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Got my soil sample, got some questions

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Old 04-14-2004 | 07:36 PM
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Default Got my soil sample, got some questions

I own some acreage along a river in western MI. There is an open area of an acre or so on a ridge at the edge of my property. It's pretty sandy stuff, as is a lot of soil around here. Turns out it is pretty crappy soil as well. The elevator called today with my results:
Ph = 5.3
npk are all low by an order of magnitude.

The soil specialist recommended about a ton of lime at $170 along with a custom mix of fertilizer at around $50.

I'm landlocked by about 200 acres of hayfields on one side of my property woods on the other two, and I have to cross a river to get to it. I don't have a tractor. Although the farmer who owns the fields is a hunter and I have a good relationship with him (he has given me permission to take my truck back), he isn't interested in doing any work for me.

When I mentioned to the soil person about putting it on myself, she acted like I was nuts. I see some other people mentioning that they have put down lime from a pickup. My plan is to pull something around with my truck to break up the soil and also to use a push broadcaster to put down the fertilizer and finally seed. Will this work out ok?

I found some information from a guy in the area who used the following mix:

SCN900 Rape Seed (Canola) 5.25 lbs $3.50
SCN205 Chicory (high mineral) 1.05 lb $7.60
SCL310 Clover, Crimson 1.05 lb $1.90
SCL320 Clover, Ladino 1.05 lb $3.90
SCL305 Clover, Berseem 1.05 lb $2.30
SCL300 Clover, Alsike 1.05 lb $4.20
SCL370 Clover, Sweet White Annual, raw 1.05 lb $1.70
SCL006 Alfalfa, Winter Dormant, raw 1.05 lb $4.60
SCL200 Birdsfoot Trefoil, Broadleaf 1.05 lb $2.80

My hope is that a) I'm using a mix that has worked well for another person in the same region, so my chances are better. b) With a nice mix of foods I increase my chances that something will take and hopefully I'll get a variety of foods throughout the season. c) A mix of plants breaking down will help enrich the soil.

Been doing a lot of reading on this, but I'm wondering if you think this specific plan will work?

Thanks for any comments.
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Old 04-14-2004 | 08:06 PM
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Boone & Crockett
 
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Default RE: Got my soil sample, got some questions

Welcome to the board. Not sure if I have all your answers, but first the $170 per ton for lime sounds extremely high. Check with your local agriculture center and see if they have a tag-a-long trailer with a live bottom you can rent with a load of lime for your field. Ours has them for $15 per day plus the lime. I would look into renting a tractor and disc for a day. Surely there is a rental center somewhere around. You don't say how big your food plot is, but if it is an acre or more it is going to be hard on your pickup to do much with breaking up your soil and I don't think it will be worth the time. Really it won't be a lot of money for the results. Any time you can find a seed mixture that works in your area it is probably worth while. The hand crank cyclone seeders you sling on your shoulder works well for seed and fertilizer on small patches.
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Old 04-14-2004 | 08:46 PM
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Default RE: Got my soil sample, got some questions

was the lime pelleted lime?....ag lime would be closer to 10 bucks a ton...
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Old 04-14-2004 | 08:48 PM
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From: Western MO
Default RE: Got my soil sample, got some questions

SCN900 Rape Seed (Canola) 5.25 lbs $3.50
SCN205 Chicory (high mineral) 1.05 lb $7.60
SCL310 Clover, Crimson 1.05 lb $1.90
SCL320 Clover, Ladino 1.05 lb $3.90
SCL305 Clover, Berseem 1.05 lb $2.30
SCL300 Clover, Alsike 1.05 lb $4.20
SCL370 Clover, Sweet White Annual, raw 1.05 lb $1.70
SCL006 Alfalfa, Winter Dormant, raw 1.05 lb $4.60
SCL200 Birdsfoot Trefoil, Broadleaf 1.05 lb $2.80
Canola...annual
Crimson clover..annual that is a southern plant
Chicory...grows wild in MO and is a weed that is a bugger...id never plant it...I have acres of it and ive never seen anything eat it if there was anything else available.
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Old 04-14-2004 | 09:28 PM
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Default RE: Got my soil sample, got some questions

The price of lime will vary according how far it has to be hauled to get to your Coop. 2 Coops in my area charge $20 and $24 per ton. Try and get the finest grind available. Works quicker. I would suggest planting 3-4 different things in strips. Put a monitor cage in each and see what the deer will go for. Put in more next year of what they go for and cut out any that don't fare well. It may take a couple of years to get a decent plot with soil in that condition.

Russ
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Old 04-14-2004 | 09:52 PM
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Typical Buck
 
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Default RE: Got my soil sample, got some questions

a ton of lime at $170? did he tell you to bend over and grab your ankles next?

$50 for one acres worth of fertilizer? did he tell you to touch your toes after grabbing your ankles?

those prices seem astronomical. when i had my first soil test done a few years ago, my P was 2 ppm (next to non-existant). now it around 28-35, depending on what part you test. K was moderate, and now it's around 160 ppm. i had a test 2 months ago.

for a 1 acre plot, you can get (at least around here) a 5 gallon bucket of DAP (18-46-0) for $5, same thing for K (0-0-60) and N (44-0-0) from the co-op. spread that stuff with a baby buggy type spreader, it's not that difficult. i did it on several acres my first year. i weighed the buckets with the fertilzer. 5 gallons of N is around 44 lbs, 5 gallons of DAP is around 52 lbs, K is about 60 lbs. that is total weight, not actual weight.

as far as lime goes, i would get .5~1.0 ton (depending on your pickup capacity) and spread it out the back with a leaf blower while another person drives. ag lime is $6/ton here at the quarry.

working up the soil, you're s.o.l. there. trying to do it with a pickup is going to be futile. do you or anyone you know have an ATV? you can build some kind of drag/harrow/scarifier for about 30 bucks and tow it behind. use lots of weight.

before you start doing all the groundwork. spray the aread down with generic roundup (glyphosate), 2-3% soln. if you can get a few gallons of liquid fert to use as a carrier for the roundup, you are saving yourself a few steps. you'll still need a 2-3 gallon pump type sprayer. they're about 20 bucks. do not spray 2-4d.
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Old 04-15-2004 | 06:28 AM
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Default RE: Got my soil sample, got some questions

I'm back at work and have my notes.

The lime was actually $107 per ton. I assume that it must be pelletized.

The other numbers were ( I assume these are in ppm? ):

Potassium (recommended range of 250-300) was 43, recommended 400# of potash for $34.
Magnesium (recommended range of 200) was 69, recommended 150# for $15.
Phosphourous was ok.
Calcium was ok and would be increased by the lime.

I don't have anything in my notes for nitrogen. I'll ask her again.

Woodust, noted your opinion on three of the plants. The reading I have done on Crimson indicates that it will do okay in colder climates if you plant it in early spring. Also indicates that it grows well in well-drained sandy soils. I assume that is why he originally added it to the list. I'm definitely going to go with the Canola eventhough it is an annual. I've heard too many good things about it firsthand. I might drop the chicory idea, tough.

I don't understand why I could not work up the soil with a truck if I could with an ATV. It's a really sandy mix with just a little low-grass and weeds growing on it. Doesn't look to me like it would take much to break it up. I was also thinking about planting a couple of patches in buckwheat to help break in the soil a little?

Thanks all for the advice on lime. Looks like I definitely need to check around on prices.
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Old 04-15-2004 | 03:12 PM
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Nontypical Buck
 
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Default RE: Got my soil sample, got some questions

alsike is a biannual
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