And the outfitter called this hunting........
 

I was on my lunch break and happened to see this truck next to me that had an outfitter advertizment on it. We'll call it "Slob" for fear of liable and slander!

I walk over to the "Slob" and introduce myself and inquire about his services. He proceeds to tell me that he operates a 400 acre high fenced ranch that's just chalk full of record book bucks. As the "Slob" begins explaining his set up and prices I'm blown away.

He proceeds to tell me his hunts are guaranteed, no kill, no fee and that many of his deer are already purchased. He sends out videos of deer and lets you choose which one you want to shoot. In addition, he says he is really set up for the bow hunter because the animals are so docile that he can get them to come in really close.

Now, I had to open my big mouth and tell him what I thought, thus starting a huge blow out. He starts yelling at me about how tough it is to even see bucks of this quality, it's well worth the money, 7500 for a 150 class buck, and bla bla bla.

I'm blown away with what some people consider hunting. To me this is like shooting them in a pen.

Had to vent a little.
Thanks

RE: And the outfitter called this hunting........
 

I would never do it personally but some people would like to and that is there choice. That guy is just trying to make a living and doesn't need anyone telling him whats right or wrong when he is succesfully raking in that much money, or even if he wasn't making money it doesn't matter. He is not taking away from your deer herd. Doing that to him is the same thing as antis harrassing us hunters. I do not think it would be fun for me and would not do it but i respect their opinions and let them do what they want.

RE: And the outfitter called this hunting........
 

WOW,I cant believe that anyone wants to shoot a deer (in a 400 acre pen,loaded with big big bucks)for 7500$.I also cant believe the response from "thenuge15" ,these are the guys (outfitters)that spread CWD! Outfitters are fair chace hunters ,in my opinion,who know how to put their clients in an area for an opertunity to "see" a trophy buck.This guy that txbohntr is talkin about is "NOT" an outfitter!!

RE: And the outfitter called this hunting........
 

Presonally I have to agree with thenuge15 ,What someone raises on thier own property is thier business . Just because you don't agree doesn't make it wrong . Thier are a lot of people that don't agree with hunting in general ,but that doesn't make them right either only in thier minds .

RE: And the outfitter called this hunting........
 

I see nothing wrong with raising deer, BUT i see ALOT of things wrong with letting people shoot them inside a pen, and 7500 for a 150class bucks is overpriced in my opinion, i mean sure thats a really big buck but it seems they are getting to be more common, i penned hunt saps everything out of the "hunt" except the antlers and thats all these guys are after, and ill admit i dont keep the meat from my deer i give it to friends or neighbors and i am really just after the anlter but i would never kill a deer or any other creature inside a cage,

"She said if I hit that fishin hole today, she's be packin all her things and she'd, be gone by noon....I'm gonna miss her, when I get home."

RE: And the outfitter called this hunting........
 

i know of spots that have 150 class bucks on PA state game lands! 150 class buck..thats nothing these days...ive seen a few 150+ers and im only 15...never in rifle season while hunting but ive seen them on public land and one for sure over 150 on state game lands...! and 400 acres is truely nothing for todays standards....my uncle has a farm its 400 acres and it is pretty small...i cant believe he comes out and said it like that...high fenced...deer bought...thats just sick...someone pays 7500 and shoots a 150class buck which is a nice trophy...hang it on the wall and you never know they took it like that...sick....now the huge huge farms with now fences..ect just well fed deer and maybe the farmer lets you pay him so much to hunt his land i can see...that to me is still fair chase...even though you payed for the hunt you still had to hunt and there wernt any fences and no bought deer...thats my view...

RE: And the outfitter called this hunting........
 

I probably would have reacted the same way txbowhntr did!

And speaking of the "anti's" , that type of fenced in slaughter is exactly the type of fuel that adds flame to their fire.

"Nocked,cocked & ready to rock"

RE: And the outfitter called this hunting........
 

txbowhntr-thenuge has made a good point,to each his own!!I know that i dont like being bothered by the anti's marching arount parking lots yelling at me about hunting.I'm sure the outfitter feels the same way.We have to respect each other.


