I have a theory I'd like to heap upon the hype pile or is it hype upon the heap pile? The new DC Patriot IMO should be more recoil and shock resistant because it will be using two cams of equal weight. Unlike a conventional single cam which has the larger cam on the bottom and a much smaller and lighter idler wheel on top. On most single cam bows you can usually feel what is known as lower limb kick due to the heavier rotational mass of the bottom cam<img src=icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle> I GOTTA SEE THESE BOWS!! Hey how about a dual cable guard rod, one above and one below the grip, no rollers! I always wondered why Mathews didn't camo that roller bracket<img src=icon_smile_dead.gif border=0 align=middle><img src=icon_smile_8ball.gif border=0 align=middle>.

WWAG,

I agree. I believe that a 2 cam bow produces a more &quot;balanced&quot; feel as it recoils than a single cam bow, even extreme low recoil models like the Patriot and Legacy.

Based on my experience with the 2K2 BKII, I can only imagine that the DC Patriot with it's parallel limb design will be incredible. My BKII had very little recoil and just a bit of handshock when set-up with a Sorbotek stabilizer and limbsavers. Some of my other onecam and hybrid bows had much more noise, recoil and/or shock than the BKII does when set-up apples to apples.

Which brings me to another point. I find it quite &quot;ballsy&quot; these days in this market to bring out a dual cam design and promote it as your main bow for the year. Not only that but Bowtech has 2 or 3 more brand new dual cam bows. They have one new Ininfity cam model (E-VFT),and a fairly big overhaul (the Blackhawk), and now w/Hoyt doing the cam and a half, will this be the year that the market finally goes to doing their own thing, and getting away from the single track idler onecams? Will 2004 bring more of the same?

Of course we shall have to see what Mathews puts out in January, but I cannot help to think that Matt McPherson has painted himself into the corner by making it clear that in their view hybrids and dual cams are inferior.

Should be interesting to say the least.

JeffB <img src=icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle>

Hey Jeff how have you been? Yes I agree with you I think this year the market will move into a free for all when it comes to cam's and options. Martin is pushing new bows that do not have single cams, bowtech is too! I find what Hoyt is doing interesting even though it looks a lot like the Darton CPS. I think companies will move away from the single cam except for a few companies. I think Mathews will continue to make solocams....I see no reason for them to change that.

I think this coming year will be the most interesting one in the last 4 or 5 years. Finally we will start seeing inovation again thanks to companies trying something new other than the solocam.

I can't help but to take notice of the new DC Pro 40. With those speeds it would make a great 3D bow and if it has the VFT limb angle, it's going to be noticed by some pros for tournaments.

Hey folks I'm back now... I'm working on getting all the answers to all the questions but please bear with me I'm absolutly swamped right now. I was out of town for 2 1/2 days for my birthday/Sweetest Day and came home to 37 emails since my laptop (via cell) phone wouldn't work in the remote area I was in...Plus NO PHONES in the rooms...A well needed vacation indeed...<img src=icon_smile_wink.gif border=0 align=middle><img src=icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle>

Edited by - BowTech_Shooter on 10/20/2002 17:32:16

I'm probably the only person on this board who is &quot;old school&quot; enough to ask about the Pro 40 wheel bow. Will it have a hard wall, or the typical wheel bow mush at the end of the draw cycle? Thanks for any info on this mostly non-speed related, non-VFT related question.<img src=icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle>

Avoid the inevitable until it is absolutely unavoidable!

Joe I still have enough &quot;Old School&quot; left in me to be VERY intrigued by that Pro40 Wheel bow as well.......Imagine the thought of that &quot;Old School&quot; butter smooth draw, and speeds upwards of 312fps with a forgiving 7.25&quot; brace height!
I can only speculate at this time, but I would guess they found a way to incorporate a solid wall into the design.
It would sure make a day on the 3D course easy on the back muscles.....even with all those blazing speed numbers for the 2003 bows, this one jumped out at me too.

Well I am a big dual cam fan.
My Patriot is the first single bow and dont get me wrong I love it.
But now they have a dual cam version out the single cam Patriot will be looking for a good home as soon as my dual cam Patriot arrives.

It is going to be interesting to see what Mathews does come out with tho.

With this years models Bowtech was put on the map and from what I can see the 2003 models they are going to be drawning a whole new map.
It is good to see a company that not only listens to the end users but gets out there and does it.

On another note

I would like to cordially invite Matt/PA he turned me onto Bowtech,Pat aka BTS and all the crew at Bowtech to my up coming divorce proceedings<img src=icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle>

Man this dual cam one is going to cost me a small fortune my wife is already asking me for the matching earings and necklace to go with the 10 carat diamond ring the Patriot single cost me<img src=icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle>
but on the bright side I wont have to change my signature pic<img src=icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle>

Jeff,

We definitely need to chat a bit more about this draw-force curves issues.

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote<font size=1 face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>In this case I would tend to think that means they smoothed out the front end, the back end, or both. If the area under the curve is increased (length of max pull), but the back and/or front ends are smoothed out a bit, I don’t think it would be too noticeable, certainly not enough to go “GOOD GAWD this thing is hard to draw”, simply because the transition/s would be easier. <hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote></font id=quote><font face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' size=2 id=quote>

I understand what you are saying Jeff but considering the current shape of the draw force curve on the B-tech cams I could not imagine how they would have any room over the draw force curve to make the transition any smoother than it currently is. I am not saying that folks are purposely mistating the truth but rather would be pleasantly surprised to see such a change.

Unless the engineers at Bowtech found some ways to &quot;tweak&quot; some minor odds and ends in order to obtain the resulting increase in speed then I would probably guess that they somewhat lengthened the range that the bow maintains its peak draw weight. Not ridiculously mind you but enough to increase the speed slightly while still being able to maintain a healthy brace height.

Anyone know if the DC Patriot will use the same riser as this year's patriot. Just curious about balance points and such.

Also, anyone know MSRP on this bow?

Rod