cayugad

We have been reading and discussing a lot of about magnum powder charges lately. In fact inline rifles are often compared to center fire based on their ability to shoot magnum loads. I would like to get feed back from the shooters here that use inline rifles. Even traditional rifles if they fit into the group.

To set the guidelines for my question. We will consider a magnum powder charge equal to 150 grains or three pellets of powder OR 120 grains of loose powder, any brand or grain. I feel we need to stipulate the loose powder considerations as many do not shoot pellets for cost reasons or just personal preference. For any of you that care to comment, I would be most interested in your loads.

1. How many of you shoot magnum powder charges for hunting?
2. What rifle(s) do you shoot these magnum powder charges out of? ie; brand, model, barrel length
3. What projectile are you shooting when using magnum charges?
4. What ignition system are you shooting?
5. Is this a scoped rifle?
6. What animal are you hunting?
7. Do you feel this is a benifit with the magnum loads or is this the powder charge that gives you the best accuracy?
8. What do you feel is the max range you would be willing to shoot, if all things were perfect in relation to the shot?
9. Have you ever taken game with this load?
10. Have you ever missed with this load on game?
11. If you do not shoot MAGNUM CHARGES, what is the average non magnum powder charges, you do shoot in your rifles?

I will be interested to learn just how many of us do indeed shoot "magnum" charges. I apologize that I do not have the basic knowledge of the Savage ML10 to include smokeless, but if a Savage owner wished to enlighten me, I would me more then happy to include that as well.

I really do want to get an idea of the "average load" inline people shoot.

sabotloader

cayugad

Dave I do not shoot 150 grain loads - I have just to say that I have - but in the normal situation I do not..

My loads in the inlines are 100 to 110 T7-2f (loose) and 80 to 90 grains T7-3f (loose) in the side hammers - I do not think these qualify as magnum loads...

The inlines are all scoped -the Omega isscoped and barrel sights are removed, all the other inlines the scope can be removed and the barrel sights are sighted in also...

None of the sidehammers are scoped - the Lyman still has the original iron sights - while all of the others have fiber optic.

I was going to copy your questions over and answer each one but I felt disqualified because I do not shoot what I consider a mag load. - hope that makes sense...

OOPs forgot - I have taken my share of game with these loads - just wish I had started this ML thing was I younger... Ranges have been from 170+ yards down to 10 yards...

mike

wabi

I've tried magnum (3-pellet) charges in a T/C Omega, but couldn't see any real reason to use such a charge for hunting. At 200 yards it grouped barnes 300 gr Expanders pretty well (3 to 4" groups), but since most of my shots are under 100 yards I couldn't see the point of suffering the recoil that load produced.
Tried 120 grains of loose 3f in my Lyman Mustang today, and it says HELLO when you pull the trigger. [&:]

cayugad

1. How many of you shoot magnum powder charges for hunting?
2. What rifle(s) do you shoot these magnum powder charges out of? ie; brand, model, barrel length
3. What projectile are you shooting when using magnum charges?
4. What ignition system are you shooting?
5. Is this a scoped rifle?
6. What animal are you hunting?
7. Do you feel this is a benifit with the magnum loads or is this the powder charge that gives you the best accuracy?
8. What do you feel is the max range you would be willing to shoot, if all things were perfect in relation to the shot?
9. Have you ever taken game with this load?
10. Have you ever missed with this load on game?
11. If you do not shoot MAGNUM CHARGES, what is the average non magnum powder charges, you do shoot in your rifles?


1. I have never hunted with a magnum powder charge.
2. Knight Disc Rifle 24" barrel 120 grain of Pyrodex RS
Green Mountain 1:28 Renegade Stock 28" barrel 120 grains Pryodex RS
3. Knight Disc 250 grain Shockwave
Green Mountain 1:28 200 grain Hornady XTP 10mm
4. Knight orange disc primer system with Remington Kleenbore 209 Primers
Green Mountain 1:28 Barrel RWS 1075 #11 caps
5. Knight Disc - yes scoped with a Millet Gold Buck
Green Mountain 1:28 no scope
6. The dreaded paper bulls eye in both rifles. Again, never hunted animals with these loads
7. No real opinion as to the benifit. I would like to shoot a deer with either of them to see the effect.
8. Max range at this time would be limited to 100 yards with either rifle. I am not comfortable enough with the charges to shoot further then that.
9. NO
10. NO
11.Average inlines vary from 70-100 grains of powder. Tradtional range from 70-110 depending on rifle.


[hr]


Sabotloader, your answer was really something I was looking for. I have followed your posts and know the kinds of animals you hunt. Also I am a little familiar with your collection and it just amazes me that you do not see the need for magnum loads, even when huntng elk. This information of yours, tells me volumes of what works and what does not. Also I am aware of your experience with different bullets, sabots, etc so this is very good information to consider these questions.