And i dont think it's fair to lay blame on high fence hunting for CWD.If we start pointing fingers,where does it stop?After baiting,food plots,feeders have all been banned.Our game population has increased considerablly.Is'nt it natures way,it was long before i was born.If you think about it.Its probobly us hunters who spread it,going to an infected area shooting game bringing it back home,then infecting animals here.Nobody wants to take the blame for it.I had a guy from N Dakota tell me yesterday that Fish and Wildlife Services in Co. turned many PEN raised elk loose into the wild several years ago.

One thing is for sure....This is going to bring new laws into effect.Outfitters will have to test there animals.The buying and selling of animals will be watched more closely.We all need to join togather to beat this disease instead of standing devided on who's to blame.


It's not how big the Deer,But the size of the experiance that matters!!

RE: And the outfitter called this hunting........
 

I have no knowledge of high fence hunting. Never did it, never care to. I do have a friend who has a 100 acre high fence for raising whitetails, no hunting though. I do know this....those deer in that 100 acre pen are more spooky than deer in the wild. It is tough to even get a glimpse of them without having my buddy circle around while I hide. They want no part of humans.

NRA,UBP,BASS Member
New Stanton,PA

RE: And the outfitter called this hunting........
 

Frankly, this thread sounds like it was created by peta-heads and anti's, for petaheads and anti's. The idea is to get all to react, so they can record the response and also to have fun. Careful what you say, the forum is open to anyone. Dissection, upheaval in the ranks and incremental reduction is their goal. Word to your mother.....earth that is........... We hunters invented conservation and are it's greatest champions!!!!!

RE: And the outfitter called this hunting........
 

hmmm. Thenuge15 i think your either related to the guy or having an affair with him. Mauser06--(150 class buck..thats nothing these days...ive seen a few 150+ers and im only 15..) That quote could be either the stupidest or just most ignorant thing i've heard. Considering the majority of whitetail bucks can't even score into p&y. And from your eye it could be a 150 class buck but in reality your eye measures far over what they really score. Especially when your 15. I think Txbowhntr did a perfect job in confronting this outfitter/moron. His prices and ideas of hunting are bogus and rightfully so should be addressed to him with no misunderstandings. Nice job Txbowhntr (I might have hit him in the face for raising his voice but overall nice job). Also for this comment thenuge15 made(Doing that to him is the same thing as antis harrassing us hunters) There is a difference between slaughter and sport. When a hunter is upset about something involving this issue you know something isn't right.

RE: And the outfitter called this hunting........
 

Hey txbowhntr.....Are you PETA?.LOL

People Eating Tasty Animals

It's not how big the Deer,But the size of the experiance that matters!!

RE: And the outfitter called this hunting........
 

Daily you make absolutely no sense in your post. If i am related to the guy or having an supposed offair with him than why am i disagreeing with high fence hunting. My point was just cause you don't believe in something doesn't mean you harras everyone that does not do it the exact same way as you do. I am glad most of you agree with me.

RE: And the outfitter called this hunting........
 

Ehat this so called outfitter is doing is simply selling a deer.This is the same as buying a cow or a pig from a rancher but certainly is not hunting.

RE: And the outfitter called this hunting........
 

Well, if you want to try to be little me by saying i made no sence. If you dont understand me then you obviously have a lack of educations Explain to me what you meant by the following. (harras) or (offair). Also who ever said anything about being exact i dont think theres many hunters out there that hunt the exact same way. If you dont understand my sarcasim I have no time to teach you the greater study of modern day humor. Also I wouldn't waste your time on another attempt of belittling my intelligence. You've been known to be bad at explaining yourself thoroughly.

RE: And the outfitter called this hunting........
 

You can't call that hunting...

RE: And the outfitter called this hunting........
 

montex i think thats already been addressed.

RE: And the outfitter called this hunting........
 

I can see where this is going

It's not how big the Deer,But the size of the experiance that matters!!

RE: And the outfitter called this hunting........
 

i raise a few deer for myself just to be able to watch them and see the kids eyes light up when they come and help feed them.ocasionally i go to a deer auction and see you see these so called outfitters come in to buy their bucks,usualy if the buck is docile he won't bring to much money,but let a buck come in and try jumping over fence and start acting wild and all those called outfitters go crazy.it's as close to a wild buck they are going to get.it is beyond me why somebody would want to shoot a buck that has been pen raised all of its life.

