Bow Problems
08-24-2008, 07:09 PM
#1
Fork Horn
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Batesville IN USA
Posts: 242
Bow Problems
I have a Hoyt Trykon that is about two years old and I used to shoot Beman ICS Camo Hunters but I switched to just Beman ICS with blazer vanes. I went to sight my new sights in and I noticed that the arrows have a bad tail whip. Does anyone have any idea what would be doing this?
08-24-2008, 07:36 PM
#2
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: SE Ohio
Posts: 2,531
RE: Bow Problems
Check for vane clearance. BLAZER's have a little higher profile than most vanes, and can cause some contact issues. Could potentially be a spine issue, but not likely, more than likely it's vane contact.
08-25-2008, 06:40 AM
#3
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Middletown PA United States
Posts: 3,625
RE: Bow Problems
Good thought. What vanes were you shooting before? There shouldn't be any difference in spine, if you're shooting the same spine.
The only other thing that comes to mind is that if your arrows were at the upper end of the spine range, then possibly the rigging on the bow has crept. The draw length and poundage go up and maybe the arrows are slightly underspined. Twisting up the string and cables to put the bow in spec might be the answer.
I'd do some powder testing to check for clearance. If this is OK then try dropping the poundage of the bow a turn or two and see if they fly better. This will be a check for spine. If it ends up being spine then you got several choices. Leave the poundage a little lower, buy stiffer arrows, or go back to the old arrrows and see if that works.
The only other thing that comes to mind is that if your arrows were at the upper end of the spine range, then possibly the rigging on the bow has crept. The draw length and poundage go up and maybe the arrows are slightly underspined. Twisting up the string and cables to put the bow in spec might be the answer.
I'd do some powder testing to check for clearance. If this is OK then try dropping the poundage of the bow a turn or two and see if they fly better. This will be a check for spine. If it ends up being spine then you got several choices. Leave the poundage a little lower, buy stiffer arrows, or go back to the old arrrows and see if that works.
08-25-2008, 08:06 AM
#4
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 375
RE: Bow Problems
Honna, These guys have covered it well. But, I was thinking first of what type rest are you using? Is it a drop away?
Second: do you know how to check for fletch contact, or what powder testing is? Don't want to insult your knowlege, I just understand that in reality archery knowlege seems to grow slowly and archery is growing rapidly...therefore only about 1/4 of us know most of this stuff. The rest just haven't had time to learn it yet!
Second: do you know how to check for fletch contact, or what powder testing is? Don't want to insult your knowlege, I just understand that in reality archery knowlege seems to grow slowly and archery is growing rapidly...therefore only about 1/4 of us know most of this stuff. The rest just haven't had time to learn it yet!
08-25-2008, 03:51 PM
#5
Fork Horn
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Batesville IN USA
Posts: 242
RE: Bow Problems
I shoot a whisker biscuit the fletching shouldn't be touching but it is possible. My old vanes were 4 inch duravanes but I don't know. I called the bow pro at Basspro and he said that my bow might be out of tune or something like that. I need help because deer season is coming up soon.
08-25-2008, 11:34 PM
#6
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 375
RE: Bow Problems
Do you know how to paper tune? I'd guess your rest is set too far in or out.
Did you get the same arrow shafts? Is the only difference the vanes? If not sure look to see if the number on the shaft is the same.
If so, are your cock feathers turned straight up when you place the arrow on the string? If not, put them on the string and turn the arrow so that it is. The nock should allow the arrow to turn around it. Or you can turn the nocks by hand either one.
Next get a cardboard box and cut a hole about a foot square or larger if you can in the bottom. Now tape a piece of newspaper over the hole Single Layer of paper. Tape it tight, no wrinkles. Now put this about 4 ft from your target and in line with it so that the arrow will go through and hit the target to stop it. Now, back up about 6-8ft from the box and shoot 2 or 3 arrows through the paper. See how the holes look.
You should see where the tip hit and where the fletch cut. It should be just one hole, but if you are getting a whip it will show up here. Let us know which way they are tearing. For instance a hole to the left and a tear with the fletch cuts above and to the right would be a high/right tear. Then note how far the tear is between the point and fletch end. 1" or 4" or whatever it is.
You can try moving the rest one way or another and repeating the steps to see if it helps. But remember only one direction at a time and only small amounts at first until you are more comfy doing this. Don't overshoot the mark.
