target-rich environment.........Great genetics......a true hunter's paradise! |
RE: High Fence - Real Life Scenario
If indeed he does succeed and takes a 150 class deer, then, this deer will be his first deer (buck anyway) shot with a bow. What does he have to look forward to? That, for most, is a once in a lifetime chance. My point is, any other deer that he shoots "by a more natural means" would never compare and would never completely fulfill his thought of a successful hunt. The "deer farm", IMO, would spoil his hunting career. This was the same thought that was handed down to me by my uncles when I first started hunting. Iwas in awe of their deer compared to my very first deer, a fork horn. They told me that I wouldn't even want to shoot that deer in my first year because almost every other year would be a disappointment.I hope this makes sense. I'm a hunter and not a writer.
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RE: High Fence - Real Life Scenario
Puke!!! This whole crap just makes me sick.
Jeff, do you think it's ok to go on a HF hunt? If you do, talk to your son and let him decide. If you don't, don't even bring it up to him. It undoubtedly is not yet your son's decision, or you would not have asked for our opinions. You are having to ask yourself, and us, what you should do, or would do. Actually you are not really allowing him to decide at all. You are questioning the whole thing and probably thinking the whole time, you are making a mistake. So why even bother. You know you really don't want him to go. Why give him the option right now. When he gets older and decides to or not to, then you will be able to see if you had an influence anyway. you seem to have a problem with the baiting thing too Jeff. Is this an inner desire of yours to defend something you may want to do? I mean, every time something comes up that others are against, you come up with "the Double Standard" stuff. You know it is not a double standard. HF is a horn porn bonanza and you know it and so does everyone else here. Baiting is not entrapment no more than hunting under a White Oak or in a Honeysuckle patch. It is an "Attractant". HF is an Entrapment. Period. LT LT |
RE: High Fence - Real Life Scenario
What does he have to look forward to? That, for most, is a once in a lifetime chance. My point is, any other deer that he shoots "by a more natural means" would never compare and would never completely fulfill his thought of a successful hunt. He'll damn sure KNOW that a yearling doe taken in our woods, here, is a FAR greater "trophy" than ANYTHING he could ever take from there. If I thought for a second he couldn't understand that......I wouldn't mention it to him. He's (and so do I;)) got a lot more common sense than he's getting credit for. Approached with this possible endeavorcorrectly....my 8 yr old nephew does, also. If we go....it'll be what it is. A novelty. I don't think there's a person in these forums that thinks the talks we'd have wouldn't instill this fact. I was telling Critr, earlier....that "my" gut tells me he'll probably decline the offer. But if he doesn't....and he still wants to go.....I'll take him. He won't leave the house with any false delusions, though. He'll be going to shoot a deer. Period. It's free....and if he wants to go and take a deer 'ol pops will likely NEVER SEE, here.....I won't deny him that. It's not illegal. No onewill be hurt during the process. |
RE: High Fence - Real Life Scenario
Reading 22 pages of back and forth. It sounds to me like you already had your mind made up prior to posting the question.
I wish you and your son the best of luck in which ever route you decide to take. |
RE: High Fence - Real Life Scenario
I'd get to give him the $$ for the mount.....that gift. and He'll damn sure KNOW that a yearling doe taken in our woods, here, is a FAR greater "trophy" than ANYTHING he could ever take from there. If I thought for a second he couldn't understand that......I wouldn't mention it to him. |
RE: High Fence - Real Life Scenario
There's nothing "confusing" about it, hillbilly......unless you have an agenda or you can't read.
Ialso stated that I'd have WHATEVER he shoots mounted for him, this year. If that's a doeor a buck, here....so be it. If it's a buck, there.....so be it. How's that confusing? |
RE: High Fence - Real Life Scenario
same women that are in the brothels
they just sleep with the same old hunter everyday. :D:D ORIGINAL: GMMAT Your not going to gat one of those racks. Ummm.....Why not? Captive audience......target-rich environment.........Great genetics......a true hunter's paradise! |
RE: High Fence - Real Life Scenario
Jeff I am usually against fenced in hunting but if it brings another youth on board buddy go for it. We need more of todays youth to join the ranks. But promise me some pics on here, deal?