RE: And the outfitter called this hunting........
 

I was talking to a small business taxidermist the other day and noticed he had a number of Corsican rams to be mounted. He said he got 32 ram heads from a pen in the Mobile, Al area. The pen is 80 acres and no telling how many heads other taxidermy shops got from the same pen. He said they also have other species available in the same pen. That ain't hunting.

RE: And the outfitter called this hunting........
 

I was not trying to belittle your intellegence I stating that you misread my post.

RE: And the outfitter called this hunting........
 

hey thanks for the help daily, but I'm just stating my opinion as everyone else did in this post

RE: And the outfitter called this hunting........
 

Yeah Carpet I'm PETA- people eating tasty animals! LOL

Grouperhead- The purpose of this post wasn't to cause dissention in the ranks. Simply put is was a post about an experience I had. I was not rude to this outfitter, nor did I belittle him, I did however question the hunt when he said the "deer are so DOCILE I can really get them in close". I'll question anyone who hunts in a 400 acre pen. Hell, he said half of it is open so in reality you're only hunting 200 acres with feeding stations, pit and tower blinds, 5-6 hunters, etc. Seems more like shooting to me.

In the future, before you pass judgment, find out who your talking to. I'll put my days afield against yours any day.

RE: And the outfitter called this hunting........
 

Could you imagine walking into some guys house, and seeing a huge buck on his wall and asking him about it, and hearing he shot it at an operation like that?

It was a cold clear morning and I welcomed the sun as it crept over the ten foot chain link fence.The silence was broken by a red tailed hawk and the feeder turning on.I scanned the woods for any movement and then I saw it an ear tag slowly moving my way.lol.

To each his own, but if I'm spending $7,500 to huntI'll go some place wild.

RE: And the outfitter called this hunting........
 

Well heck there is just as much sport and pride in that type of harvesting(I refuse to call it hunting)as me going down to a cattle ranch, hanging my stand on the side of the barn and picking off a heifer coming in to feed. I bet the rancher would charge less also.

The Tazman aka Martin Price
Founder and President of
Virginia Disabled Outdoorsmen Club

RE: And the outfitter called this hunting........
 

Well I don't see how 400 acres could be a pen. That's a healthy chunk of real estate right there.

Hey Tx, I know exactly what you are talking about and I think I would of felt the same way BUT for everyone to say that high fenced hunting is not hunting is rediculous. Just because a deer lives its entire life behind a game fence, does not mean that it is a pet. I HUNTED behind a high fence operation and it was an experience I will never forget. It was a 5,000 acre ranch and the deer were truely wild. I ended up coming home empty handed. The hunting was no different than hunting my 300 acre spread out of Madisonville exept of one thing. The bucks I saw on the high fenced ranch were 3 times bigger but the number of bucks I saw was the same as hunting my 300 acre low fenced operation. <u>The hunting was the same but the quality of bucks was different.</u> I think the sales pitch the guy gave you would not have impressed me one bit and I would of said no thanks. What I have a problem with is everyone throwing all high fenced operations into one box. There are some dang good ones out there where it is deffinately fair chase. Heck, alot of them don't even have feeders on them. Cahrlie P is a good example. He basically throws all high fenced hunts into one box and I bet you he has never hunted behind a high fence. Am I right Charlie?

Daily, lighten up a little. No ones out to get ya.

****I'd rather be a fence post in Texas than a corn boy in Ohio****

RE: And the outfitter called this hunting........
 

What a sore point. We all do have some degree of tolerance , it is a matter of where your personel taste draws the line. The money gig is strange to me that some people have a if costs to much its not sporting attitudes. How about a fly in for 20k or more. Try Siberia for polar bear. 20k for a liscense. Wonder what a Tiger liscense costs. They do exist!! WHERE DO YOU DRAW THE LINE is the real quandery.

RE: And the outfitter called this hunting........
 

Johnny,No I didn't lump them together I stated <BLOCKQUOTE id=quote<font size=1 face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>Could you imagine walking into some guys house, and seeing a huge buck on his wall and asking him about it, and hearing he shot it at an operation like that? <hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote></font id=quote><font face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' size=2 id=quote>An operartion &quot;like that&quot; not one like your talking about.