HINT: Be sure the hole in your WB is lined up with the hole in your riser as far as up and down goes. If off, are you comfortable in moving it to realignit? Next...Hold it out at arms length with an arrow nocked and in the rest. Line the string up with the cams and the space between the limbs. Is your rest hole in line with all of this? Is the tip of your arrow sticking to one side or the other? If it is obviously out to one side, do you feel comfy in moving it to realign? If so then be sure your rest is all tight and screws secure when finished and that hole lines up both ways as described. Also be sure your rest biscuitis not leaning significantly forward or backward and the arrow is lying flat on the bristles...WITH THE COCK FEATHER UP. No fletch should be hitting the black bristles. NOW you are ready to paper tune as noted above. The thing with the WB is that you have to make all these adjustments one at a time and preferrably in the order I described. Always check to be sure moving it to align it one direction didn't change another.
If this is too much...I would try to find a smaller shop than Bass Pro to do it for you. They are not known for taking the time to do good tuning. Or maybe we can talk you through it.
When does your season start...I live in WV....Latest starting archery season in the US several years running. Our seasons and limits only serve to do one thing...make money.
Did you get the same arrow shafts? Is the only difference the vanes? If not sure look to see if the number on the shaft is the same.
If so, are your cock feathers turned straight up when you place the arrow on the string? If not, put them on the string and turn the arrow so that it is. The nock should allow the arrow to turn around it. Or you can turn the nocks by hand either one.
Next get a cardboard box and cut a hole about a foot square or larger if you can in the bottom. Now tape a piece of newspaper over the hole Single Layer of paper. Tape it tight, no wrinkles. Now put this about 4 ft from your target and in line with it so that the arrow will go through and hit the target to stop it. Now, back up about 6-8ft from the box and shoot 2 or 3 arrows through the paper. See how the holes look.
You should see where the tip hit and where the fletch cut. It should be just one hole, but if you are getting a whip it will show up here. Let us know which way they are tearing. For instance a hole to the left and a tear with the fletch cuts above and to the right would be a high/right tear. Then note how far the tear is between the point and fletch end. 1" or 4" or whatever it is.
You can try moving the rest one way or another and repeating the steps to see if it helps. But remember only one direction at a time and only small amounts at first until you are more comfy doing this. Don't overshoot the mark.
HINT: Be sure the hole in your WB is lined up with the hole in your riser as far as up and down goes. If off, are you comfortable in moving it to realignit? Next...Hold it out at arms length with an arrow nocked and in the rest. Line the string up with the cams and the space between the limbs. Is your rest hole in line with all of this? Is the tip of your arrow sticking to one side or the other? If it is obviously out to one side, do you feel comfy in moving it to realign? If so then be sure your rest is all tight and screws secure when finished and that hole lines up both ways as described. Also be sure your rest biscuitis not leaning significantly forward or backward and the arrow is lying flat on the bristles...WITH THE COCK FEATHER UP. No fletch should be hitting the black bristles. NOW you are ready to paper tune as noted above. The thing with the WB is that you have to make all these adjustments one at a time and preferrably in the order I described. Always check to be sure moving it to align it one direction didn't change another.
If this is too much...I would try to find a smaller shop than Bass Pro to do it for you. They are not known for taking the time to do good tuning. Or maybe we can talk you through it.
When does your season start...I live in WV....Latest starting archery season in the US several years running. Our seasons and limits only serve to do one thing...make money.
08-26-2008, 05:27 AM
#7
Fork Horn
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location:
Posts: 145
RE: Bow Problems
Hey Dryridge,
I twisted the nocks on my new arrows so the cock fletch is up(shot them with it out left this weekend and was getting black marks again on one vane). The arrows seem to group about the same, but I'm not getting the black marks anymore-- so I know I'm clearing the rest and cables (thank god.) What is powder testing?
I twisted the nocks on my new arrows so the cock fletch is up(shot them with it out left this weekend and was getting black marks again on one vane). The arrows seem to group about the same, but I'm not getting the black marks anymore-- so I know I'm clearing the rest and cables (thank god.) What is powder testing?
08-26-2008, 07:16 AM
#8
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Middletown PA United States
Posts: 3,625
RE: Bow Problems
At least we have the question about fletching clearance out of the equation. With a WB the fletching absolutely makes contact with the rest, but if the rest is perpendicular to the arrow all the vanes should make contact at the same time so that shouldn't be an issue.
08-26-2008, 10:17 AM
#9
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 375
RE: Bow Problems
powder testing is using athletes foot powder spray on your rest and cables and shooting to see if your fletch will wipe it off. This shows fletch contact. However, you can't do it on a WB except on the outside ring of the Biscuit.
Your groups are now doing what exactly? Have you lined the WB up like I described or at least looked at it to see if it lines up like I described?
Have we shot through paper yet?
Your groups are now doing what exactly? Have you lined the WB up like I described or at least looked at it to see if it lines up like I described?
Have we shot through paper yet?
