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Bore Butter causes rust??

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Bore Butter causes rust??

Old 10-20-2004, 07:41 AM
  #1  
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Default Bore Butter causes rust??

Someone on another post replied to my suggestion to use Bore Butter. The person said it had caused their firearm to rust. Has anyone else had this problem? I really don't see how it could cause rust, and have used it for awhile without seeing any signs of rust.

What do you use when cleaning your blackpowder rifle? I use T/C No. 13 cleaner wipe all of the dirt out. Switch to a dry patch and swab with three of them. Next, I use the Bore Butter only once down the barrel. Then swab again with two dry patches.

Last year I shot my new muzzleloader about 30 times and used this procedure. Afterwords, I stored it for 10 months before shooting it again, and there was no signs of rust. BTW, I have a nickel barreled muzzleloader; don't know if that would make a difference.
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Old 10-20-2004, 10:24 AM
  #2  
Fork Horn
 
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Default RE: Bore Butter causes rust??

You might be interested with the results of this experiment at: http://www.ctmuzzleloaders.com/mlexp...corrosion.html

Now they didn't test Bore Butter but they did test Wonder Lube and I have read that Ox Yoke supplies TC with Bore Butter and it is only a minor variation of Wonder Lube. From my own observations, they sure seem to be almost the same so I would say that you could expect the same results from Bore Butter.

From the results of this test you can see that Wonder Lube didn't do too good of a job at corrosion protection. It is not that the Wonder Lube caused the corrosion but did not adequately provide protection from it. This is probably what the person that responded to you meant.

Now notice that in this test, burnt powder residue was purposely left on the metal test strips and they were not clean. If they were clean, there may very well not be any corrosion problems, at least not in the time periods between using the rifles and recleaning. However, I think it would be fair to say that a product that offered the most corrosion protection, even with burnt powder residue present, would be better for storage of a clean rifle.

FWIW, I do use Lehigh Valley Lube for shooting and do think it is an excellent product, both as a patch lube and for cleaning. I don't normally use it for a thorough rifle cleaning, but have used it when I am away from home and just need to clean and store the rifle for overnight. I also do not use it for corrosion protection of my stored rifles.
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Old 10-20-2004, 11:20 AM
  #3  
Dominant Buck
 
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Default RE: Bore Butter causes rust??

Bore Butter, Natural Lube 1000 or Wonder Lube is all the same thing. I used to be a Bore Butter user all the time. I had two different rifles rust using it, and if anyone is fussy when it comes to cleaning their rifles, it is me. I was lucky I shoot so often and that I noticed it right away and it was only surface rust and some J.B. Bore Paste and a brass brush took it out. I was so shocked when I ran a patch down my Bore Butter Seasoned Barrel and it came back out rust brown. Talk about a photo oppertunity for surprised look on their face....

Also the accuracy in my T/C Renegade got so terrible, I no longer trusted the rifle. I missed a shot (during our deer season) I could have made with a different rifle and my eyes closed, and ended up wounding a nice little buck. Three of us did manage to walk the critter down, and I admit the .54 caliber did enough damage it finally layed down, but it was a long walk and a longer drag out.....

I then did a boiling soap water bath with the rifle and some oven mitts. Then I plugged the barrel and filled it with M.A.P. and after it sat for 30 minutes I bore brushed the devil out of it. After that I gave it another boiling water bath and then ran solvent patches through it until they came out white, not rust colored or gray, but white. My testing showed the accuracy was back to normal.

When I went back to the rifle's original load the next day I shot a nice doe at over 60 yards as she walked past the stand. The roundball hit right where it was supposed to. That was the last time I ever tried to season a barrel.

The problem with a sidelock is there is really no way to be 100% certain you have the barrel and breech clean. How many times have you cleaned your rifle, then later, ran a solvent patch or a follow up oil patch down the barrel for one reason or another and it came up brown with rust.

The difference between using the bore butter and a petrolium based solvent clean barrel is that you might not have to swab the bore as often using bore butter. They claim in their add that you do not have to swab the bore between shots, well you will still have to if the projectile gets too hard to seat properly. Some people have claimed that they shot 30 times in a row without swabbing. I guess I just do not trust the stuff anymore as something to prevent rust from forming.

I am not telling anyone not to use bore butter. If you have good luck with it then by all means use it. All I am saying is I had a bad experience using it more then once. For that reason I use Birchwood Casey Bore Scrubber, Butch's Bore Shine, M.A.P. and hot water to clean the bores of my rifles. After I am all done I protect them with a patch of Birchwood Casey Sheath or REM OIL, but I like the Birchwood Casey the best. Nice smell too...