In many other threads I have stated I have no problem with large operations.If I have to I'll find them and post them.

What seperates the type of operation you hunted at, and this one?This statement from the owner does it for me <BLOCKQUOTE id=quote><font size=1 face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>He proceeds to tell me his hunts are guaranteed, no kill, no fee and that many of his deer are already purchased. He sends out videos of deer and lets you choose which one you want to shoot. In addition, he says he is really set up for the bow hunter because the animals are so docile that he can get them to come in really close. <hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote></font id=quote><font face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' size=2 id=quote>

You asked a question and I'll answer it. No I have never hunted behind a high fence.Would I ? It would depend on the place.I would hunt at some of the places that I have checked out.Large parcels that allow the deer to breed and feed naturally.Places that don't guarentee me a kill or let me pick out the deer before I get there.Places that are wild.That's why I also said this <BLOCKQUOTE id=quote><font size=1 face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>To each his own, but if I'm spending $7,500 to huntI'll go some place wild. <hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote></font id=quote><font face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' size=2 id=quote>

Would I hunt at a place like this operation? Not if you paid for it?

Do you still think I'm a good example?

RE: And the outfitter called this hunting........
 

Ha ha dont worry about me im just good at arguments. Which can be good, but really the only reason im being subservient is because people that lack knowledge in certain things pertaining to hunting they should be obsequious to those who have it.

txbowhntr qoute: (in n the future, before you pass judgment, find out who your talking to. I'll put my days afield against yours any day.)

As will I...............

RE: And the outfitter called this hunting........
 

Personally, I wouldn't do it. One reason is that $7500 is a lot of truck payments, but it is legal in many states (Texas <u>and</u> others.) What the guy does within the confines of the law is his business. If I don't agree with it, he won't get any $'s from me.
We oughtta have some real &quot;trigger topics&quot; to drive more wedges within the hunting community. [/sarcasm] <font size=1>...fng 2002</font id=size1>

Baiting + blinds + caliber + compound bows + crossbows + dogs + drives + electronic calls + feeders + fences + longbows + pistols + any other controversial issues that escape me at the moment = <font size=4>Wanna Fight??</font id=size4> <img src=icon_smile_dissapprove.gif border=0 align=middle><img src=icon_smile_blackeye.gif border=0 align=middle><img src=icon_smile_8ball.gif border=0 align=middle>

Edited by - GoTres on 09/05/2002 15:52:30

RE: And the outfitter called this hunting........
 

This thread really just shows me that you can't lump everything into one catagory. Different circumstances can make big differences in what is hunting and what is harvesting!
I was invited to go on a hog bow hunt a few weeks back. It ended up being a high fenced, 250 acre area. These animals were fed, not from feeders but from a truck or 4 wheelers. These animals were practically tame, and came out to the sound of vehicles, instead of shying away from them. I feel that this was &quot;harvesting&quot;,&quot; not &quot;hunting!&quot;
I did not like this and will not go back!
On one hand, this is no different than going to a butcher shop, so if that is what you want to do and it is legal then go for it! Just don't try to pedal this off as &quot;hunting&quot; or try to tell people of your great &quot;trophy!&quot;
On the other hand people that do pedal this off as &quot;trophy hunting&quot; are disgusting, and they do disgrace true sport hunting!
Then, as I said different circumstances call for different conclusions!
Such as, hunting a 5000 to 10,000 acre high fenced ranch, were the animals are not &quot;tame&quot; IS hunting! These wild animals can be as hard to hunt as animals on open range land!
5 to 10,000 acres is a lots of territory and a WILD animal that does not want to be seen, could go for years without being shot!
So, you can't just say that ALL high fenced hunting is bad, or even ALL baiting is bad! It just depends.....
Frank

RE: And the outfitter called this hunting........
 

Sounds like an antlered version of a stocked fish pond to me. What the hell, if somebody wants to burn up a bunch of cash to kill a penned animal, what should I care. However, I absolutely, positively could not respect them as a hunter.

RE: And the outfitter called this hunting........
 

