How to set your bow's tiller
04-23-2008, 12:19 AM
#41
Fork Horn
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Nebraska
Posts: 112
RE: How to set your bow's tiller
Arthur,
Thanks for clearing that up. I was forgetting when the bow is shot that the bow hand is still the fulcrum.
Those videos of the arrows shot by finger shooters are amazing. It's hard to believe finger shooting archers can hit anything!
Thanks for clearing that up. I was forgetting when the bow is shot that the bow hand is still the fulcrum.
Those videos of the arrows shot by finger shooters are amazing. It's hard to believe finger shooting archers can hit anything!
05-04-2010, 06:39 PM
#44
Boone & Crockett
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Eastern PA
Posts: 12,747
Those are some cool videos. Amazing how much an arrow flexes when shooting with fingers. Really shows the importance of spine selection so that the arrows will clear the rest. Those arrows look like snakes going downrange.
Arthur this is a very interesting post. Not that I doubt you. And your explanations make perfect sense. But I just purchase 2 new Martin bows and I sent them an email to see what their response is to your technique. I will post it when they send a response.
Arthur this is a very interesting post. Not that I doubt you. And your explanations make perfect sense. But I just purchase 2 new Martin bows and I sent them an email to see what their response is to your technique. I will post it when they send a response.
05-05-2010, 04:54 PM
#45
Boone & Crockett
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Eastern PA
Posts: 12,747
OK here's the word from Martin. The manual says the bow will shoot best with the tiller set dead even. The tech guy said there would be no problem in trying to tune by this method. OK lets see. I followed Arthur's directions. After noting my pin moving up away from the sight, I cranked the lower limb in 1/4 turn and took out the upper pin 1/4 turn. Almost right. I cranked in the lower limb another 1/4 turn and tried again. Perfect - the pin stayed right on target right through the draw.
OK now the test. Took 6 arrows out at 20 yds. (3 FTs and 3 BHs).
First 3 FTs hit 12 o'clock about 3" high on the field point target. Switched over to the broadhead target and let the 3 BHs fly. Guess where they hit? 12 o'clock - 3" high. Right on with the FTs.
Now this tells me 2 things. First is that the arrows were shooting much tighter groups with both the FTs and the BHs. And second, that the speed increased being that I was hitting 3" higher. (Netting only a 1# draw wt. increase)
One other thing I noticed even with only these 6 shots. I was able to follow the arrow moving to the target because the bow didn't jump down blocking my sight picture after the shot. It just seem to sit 'right there'.
So for my records, I decided to measure the tiller settings for future reference and found that the tiller was dead even. Not even a 1/16" difference. Coincidence? I don't know and I don't care. Its hitting where I want, grouping tight and no recoil or vibration after the shot. Thanks Authur. Great post
OK now the test. Took 6 arrows out at 20 yds. (3 FTs and 3 BHs).
First 3 FTs hit 12 o'clock about 3" high on the field point target. Switched over to the broadhead target and let the 3 BHs fly. Guess where they hit? 12 o'clock - 3" high. Right on with the FTs.
Now this tells me 2 things. First is that the arrows were shooting much tighter groups with both the FTs and the BHs. And second, that the speed increased being that I was hitting 3" higher. (Netting only a 1# draw wt. increase)
One other thing I noticed even with only these 6 shots. I was able to follow the arrow moving to the target because the bow didn't jump down blocking my sight picture after the shot. It just seem to sit 'right there'.
So for my records, I decided to measure the tiller settings for future reference and found that the tiller was dead even. Not even a 1/16" difference. Coincidence? I don't know and I don't care. Its hitting where I want, grouping tight and no recoil or vibration after the shot. Thanks Authur. Great post
Last edited by bronko22000; 05-05-2010 at 04:56 PM.
06-19-2012, 07:46 PM
#46
Spike
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1
Sorry to bump an ancient thread for my first post, I was Googling about looking for information and I had to ask when I found this. How are you putting your pin on the target to aim before drawing to see if it moves at all during the draw? I just get my bow in the general direction and finalize my aim while I'm looking through the sight.
06-26-2012, 03:31 AM
#48
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 2,445
I used this method to adjust tiller on my single cam bow, a old Mission X3. With both limb bolts out 1/2 turn from bottomed out, the pin did climb during the draw. Adjusted the top out 1/4 and the lower in 1/4, and it was better. Then bottomed the lower and backed the top out another 1/4, and this seemed to keep the pin steady. Had to adjust the rest as the nock point changed. Shot a couple shots, adjusted sights, and shot some to see how the bow handled. It seemed to be quieter, less movement through the shot, and arrows were flying straight and grouping well.
02-07-2013, 10:40 AM
#50
Spike
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 4
Originally Posted by Arthur P
People have been trying for thousands of years to fully understand what's happening when an arrow is launched from a bow. Even with high speed video equipment and all the computer power we've got now, it still ain't happened.
No matter whether the grip is at the center of the bow (as it is with some designs) or the arrow pass is at the center (as it is on other designs), you still have to contend with the basic problem that the arrow pass is several inches above the grip. You push on the grip during the draw. You push on the grip during the shot (if the grip didn't have resistance against it during the shot, the entire bow would move backward as the string moves forward) So, the grip is where all the pressures are brought to bear.
You have to balance the tiller so that the pressures are equal on either side of the fulcrum or the bow will rock back and forth during the draw and during the shot.
If the bow is rocking during the shot, the nock is moving up and down while the arrow is on the string. It will make the tail of the arrow move up and down during the launch as well. Maybe you can see the potential problem with unexplainable tail high/tail low tears when shooting through paper.
Watch this video. You can barely see the bow rock during launch. You can clearly see the rearward movement of the riser, which I referred to earlier. There is definitely a LOT of pressure applied to the grip during the shot, whether you feel it or not. But pay close attention to the closeup of the launch from the arrow rest. You can see the effect of the nock oscillating up and down on the string. This bow isn't bad, but it could stand a little bit of work done to it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hDV1pHtI7S8
Wouldn't it be great to have a high speed camera as part of your bow tuning gear?
Here are some more slo-mo videos, just for the heckuvit. These are pretty old, but still interesting, especially for fingers shooters.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=48R2ajWx3rY
No matter whether the grip is at the center of the bow (as it is with some designs) or the arrow pass is at the center (as it is on other designs), you still have to contend with the basic problem that the arrow pass is several inches above the grip. You push on the grip during the draw. You push on the grip during the shot (if the grip didn't have resistance against it during the shot, the entire bow would move backward as the string moves forward) So, the grip is where all the pressures are brought to bear.
You have to balance the tiller so that the pressures are equal on either side of the fulcrum or the bow will rock back and forth during the draw and during the shot.
If the bow is rocking during the shot, the nock is moving up and down while the arrow is on the string. It will make the tail of the arrow move up and down during the launch as well. Maybe you can see the potential problem with unexplainable tail high/tail low tears when shooting through paper.
Watch this video. You can barely see the bow rock during launch. You can clearly see the rearward movement of the riser, which I referred to earlier. There is definitely a LOT of pressure applied to the grip during the shot, whether you feel it or not. But pay close attention to the closeup of the launch from the arrow rest. You can see the effect of the nock oscillating up and down on the string. This bow isn't bad, but it could stand a little bit of work done to it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hDV1pHtI7S8
Wouldn't it be great to have a high speed camera as part of your bow tuning gear?
Here are some more slo-mo videos, just for the heckuvit. These are pretty old, but still interesting, especially for fingers shooters.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=48R2ajWx3rY
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