Use what you trust and feel comfortable with. If you are a bore butter user, how often do you brush the bore to remove the buildup of the stuff? As I said in the other post, I season my fry pan not my rifle barrel. I have an old barrel around here that I no longer shoot. I think I will conduct an experiment with bore butter..... sounds like an interesting test...
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Old 10-20-2004, 11:39 AM
  #4  
Nontypical Buck
 
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Default RE: Bore Butter causes rust??

Criggster

You misunderstood poster Cayugad & you misinterpreted what he said. This is what he said... "I have seen too many rifles rust using bore butter."

What Cayugad means is that Bore Butter/Wonderlube 1000 cannot displace moisture. So far, your barrel-drying techniques have been working real well. However, some butter users leave traces of water/moisture in their rifling & apply the butter... thinking it will protect the bore for the winter months. What happens is the butter cannot/does not displace moisture.... it rides right over the water sitting in the rifling channels & rust develops there over time.

If used properly & so far you have, Bore Butter/Wonderlube has protected miles of bores over the years even though it says right on the tube it is a bore rust inhibitor. Inhibit means to discourage.... that doesn't stop anything really. That's like saying I discourage you from voting for George Dubya Bush for President. That certainly isn't going to stop you from voting for him. So.. should you by chance make one lousy mistake with it while applying it to your bore after cleaning & you will pay dearly.... oops... I mean pay by means of rust.

Buy "gun oils"... not the cheap ones either. Buy ones that say they are "rust preventers". Good ones are Birchwood Casey Sheath, Breakfree CLP, Rem-Oil with Teflon... etc... according to their labels. After you are done cleaning, run a nice damp rubbing alcohol patch to remove the leftover moisture... then a couple of dry patches. Then run two oil patches. All this should be done with a bore brush because brushes reach into places jags don't.
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Old 10-20-2004, 12:05 PM
  #5  
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Default RE: Bore Butter causes rust??

I remove the breech plug, put the end in a bucket of soapy water, pump a patch up and down. Turn the barrel around and do the same. Then I run a presoaked patch of TC#13 up and down, in and out. Then I run a brush through a couple of times. Then an alcohol patch. Then I take a mop and liberally saturate it with BC Sheath and run it through till it drips out the ends. Then I run a dry patch thru to take up the excess BC Sheath. I do it again with a fresh dry patch to make sure it is dry. I install my cleaned and anti-seized plug.

The moisture is totally removed with the BC Sheath and then the excess Sheath is removed. I run the Sheath before installing the plug so no puddles form at the bottom of the barrel. I don't Sheath the plug. When I go to shoot I just run an alcohol patch to remove the thin film of Sheath that remained. Sounds complicated but takes 20 minutes at most.
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Old 10-20-2004, 12:33 PM
  #6  
Nontypical Buck
 
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Default RE: Bore Butter causes rust??

Cayugad,
Can you tell me what M.A.P. is?

Thanks
Steve
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Old 10-20-2004, 03:22 PM
  #7  
Dominant Buck
 
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Default RE: Bore Butter causes rust??

M.A.P. is a home made bore cleaner. It is a mixture of Murphy's Oil Soap, Isopropyl Alcohol and Hydrogen Peroxide in equal parts (actually I use a little less of the murphy's oil soap and more of the alcohol). This will really cut through the crud and fowling but you have to be careful when you use map. Be sure and wash the barrel out good with very hot soapy water, run some alcohol patches to displace any water on the metal and then oil all parts of the rifle with a very high quality gun oil such as Birchwood Casey Sheath or REM OIL with teflon.

The reason is the hydrogen peroxide as anyone who ever treated a cut finger with it knows, it has a bubbling action as it cleans. And it does in deed attack the grime, but it also attacks the metal. If you fail to oil the rifle it will be rusted within a few hours.

I keep a small bottle of it for soaking the breech plug, nipple and striker from the inline in while cleaning the barrel. Since they are stainess steel the MAP will clean the grime off them while I clean the barrel. Then all I have to do is wipe them down and re-oil them before replacing them in the rifle.

MAP is also good for when you have a barrel full of crud. Plug the breech or nipple port and pour that into the barrel and work it around. It will bubble all the crud out of the pores in the metal and rifling and get the barrel back to a very clean state. After that I hot soap and water the barrel and then solvent patch it, and of course oil the thing real well....
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Old 10-20-2004, 05:10 PM
  #8  
 
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Default RE: Bore Butter causes rust??

Natural Lube 1000 (bore butter) is, and has been, an outstanding lube for me in many TC Hawkens for many years and is the only thing I have and will use.
And I would agree if a bore is not properly dried that rust could form...but that's not any fault of the bore butter.
After a 100% hot soapy water cleaning & bone drying the bore, I pack bore butter very heavily...very heavily...into the bore and leave it there until the next time I go to the range or to hunt, dry patch out the excess and enjoy...worked perfectly for almost 15 years now.
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