Hey Txbowhntr, I appologize sincerely, I am truly sorry for what I said, that was cruel to accuse you of such an aweful existence, I really feel bad. I would be completely irrate myself, please accept this public apology.

I have just seen so many threads like this started by trolls that come on outdoors websites and get all #ell broke loose. Before anyone realizes it, they been took.

Now about that challenge...hummm...how about you come down to Florida and hunt in my favorite spot and I go to Texas to your favorite spot...hehehe...and we see who gets the most deer in a season! It ain't even that funny man, this place is HHHARD to hunt.

I wish I had half the kinda hunting you guys have over there. We're working hard to get things going with the state game commission here and it looks like they may have finally come to the table with some serious thought about actually managing the deer herd. QDM or not, at least their starting to look at why the hunters are leaving the state.

Our buck to doe ratio on public land is anywhere from 1:10 up to 1:20, little or no visible rut and hunted so hard, the times I've seen mature bucks walk out in the open like you see in Bill Jordan videos, can be counted on one hand in 20yrs. They hug cover like spandex in a fat womans buttcrack. We have this stuff called the scrubs(20 foot tall, push thru thick, scrub oak) and they live in it. Similar to what I see in Texas video's minus any sendero's.

Anyway, I apologize. All you had to say to hurt me where it counts was, &quot;I hunt in Texas and you don't&quot;hehehe...Good hunting and may your aim be true to its mark.

Phillip Griggs Moss Bluff, Florida

RE: And the outfitter called this hunting........
 

Well, when a guy thinks killing docile animals is a good thing while equating it IN ANY WAY with sport, I say the guy and what he does are both danged pathetic. I don't care if it is legal. Now don't get me wrong. There is nothing wrong at all with Mr. Purdue raising and then slaughtering chickens. But should he ever call himself a bird hunter I'm gonna think he's pretty doggone pathetic.

RE: And the outfitter called this hunting........
 

My biggest problem with that type of operation is that it is referred to as hunting. And when these type of &quot;hunts&quot; are shown and talked about by the media, it hurts the rest of us. The guys who pay for those type of operations, and the guys that own them could care less how true hunting is affected.

-Man who fight with wife all day get no piece at night-

RE: And the outfitter called this hunting........
 

well.. I don't have any use personnaly for fenced hunt's, but I don't see much difference between fenced hunt's and hunt's where you sit your lazy butt in a blind and wait for the feeder to go off, as far as I'm concerned you don't have any more bragging right's to that rack then you would from a fenced hunt. In my opinion any hunt that involves feeding or feeder's , other than planted food plot's is just a tad harder than then choosing your meat at a supermarket, go ahead boy's take your best shot !! usahunter

2-Gun

RE: And the outfitter called this hunting........
 

The individuals that shoot deer this way probably hang them on the wall and bragg about a great hunt.I could never be proud of taking an animal this way.

RE: And the outfitter called this hunting........
 

appparently the high fence ranch is a big business down here in texas, mostly because the quality of our wild deer sucks horribly. the operation that tx was talking about sounds like nothing like a real hunt, but some of the other high fence ranches are more like real hunting....i think....

RE: And the outfitter called this hunting........
 

If the guy is charging $7500 for a 150 class whitetail, and gettign customers, there must be a demand for this &quot;service&quot;.
Whould I do it? No. But if the guy is raising his deer in his fence, and wants to have people shoot them, fine.....matterialistic, but fine. It IS a free (somewhat free at least) country.
Keeping his deer in his fence should not spread CWD...but they SHOULD be tested for when one DOES leave (harvested).
Kinda sounds like going to the farm and shooting a cow (gonna mount that?).
It's sad that people WILL pay that kind of cash to shoot &quot;docile&quot; animals. I would suspect that these are the same types who buy Harley Davidson Jackets, but have no bike....they just want that image.
Could you imagine the humiliation if you were to claim you got that on a &quot;real&quot; hunt ...then your buddies found out you shot it in that manner?
Don't like it. Don't want it. But it ain't my business HOW he wants to kill his deer (key word...HIS)

RE: And the outfitter called this hunting........
 

Ya thats what I think of high fence hunting...ALL high fence hunting.