After all they love to compare the inline to center fire rifles. Ballistically speaking, what center fire would you compare your hunting load muzzleloader to then?

Semisane

Neat thread you're starting here, cayugad. Ought to be interesting.

Here's my situation. Deer harvest rules for our club (10 guys / 900 acres southern pine plantation) are two does per member, one buck 6 or 7 points, and two bucks 8 points or better. Most of us take our two does for meat, pass on the 6 and 7 pointers, shoot the first 8 pointer we see, then only take a second buck if its better than the first one taken.

First off, let me say I want accuracy over velocity.

For the last nine years I've taken one of my does with a 50 caliberiron sightedcap lock TC New Englander with 90 grains Pyrodex RS or Select, and a 410 grain HornadyGreat Plains bullet. This is the most accurate load in that gun and clocks around 1050fps.My personal maximum range with this gun and load is 100 yards, though I've never shot a deer that far. Shots have ranged from 30 to 75 yards. Never lost a deer with this load. Never had one go more that about 50 yards after the shot, though most drop in their tracks.I'm real picky about my shots and won't shoot unless I have a good broadside (we have lots of does). Always have pass through. Missed once on a "below the ear" neck shot at about 35 yards. Don't know what the hell happened there, but I could swear I heard her laughing as she bounded away! I also think she yelled "you shoulda shot for the lungs dumbbutt!"

Next seasonI'm going to give the Lyman Mustang I bought this year a try.Got it because I wanted a scope sighted ML and - heck, I just wanted it. Anyway, so far the most accurate loads are in the 110 grain range with T-7 and 300 grain XTPs or Gold Dots. Still playing withvarious loads/sabots/bullets, etc. Will use whatever is most accurate and will stretch my comfort range to 150 yards.

cayugad

Semisane... real interesting. I understand the need for no magnum charges. So far I guess the theory of a magnum rifle is not holding water. That New Englander with that kind of powder and projectile has to be a deer thumper.

What center fire rifle would you compare your rifle to?

sabotloader

cayugad

I have said for years... If I put a scope on my 30-30 Win 94 and only one bullet in the chamber - my inlines are comparable to slighly better. But if I were hunting for meat to live by i would take the 30-30 all day - much better fire power and repetitive shots. If I take the scope off the inline and no scope on the 30-30 and one shot from each gun - they are very compatible.... one thing thats really makes the difference is I believe I have a better variety of more effective bullets that I can shoot in the ML than I can in a tubular magazine 30-30...

There are some folks out there that think with a regular inline they are comparable to an 06 - i call hogwash on that one, but unfortunately a lot of game departments hear this + the words "magnum ML" and think they need legislation to reduce the effectivness of the inline...

What are your thoughts?...

Wolfhound76

1. I have done so once on a hog. IMO "Magnum" charges are a waste of powder.

2. The one I did was a knight Extreme 26" barrel.

3. It was a Barnes 250 MZ.

4. Standard Winchester 209 in a red disc.

5. Yep. It was a 2-7X32 Bushnell Elite 3200. I was hunting woods so I wanted more field of view with the 2X.

6. Russian Boar

7. I just wanted more punch. A buddy of mine in Texas believes they are a hard kill. I didn't want to take a chance on not bringing enough gun. In hindsight I probably shouldn't have bothered with the mag charge.

8. My shot was 35 yds IIRC.

9. 1 Russian boar.

10. No. I needed 1 shot only.

11. Average for most of my shooting is 90-100 gr although for my pistol it's 60 gr. I'm not a big fan of heavy charges but I made an exception for this one hunt.

Semisane

If you're talking about myNew Englander load, I'd compare it to the factory load 45-70 for "old original actions". As sabotloader says, a 30-30 beats it any day, as I consider a 30-30 a 150 yard rifle (175 extreme) and the New Englander a 100 yard rifle (125 extreme).

cayugad

I used to be asked by a lot of new shooters as to what kind of power they can expect from their new muzzleloader. I always told them, a 30-30 would be where I would put it. I have to agree with you guys.

Now Wolfhound's information is real interesting. I consider him a Knight Rifle answer all my questions. If he does not see the need for magnum charges, especially in a Knight, that really sparks my interest. On that big russian boar, did you get complete pass through? What center fire would you compare that load you shot.. to?

Didn't Jim Shockey in his Knight years simply use 100 grains of Pyrodex RS and a Nosler bullet? I mean face it, he hunted moose (one hunt of his I watched was most exciting), bear, you name it, and always his Knight. I think that was a Disc but would not swear to it. Then he had that Revolution that I often wondered if he really liked.

So far people, we are not much for the high power magnum muzzleloaders we were described as by some and in many magazines of course.