Gun Law Warnings to Canadians
03-03-2004, 04:25 AM
#1
Nontypical Buck
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: NewLowell ,Ontario ,Canada
Posts: 2,765
Gun Law Warnings to Canadians
Hello All,
I'm speaking out today as a warning to all gun owners in Ontario and the rest of Canada. I speak from 100% experience, from someone that did nothing but hunt and over looked alot more than I should of. I was not a Criminal, so I didn't need to know the Criminal laws, as well I didn't need to know my Civil rights as a Canadian, because I did not think I was a Criminal and needed to. I was just a Hunter and a Long Gun owner like most. Just to let everyone know , I Was Wrong.
There's a lot more to this than everyone thinks.
I just spent 2+ years of my life completely upside Down, fighting in the Courts, Charges that were laid against me, because of untrue Allegations/Tips about something other than Guns and Weapons that I owned. In all the actions , not knowing my Civil Rights in turn made things worse for me. After finding that the allegation that was made was not true, I was in turned charged for 3 related Guns offences.
1/ Unsafe Storage of Ammunition
2/ Unsafe Storage of Firearms
3/ Being in Possession of a Prohibited Weapon (Something I did not know)
After a 2 hour search of my home, 8+ officals could not find my firearms. I was asked as to where I kept them. I was informed that they knew I had Registered Firearms. I told them where they were,(not knowing my Civil Rights).
I have fought this on my own for the last 2+ years with 2 Lawyers just to keep my behind out of jail. Yes! this is what our Government Laws want, when they know there was a mistake,and won't admit to it, there view is,,, they are not wrong. I have been to court over this about 10+ times, fighting it on my own with no help from any Organizations here on this issue. After spending Thousands, and Thousands and more Thousands to prove my innocence, yesterday was the final and end to all of the stress I've been under for years. This story is so unbelievable that most can not believe it happened here in Ontario. But in the End with help from the Best Firearms Lawyer in Ontario and maybe Canada All charges have been dismissed.
Just to let you all know some of the things I learned in the past 2+years.
1/ My Lawyers are from Collingwood Ont., Firearms-Paul Shaw & Criminal-Bryan Mclellan can be reached at 705-445-1382.
2/ Get to know all Criminal Gun and Weapon Laws.
3/ If you're a Gun Owner , know your Storage and Traveling Laws and Stick with them.
4/ The Most important; Know your Civil Rights in this Country and the rights that you have when The officials come to your Door!
I'm not looking for sympathy here , I just want to Warn all Canadian Gun owners, It can happen to you when you don't expect it.
Adrian Hare
I'm speaking out today as a warning to all gun owners in Ontario and the rest of Canada. I speak from 100% experience, from someone that did nothing but hunt and over looked alot more than I should of. I was not a Criminal, so I didn't need to know the Criminal laws, as well I didn't need to know my Civil rights as a Canadian, because I did not think I was a Criminal and needed to. I was just a Hunter and a Long Gun owner like most. Just to let everyone know , I Was Wrong.
There's a lot more to this than everyone thinks.
I just spent 2+ years of my life completely upside Down, fighting in the Courts, Charges that were laid against me, because of untrue Allegations/Tips about something other than Guns and Weapons that I owned. In all the actions , not knowing my Civil Rights in turn made things worse for me. After finding that the allegation that was made was not true, I was in turned charged for 3 related Guns offences.
1/ Unsafe Storage of Ammunition
2/ Unsafe Storage of Firearms
3/ Being in Possession of a Prohibited Weapon (Something I did not know)
After a 2 hour search of my home, 8+ officals could not find my firearms. I was asked as to where I kept them. I was informed that they knew I had Registered Firearms. I told them where they were,(not knowing my Civil Rights).
I have fought this on my own for the last 2+ years with 2 Lawyers just to keep my behind out of jail. Yes! this is what our Government Laws want, when they know there was a mistake,and won't admit to it, there view is,,, they are not wrong. I have been to court over this about 10+ times, fighting it on my own with no help from any Organizations here on this issue. After spending Thousands, and Thousands and more Thousands to prove my innocence, yesterday was the final and end to all of the stress I've been under for years. This story is so unbelievable that most can not believe it happened here in Ontario. But in the End with help from the Best Firearms Lawyer in Ontario and maybe Canada All charges have been dismissed.
Just to let you all know some of the things I learned in the past 2+years.
1/ My Lawyers are from Collingwood Ont., Firearms-Paul Shaw & Criminal-Bryan Mclellan can be reached at 705-445-1382.
2/ Get to know all Criminal Gun and Weapon Laws.
3/ If you're a Gun Owner , know your Storage and Traveling Laws and Stick with them.