My brother went on a fenced operations a few years back for elk to help out the outfitter cull a few females and that meat was so good. T |
RE: High Fence - Real Life Scenario
My brother went on a fenced operations a few years back for elk to help out the outfitter cull a few females and that meat was so good. Like I was also telling him.....he may well choose NOT to do this.I think the discussion was very telling, though. |
RE: High Fence - Real Life Scenario
My son would be offended if I even offered to take him on a shoot like that, free or not! :) Not our cup of tea!;)
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RE: High Fence - Real Life Scenario
Oh stop, you still sore about the cubs?:D:D:D:D:D:D:D
I am sore about Favre being gone I can tell that. Hell with the GM and Pres. |
RE: High Fence - Real Life Scenario
I am sore about Favre being gone I can tell that. Hell with the GM and Pres. |
RE: High Fence - Real Life Scenario
My son would be offended if I even offered to take him on a shoot like that, free or not! :) Not our cup of tea!;) I think I see a streak in your house.;) |
RE: High Fence - Real Life Scenario
favre who does he play golf :D:D:D:D
ORIGINAL: peakrut Oh stop, you still sore about the cubs?:D:D:D:D:D:D:D I am sore about Favre being gone I can tell that. Hell with the GM and Pres. |
RE: High Fence - Real Life Scenario
Ahh Happiness is signing on and seeing a GMMAT 22 pager. ;)
Couple thoughts, You have the deer numbers to put him on a doe virtually anytime in your woods. If he hasn't taken a deer, a doe or a buck should give him the same taste of the hunt. The thrill is the chance to shoot your 1st arrow at that live target, knowing if your shot is good, the result will be a quick humane kill. I couldn't take my son on such a hunt for his first..why, I'm not really sure! It just doesn't seem right, because I'm making the choice for him. Given the chance to have a near 100% shooting opportunity most any youingster would jump at it. Not saying that they don't have ethics, but they are not yet deep rooted as some of ours. They haven't yet grasped the oneness with nature, the real thrill of the hunt itself. Heck, when I was young I never understood how Dad had a "great hunt" when he came home empty handed. It takes some years to understand that the kill is not the hunt, it'sjust a small (sometimes unneccesary) fraction of it. Now if you choose to go on the hunt, it's different and my viewpoint (after thinking about this for the better part of a year) has pehaps changed. It's a free opportunity (call it free hunt, free shoot, what-ever). How is this different than someone taking you on a free round of Golf. The animal was bred and sustained for this purpose. It's not like they go out in the wild and lasso one and drag it in for you. It's a product. As is the beef you buy at the store, asare the pheasants you shoot at the "Ranch". Many naysayers on the board would probably jump on it in private. Would I? Offer to film me, we'll do a documentary for the board on an actual canned hunt expirience minute by minute hour by hour with video. No sugar coating. Would I shoot? Can't say ! I've never been in that situation. |
RE: High Fence - Real Life Scenario
GR8....He's already killed a deer, here. He did that a few years ago.
Let me ask....lol.....If I told them we were brothers....you game? Close to home!:D |
RE: High Fence - Real Life Scenario
i disagree some what i am a youngest i guest 23 and i would not take the hunt. maybe if i wanted some meat i would not kill a trophy deer there and i would not mount it.
But this will be my 5th year hunting i have still not got a deer for a few differt reasons. but i will not settle for anything less the 100% fair chase. not to say one day i would not do it. but i want that first deer kill to be perfect, ORIGINAL: GR8atta2d I couldn't take my son on such a hunt for his first..why, I'm not really sure! It just doesn't seem right, because I'm making the choice for him. Given the chance to have a near 100% shooting opportunity most any youingster would jump at it. Not saying that they don't have ethics, but they are not yet deep rooted as some of ours. They haven't yet grasped the oneness with nature, the real thrill of the hunt itself. Heck, when I was young I never understood how Dad had a "great hunt" when he came home empty handed. It takes some years to understand that the kill is not the hunt, it'sjust a small (sometimes unneccesary) fraction of it. |
RE: High Fence - Real Life Scenario
hey i am game bro :D:D:D:Dant we all brothers on here. i would go let you film it take the shoot and be 100% open to let everyone make a informed choice on what a hf hunt is
ORIGINAL: GMMAT GR8....He's already killed a deer, here. He did that a few years ago. Let me ask....lol.....If I told them we were brothers....you game? Close to home!:D |
RE: High Fence - Real Life Scenario
ORIGINAL: GMMAT GR8....He's already killed a deer, here. He did that a few years ago. Let me ask....lol.....If I told them we were brothers....you game? Close to home!:D Would I? Offer to film me, we'll do a documentary for the board on an actual canned hunt expirience minute by minute hour by hour with video. No sugar coating. Would I shoot? Can't say ! I've never been in that situation. |
RE: High Fence - Real Life Scenario
I wouldn't drive 8 hours one way to see you soil your ultimate pants and get a case of perma stage fright/indecision.
