How was dinner?

Jeff, I' d be interested in hearing some of those thoughts. After BT Kevin' s comments on the ' 04 Pat being almost as smooth as the liberty, I looked at the paper- Both 33" ata (axle this time ) 1/2" difference in brace. Assuming the 80# liberty does 15 fps more than the 70# numbers Kevin posted, their performance is about identical.

Was there something(s) specific about that made you choose the Freedom over the Infinity?

In the end, I hope to be able to draw both and come to my own conclusions, but if the 80# liberty draws like the 70# pat, I may just have to go with a 70# liberty to get the same numbers of the 60# pat...

It' s gonna be a busy spring

Very good Thank You. Twas a good night for Bacon & Eggs w/ Toast & Peach Jelly. I cook a mean breakfast if I do say so myself

Well, first of all I' m assuming what you meant is that the same arrow weight is used for an 80 pound Liberty as compared to a 70 pound Pat SC. At say 5 grains per pound, the Pat SC will still be the faster bow, apples to apples. I think you should compare grains per pound...not X arrow weight in grains out of a 70 pound and the same arrow weight out of another bow @ 80. I' m sure that IF I shot a 80 pound Liberty w/ a 350 grain arrow it would exceed the 70 pound Pat SC' s IBO speed by a pretty big margin. The BT cams are super efficient the lighter the arrow gets

As to Kevin' s comments. He should know..he designed them I have not even shot them yet. I' ve heard how the new I-cam is smoother and quicker and what they did to obtain that improvement. Were the Liberty not available, I would be shooting another I-cam bow on a Patriot or whatever else. But even if the Pat SC is an 8 for smooth draw, and the Liberty is only a 9, I wanted the smoother bow for reasons I' ll go into below.

Absolutely. The smoother draw force curve,and the advice of someone whom I trust 110% who has shot the bow in question already I' ve been looking for the right 80 pounder for a few years, and after some discussion, I felt I finally may have the smooth drawing/shooting 80 pounder with the specs I want. I' ve tried some other cam designs at 80 pounds and it was a definite " not for me" experience. After asking some " tough" questions, I came away satisfied that the Liberty would most likely fit the bill.

Personally I also prefer the larger idler wheel. It better matches the size of the cam for better nock travel, and also creates the " illusion" of a longer axle to axle bow in the feel department (greater string angle). While I don' t have a prob with the smaller idler on the I-cam bows and nock travel has not been an issue for me because I know how to avoid any problems it may cause, I still prefer the larger version because of the string angle issue.

As well you should

Yes, I was comparing them based on the same arrow weight, which I would use out of each. I realize that would put the Liberty shooting less grains per pound than the Patriot, but with a 450 grain arrow, I' d still be good to go, 5.6 grains per # for the 80# Liberty versus 6.4 for the 70# Patriot... I understand grains per pound v grains per pound, the Patriot is faster, due to it' s 1/2" less brace and more aggressive cam.

I do plan to shoot both. I' m about to call the local dealer to see when he might be ordering new bowtechs. We have no large shops in our area, inventory is usually pretty limited...

Jeff, what were you able to find out regarding draw length and let off adjustability of the Freedom cam?

I hope you don' t mind me buttin in on ya.

I hope this is what you' re asking about.... The Freedom cam has 1/2" draw increments and the let off is adjustable same as the Infinity cam.

Butt in all you want

So the Freedom cam lacks the minute draw length adjustability of the I cam? To reach 28.75" dl, one would have to use either a 28.5" module or a 29" module then twist/untwist string/cable 1/4" ?

Is there a performance issue that makes one more desireable than the other?

I' m sorry if I confused ya. The Freedom cam has the exact same adjustmenst as the Infinity cam. A 1/4" of draw is pretty easily covered but keep in mind that it will change the let off some, depending on which way you move the stop.

The Freedom cam was designed for a smoother draw but it still has very respectable speed for as smooth as it is.

I' ve been shooting between 55-65 lbs. for many years. I generally struggle some with 70 lb. bows due to lack of using that particualr poundage on a regular basis.

Without knowing it, I shot a 70 lb. Liberty with the Freedom cam on it like it was a 60 lb. bow... just my findings and I know they may vary from person to person.

No. It operates in the same exact manner.

Ha!!!! I beat you by 9 seconds.....

Just like two five year olds.....is it time for recess yet?

[>:]

Frank,

I' m not allowed to have recess anymore. I fell off the monkey bars and hit my head (more than once) and now they won' t let me out of this place I' m in...