4/ The Most important; Know your Civil Rights in this Country and the rights that you have when The officials come to your Door!
I'm not looking for sympathy here , I just want to Warn all Canadian Gun owners, It can happen to you when you don't expect it.
Adrian Hare
03-03-2004, 05:05 AM
#2
Fork Horn
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Toronto Ontario Canada
Posts: 304
RE: Gun Law Warnings to Canadians
It's like I always said "guilty untill you prove yourself innocent". So, all charges dropped , now who ever this happened to spent XY thousands of dollars to prove they where innocent and have NO WAY of recouping their court costs. It could even bankrupt you.
As brothers and sisters in the hunting/ shooting sports why can't we start a legal fund to be held in trust for cases like this. Think about it , 2 bucks from everyone. In VERY short order we would have enough stashed that the fund would feed itself through low risk investments( ie: GICs)
As brothers and sisters in the hunting/ shooting sports why can't we start a legal fund to be held in trust for cases like this. Think about it , 2 bucks from everyone. In VERY short order we would have enough stashed that the fund would feed itself through low risk investments( ie: GICs)
03-03-2004, 11:50 AM
#3
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location:
Posts: 520
RE: Gun Law Warnings to Canadians
Without knowing the case, this is the main reason I gave up my guns. Early on in this there was a case where there was a black fugitive in TO, he was eventualy arrested in Florida. There was another black man who happened to have a white girlfriend. A neighbour resented this fact and claimed black man 2 was the fugitive, or maybe he believed it. The Police guys kicked down the doors of the girlfriend's family, pointed machineguns at everyone in the middle of the night, etc... The family had a son who had recently died. He had left a stash of dope (not traffiking size I think), and a .22 lying around. The family (some person presumably) was charged with unsafe storage! Just think of that. Yet of course the police were completely justified. These charges were dropped.
Another case involved an Ottawa man whose wife found kiddie porn on her husband's computer. She called the police, and they charged him with unsafe storage of firearms, knowing kiddie porn charges are very hard to make. Fair enough. It did make me think that next time you want to divorce a guy, just download some kiddie porn onto his computer, and take a few guns out of the safe, and call the cops! Done deal. Of course in this particular case, I never heard that suggested, or never heard the outcome for that mater.
But people often ask why do we care if there are gun rules, there are car rules afterall. Yet you never hear of coercive prosecutions of people who speed dangerously on the 401. Leave an unloaded, partial, unfireable, firearm lying around, and you might as well forget it. If you're on the registry database, then they can basically kick down your door whenever.
It's important to remember that the safe storage rules were brought in by the Conservatives, not the Liberals. It's a toss-up I guess, but I think they are every bit as big a deal as the registry. They were very costly, forcing everyone to buy safes, though that is probably a good thing. They also basically outlawed all primary uses of firearms, like self-defence, since it's hard to make the urgency case if you have to seperately lock up firearms and ammo. And they opened a lot of inatentive owners to coersive prosecutions.
Another case involved an Ottawa man whose wife found kiddie porn on her husband's computer. She called the police, and they charged him with unsafe storage of firearms, knowing kiddie porn charges are very hard to make. Fair enough. It did make me think that next time you want to divorce a guy, just download some kiddie porn onto his computer, and take a few guns out of the safe, and call the cops! Done deal. Of course in this particular case, I never heard that suggested, or never heard the outcome for that mater.
But people often ask why do we care if there are gun rules, there are car rules afterall. Yet you never hear of coercive prosecutions of people who speed dangerously on the 401. Leave an unloaded, partial, unfireable, firearm lying around, and you might as well forget it. If you're on the registry database, then they can basically kick down your door whenever.
It's important to remember that the safe storage rules were brought in by the Conservatives, not the Liberals. It's a toss-up I guess, but I think they are every bit as big a deal as the registry. They were very costly, forcing everyone to buy safes, though that is probably a good thing. They also basically outlawed all primary uses of firearms, like self-defence, since it's hard to make the urgency case if you have to seperately lock up firearms and ammo. And they opened a lot of inatentive owners to coersive prosecutions.
03-04-2004, 02:46 PM
#5
Nontypical Buck
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: NewLowell ,Ontario ,Canada
Posts: 2,765
RE: Gun Law Warnings to Canadians
Too make a very long story short,
2 1/2 years ago , someone made a false allegation against me while I was in NY. When I returned home I was comfronted by 8-10 Cops and arrested for Drugs. After being setup by them, I was cuffed and read my rights, something I have only heard on TV. I was brought back to my residents in a car and kepted in the car at all times. While they did a seach of the house they found No Drugs but Decided to go after my guns. They could not find the guns after 2 hours of searching, so I just ended up telling them where they were when asked. In with the guns they found a 36inch Blowgun that I bought from a PA Sports Show for $9.00. I had no idea Canadians are not have these. After realizing there was trouble , I asked to speak to a Lawyer, and was not permitted. Well I was Charged with 1/ Unsafe Storage of Ammo, 2/ Unsafe Storage of firearms, 3/ Being in Possesion of a Prohibit Weapon.