Don't matter to me. I'd film two goats boinkin'. |
RE: High Fence - Real Life Scenario
How could I not that close last year? Im just frustrated and didnt want the vikqueens to get him.
ORIGINAL: Schultzy I am sore about Favre being gone I can tell that. Hell with the GM and Pres. |
RE: High Fence - Real Life Scenario
Nah noUC on this one buddy! I'd have to buy some Wally World stuff. ;)
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RE: High Fence - Real Life Scenario
LMAO 2 goats boinkin
ORIGINAL: GMMAT I wouldn't drive 8 hours one way to see you soil your ultimate pants and get a case of perma stage fright/indecision. Don't matter to me. I'd film two goats boinkin'. |
RE: High Fence - Real Life Scenario
One man's baiting is another man's HF hunting. I live in anti-hunter heaven, and haven't seen any legistlation be affected by high fense operation. Brad, you can't make people be good people or what you want or what you consider to be a good person. As for what the anti hunters think F*CK the anti hunters i could really care less what they think.and yes i mean every word of that. We should not think bads about a type of hunting just because the antis dislike it or want to use it for a reason. to stop hunting. I'm fine with shooting deer in pens - but the shooting of deer in pens is NOT HUNTING ! Its not, and the fact remains those fences are there to stop fair chase. Yes you can argue 20,000 acres makes it almost unlike there isn't a fence - but there is one, and its there for anti-hunting reasons. Taking a kid to a high fence so he can find out what's it's like to hunt is like taking him to a brothel to find out what women are like. 
nice analogy LouisianaTomkat if you're a Dad you know that you have to lead the way with your children, guide them in whats right and wrong. Its what a Dad does Jeff I am usually against fenced in hunting but if it brings another youth on board buddy go for it. We need more of todays youth to join the ranks. But promise me some pics on here, deal? My brother went on a fenced operations a few years back for elk to help out the outfitter cull a few females and that meat was so good. GMMAT - you and I both know (and you cannot argue it) those fences are there to manipulate the genetics, grow big antlers, make money and do it all in an escape proof fence through cattle-like farming techniques. How proud can you be of shooting a barnyard animal ? Awe, maybe he's only half tame, he certainyl aint wild, he certainly didn't grow the rack by accident .... hey do they ear tag the bucks ? How many acres was this place ?? |
RE: High Fence - Real Life Scenario
I'd rather see the goats than one more news story on Bret Favre..boy talk about soiling a reputation..He goes out with pride and dignity only to stumble back in 6 months later as a total bum, traitor, and arrognant has been.
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RE: High Fence - Real Life Scenario
ORIGINAL: Big Duane One man's baiting is another man's HF hunting. Taking a kid to a high fence so he can find out what's it's like to hunt is like taking him to a brothel to find out what women are like.;) |
RE: High Fence - Real Life Scenario
i do not mean to say i do not care what they do. i do very much but when i go to hunt i do not care what they think about what i do. they have there opinion i have mine. no matter how nice i make hunting there never going to like it. I will fight until my dieing breath to stop those people. but i could still careless what they think of me for hunting. and how i hunt. i do not twiddle my thumbs i see one of them and i will argue hunting until the end of days with them.
As for what the anti hunters think F*CK the anti hunters i could really care less what they think.and yes i mean every word of that. They do not have to like me most of them have no control over what i do. matter of fact if they tried to tell me i could not hunt a hf place i would just to stick it to them. hunting is hunting even if it is killing a deer in a fence area. weather i think it is hunting or not i would defend it as a part of someones hunting. |
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