I'm going to have to stop bowhunting! My arrow only travels 300 fps and only carries about 70 lbs. of kinetic energy to the intended target. Come on, I have shot deer with compound bows, 50 caliber muzzleloaders, 30-30's as a kid, and currently a 30-06 and a 300 win mag. If I do my job and put the arrow/bullet through the boiler room, I'm in for a drag job. Comparing the 30-06 and the 300 win mag, I have not seen any measureable difference between the two when shooting a deer. The main advantage IMO is the extra yards the 300 mag will allow me should I need it.

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Edited by - VAhuntr on 12/16/2002 20:11:40

your arrow only goes 300 fps but how far are you shooting 20'30 yrds not 100'200 yrds.

Before we get into this whole "bow vs gun" thing let's realize that you are talking apples and oranges. Guns kill through bullet impact causing massive tissue trauma and hydrostatic shock. Bows on the other hand simply send a razor blade through internal organs causing massive hemmoraging. The bow doesn't need that much kinetic energy to do its job.

I knew that would get some responses! My point is so many hunters think that a magnum rifle just makes deer drop right in their tracks. I agree that using a rifle and a bow to take game with are two different ballgames. What I was trying to point out is you can compare numbers all you want in fps or ft lbs of energy but if you put that projectile(bullet or arrow) through the vital organs you have scored.

A bullet also causes blood loss does'nt it? I always thought a bullet destroyed tissue/organs causing massive blood loss. I'm by no means a ballistics expert, all I know when comparing the effectiveness of a 30-06 to a 300 win mag(a 270 and 7mm rem mag are close too) the difference seems to be non-exsistent. I'm sure I would notice the difference if I were shooting elk or moose or shooting at longer ranges but whitetail's are not built like these animals nor do I shoot at them at extreme ranges.

I'm by no means against magnum rifles, heck I own and hunt with one sometimes but for the deer hunting I do in North Carolina and Virginia the average deer is not huge and the shots are usally less than 100 yards.

Edited by - VAhuntr on 12/16/2002 22:24:06

VAhuntr-The deer in your area are small and your shots may be mostly under 100 yards but in alberta and saskatchewan bucks often exceed 300 lbs on the hoof and shots can be quite long in our open fields.A cartridge that seems like overkill in your area may to perfectly suited to other conditions.

stubblejumper- I will agree with what you are saying. Will a well placed shot from a 270/30-06 class rifle not take down a 300 pound buck? In comparing numbers, just how much more range would a 7mm rem mag and a 300 win mag have over the 270 and 30-06? This is a good question for yall that know ballistics much better than I.

I shot a 338 weatherby for 3 years before chunking it.Killed alot of deer with it but it was too much gun for deer,too much noise for my ears,and too much recoil for my shoulder.Now the only advantages a magnum has over a standard round is more energy down range and my 257 Roberts is good out to 400 yards,of course I would never take a shot that far,and I also think that anyone who can't get closer than 400 yards shouldn't call themselves a hunter.Now for moose you need a magnum but for deer....anything between a 243 and 30-06 is plenty.

It's the operator that messes up....not the equipment.Have confidence in yourself and shoot straight.

VAhuntr-The 30-06,270 or most other cartridges will kill a 300 lb deer just fine with a perfect hit at 400 yards.My 7mmstw shoots quite a bit flatter than the 270 or 30-06 and also is less effected by the wind we often get in the open fields.This combination makes the odds of a perfect hit higher and the extra power is handy for when a hit is not quite perfect.My farthest kill(measured with a laser rangefinder)was 480 yards with a few more over 400 yards and the 7mmstw I now use or 257wby that I used to hunt deer with do make these shots a higher percentage proposition than if I was to use a 270 or 30-06.For the record my average shot is probably 200 yards or so but when a deer is spotted in a flat open field with no cover for a stalk the ability to shoot much further is definitely an advantage.

Edited by - stubblejumper on 12/16/2002 23:18:30

You ain't got to worry about me trying a 400 yard shot.....although if I practiced it, it would definately be a fun challenge. I've always read that the 7mm STW was pretty awesome. How does it compare to the 7mm Remington Ultra Mag? I guess I enjoy getting close to the game I am hunting. I hear Alabama has a spear season.....I would actually like to give that a try.

VAhuntr-I actually own two 7mm stw's,a 7mm ultra and two 300ultras.I only see about 50 to 75fps advantage with the 7mm ultra over the 7mmstw's and I use the stw's for all my deer,pronghorn and sheep hunting because both are a little moe accurate than my 7mm ultra.I use the 7mm ultra for long range shooting practise and the 300 ultras for hunting elk and moose.