These are all Criminal here and I was close to doing Jail time. I hired 2 Lawyers and the fight began. At the first it was to stay clear of jail , in which they wanted and Bad. The evidence I had to back all my clams ment nothing. I have kept this from everyone due to Quakerboy and they aswell were aware of it all. After 10 or more times to court and close to 10.000 dollars in legal fee's and damages. I finally got the curse off my back with all Charges Dismissed.
The mental Stress involed with this was so intence, that no one has any idea, what it can do to a family. Lucky I have a companion that is very understanding. I've been a prisoner in my own home for 2 1/2 years , scared to go anywhere , because you never know. The emotions after the court was uncontrolable. I've spent 2 days wondering around lost. I hate to answer the phone , because of the call that I recieved by the Police the day I was cuffed.
As for the guns , I asked about them and they will not be returned untill a 30 day waiting period is over incase of an appeal on the Crowns part...BT
2 1/2 years ago , someone made a false allegation against me while I was in NY. When I returned home I was comfronted by 8-10 Cops and arrested for Drugs. After being setup by them, I was cuffed and read my rights, something I have only heard on TV. I was brought back to my residents in a car and kepted in the car at all times. While they did a seach of the house they found No Drugs but Decided to go after my guns. They could not find the guns after 2 hours of searching, so I just ended up telling them where they were when asked. In with the guns they found a 36inch Blowgun that I bought from a PA Sports Show for $9.00. I had no idea Canadians are not have these. After realizing there was trouble , I asked to speak to a Lawyer, and was not permitted. Well I was Charged with 1/ Unsafe Storage of Ammo, 2/ Unsafe Storage of firearms, 3/ Being in Possesion of a Prohibit Weapon.
These are all Criminal here and I was close to doing Jail time. I hired 2 Lawyers and the fight began. At the first it was to stay clear of jail , in which they wanted and Bad. The evidence I had to back all my clams ment nothing. I have kept this from everyone due to Quakerboy and they aswell were aware of it all. After 10 or more times to court and close to 10.000 dollars in legal fee's and damages. I finally got the curse off my back with all Charges Dismissed.
The mental Stress involed with this was so intence, that no one has any idea, what it can do to a family. Lucky I have a companion that is very understanding. I've been a prisoner in my own home for 2 1/2 years , scared to go anywhere , because you never know. The emotions after the court was uncontrolable. I've spent 2 days wondering around lost. I hate to answer the phone , because of the call that I recieved by the Police the day I was cuffed.
As for the guns , I asked about them and they will not be returned untill a 30 day waiting period is over incase of an appeal on the Crowns part...BT
03-04-2004, 03:28 PM
#7
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Pirate on the river Saskatchewan
Posts: 2,167
RE: Gun Law Warnings to Canadians
My days of watching law and order will someday pay off i think....First of all the search warrant was for drugs not guns. If they wanted to look for the guns i would have told them to come back with another warrant. And because they found the guns without a proper search warrant this would be thrown out of court or should be. Not letting you speak to a lawyer is a big NO NO their part. What are your rights...you have the right to remain silent, anything you say can and will be used against u in a court....U HAVE THE RIGHT TO AN ATOURNEY, if u can't afford one one will be provided for you. I would have sat there like a stump and not said a peep except i want a lawyer i want a lawyer again and again. They can interagate you as much as they want but you have the right to remain silent and don't have to say a word until your lawyer is present. It sounds like these guys were really out to get you and weren't following proper invstigation methods. I really hope that i never have to deal with anything like this but if i do i am sure i will know how to conduct myself.
03-04-2004, 06:02 PM
#8
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Ontario
Posts: 241
RE: Gun Law Warnings to Canadians
Adrian, the 30 day waiting period pending appeal is standard procedure in all statutes, so don't sweat that part. I think you mentioned that the officers in this case were being charged? If so, how about keeping us posted? I know, I sure would like to know how things work out for you. Hang in there Pard, the guys here are pulling for ya--and your family!
03-07-2004, 02:00 AM
#10
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location:
Posts: 520
RE: Gun Law Warnings to Canadians
I know what you mean, but in the world of overzealous prosecution the ATF has it sewn up. I'd far rather live in Canada if that was the only issue. What's hurting now in Canada is one department after another is getting a black eye, while in the past it was like living in Mayberry.
