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Hot Barrel?

Old 10-14-2008, 08:05 PM
  #1  
Spike
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Default Hot Barrel?

Ok - this one has got me. Last yr. I worked up loads for my new Savage Mod 11 Accu Trigger .234 w/ Leupold bases/rings & a VXIII 4.4 X 14.

I came up w nice grouping 100 gr. Sierra Game Kings on top of 41gr. IMR 4350 - it was shooting about 3/4" groups. I also had a 70 gr. Sierra Blitz King group under 1" using 38.5 gr. IMR 4350 and w/ 37.5 Gr. H 414 . This is all background info.

the other day I shot the gun w/ the 70 gr. bullets and (as usual w/ this gun the first (clean barrel) round) was out. The 2 & 3 rounds were touching but then the 4th was like 1" to 1 1/2"+ away & I didn't pull the shot.

I went to sight it in for the 100 gr bullet loads and the gun was would throw two rounds touching then the 3rd a flyer. I couldn't sight it right because we'd shoot 2 rds, adjust windage, say 4 clicks left, then the next round was too far over or high.

The ammo is neck sized in fire-formed Win brass - hand primed, w/ individual weighed power charges - not sloppy work.

It was a warm day 75, with little wind and med humidity. I don't know, but my dad shot a few also and had the same result. It was cold when I previously worked up these loads. This day I did end up shooting about 18 rds and while I waited when I felt the barrel getting hot, I didn't follow any strick time frame. My last shot was after I walked away and came back 15 min later and the shot went high relative to previously fired rounds ?? I wasn't pulling these shots that much even on a bad day.

Could it be barrel heating causing my problem?? How much time should I wait to get a uniform group.
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Old 10-14-2008, 08:40 PM
  #2  
Typical Buck
 
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Default RE: Hot Barrel?

Shoot three, then adjust the scope. Let the barrel cool, repeat until you have your grouping where you want it. Don't be in a hurry when shooting the three shot group either.
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Old 10-15-2008, 09:57 AM
  #3  
Nontypical Buck
 
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Default RE: Hot Barrel?

Bedding could definitely be a problem. Best have it checked.
Temperature sensitivity of the powder could also be a factor, but I've never had 4350 cause much trouble. But, sometimes what you work up in warm temps will not necessarily shoot well in cold temps, and vice-versa....
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Old 10-15-2008, 11:32 AM
  #4  
Spike
 
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Default RE: Hot Barrel?

Dave R, I took a rifle to the range with 50 rounds,10 different loads in groups of 5 to check a rifle, it was/is TRIPPED out, not tricked out, the barrel is bedded into the stock 'solid' as in ripping a piece of wood, cutting a barrel channel in bothpiecesthen filled with J-B Weld, together with the barrel in the middlethen clamped. the stocked is also the recoil lug. It has been advertised as the ugliest rifle in the world, not my problem.[/align][/align]At the rangethe rifle gotsome attention from those that look for fault first, first was the issue of 'barrel float', I was not trying to sell the rifle, I was test firing, so I said "boats float", another question about floating barrels, I said, "it floats, in water" , with 7 rifles I was not in a hurry but the rifle produced 10 tight groups, It is a M1917 Remington barrel boltand actionwith a Timney trigger, cock on open and a Q-T firing pin and spring (quick trip).[/align][/align]F. Guffey[/align]
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Old 10-15-2008, 01:15 PM
  #5  
Nontypical Buck
 
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Default RE: Hot Barrel?

A good rule of thumb to determine if your barrel is "hot" is if you can't hold a finger on the barrel near the chamber for more than 2 seconds. I highly doubt that your barrel was getting hot enough to effect your groups.
I don't have the answer to why your 3rd shot keeps "throwing", but I'd bet a dollar that barrel temp. isn't the culprit! I'm curious as to how far off the lands are you seating your bullets. Might try to seat the bullets either closer to the lands or further away if you're already seating right at the lands! Just an idea.
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Old 10-15-2008, 02:02 PM
  #6  
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Default RE: Hot Barrel?

If your rifle was shooting good before with the same ammo I would try playing with the scopeto see if it is the culprit.
Try this.
shoot 3 shots (1 min between shots)
move scope 12 clicks up, 12 clicks right - shot 3 more
move scope24 clicks down - shoot 3 more
move scope 24 clicks left - shoot 3 more
move scope 24 clicks up - shoot 3 more
move scope 12 clicks down, 12 clicks right - shoot again (you should be back where you started.)
If not, your scope may be faulty.
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Old 10-15-2008, 06:24 PM
  #7  
Spike
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Default RE: Hot Barrel?

Thanks Guys for your thoughts. I was really getting to like this rifle, specially since I got my first coyote with in last Feb!

That Savage has a floating barrel and its pillar bedded. I checked the tie down bolts when I cleaned the rifle & they were snug. THe scope rings were also very snug. THe scope is a Leupold & almost new.

The ammo was in the sun a while but it was in a tool bag and inside a plastic 50 round ammo case. I was shooting inside a cool barn, but it was warm outside.

The seating depths were pre determined based on working up the loads in winter. I think its about .015 short of the lands. One set of ammo was left over ie, not a second batch made up later. That ammo shot good before.

The only real variable I can think of was the temp. I plan to give this another try under different conditons.

One item I thought of - the barrel was near
( about 2" or less) from the barn window sill with the muzzle half way out. Due to the position of the bench rest this was my most comfortable position.. Could muzzle blast pressure reflecting from the sill have affected the barrel/ bullet as it exited the muzzle?

PS, what do you reccomend as a case lube for neck sizing only?

Thanks again.

dave
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Old 10-16-2008, 09:07 AM
  #8  
Nontypical Buck
 
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Default RE: Hot Barrel?

When you developed the load was the brass new or fire formed? Some rifle like fire formed brass and some don't. Just a thought.
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Old 10-16-2008, 01:00 PM
  #9  
Boone & Crockett
 
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Default RE: Hot Barrel?

Dave - One other thing I just realized. You siad it is the model 11. Is it the synthetic stock? I've noticed on mine that (synthetic stock) if you rest the rifle too far forward on the stock (closer to the forend tip) it will tend to shoot a bit erratic. That's my only complaint about the Savage - their synthetic stocks are too flimsy. They have a tendancy to flex and could be causing differernt pressure points on the barrel changing the harmonics.
I keep my bags back at least to the center of the checkering and this eliminates the problem.
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Old 10-16-2008, 01:20 PM
  #10  
Nontypical Buck
 
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Default RE: Hot Barrel?

Good point, bronko...I'm glad you brought it up. I had considered it, but forgot to mention it........Good bench procedures dictate that everything must be done the same, shot after shot. The position of the rest or bags is one of the most critical.
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