RE: Alt on Penna. Outdoor Life
 

First of all I did not say that there are not more PS buck than we had with AR. What I said was that if HR progresses there will be fewer buck to be saved by AR and eventually that will result in fewer 8+ pt buck. Prior to Alt being appointed the 10 yr. avg. anterless harvest was 200K resulting in an avg. BB harvest of 44K. Now compare that to 62K BB harvested in 2001, 77K in 2002 and 88K in 2003.

If you have a lot of posted ,unhunted land ,than maybe 50% of those buck will survive. But, once again you disagree with the state stats that show that we harvested 86% of the 2.5+ buck that were carried over from 2002. Furthermore, if your AR legal buck have such a high survival rate ,there was no need for AR in the first place.

Okay, in the future I won't believe anythng you post and just assume you are intentionally trying to mislead the readers.

RE: Alt on Penna. Outdoor Life
 

Harvesting 6 BB on 35 acres equates to a herd reduction rate of 110 DPSM. If every group of hunters were as succesful as our group , the overpopulation problem would be solved in one or two years.

I found a doe and I harvested that deer and I still had an unfilled anterless tag the last day of ML, so if we all had passed on those BB that would have allowed the OW herd to increase by 6 DPSM. A buck causes just as much crop damage as a doe and it causes just as much damage to a car. Shooting any deer contributes to herd reduction and only those who don't care about HR have a problem with harvesting BB.

RE: Alt on Penna. Outdoor Life
 

35 acres is a postage stamp in a deer's range. If all hunters were as "successful" as you, the b/d ratio would be off the charts. Even if hunters killed all but one buck in a 5 mile radius of your place the herd would still grow the next year. Several bucks from far away will infiltrate your territory very quickly during the rut, and one buck can breed many, many does. Shooting BB to accomplish HR is the most shortsighted plan I have ever heard of. You are trying to manage your WMU from your backyard.

RE: Alt on Penna. Outdoor Life
 

What you don't seem to be able to comprehend is that it wasn't a choice between shooting an adult doe or a BB , it was a choice of shooting a BB or not shooting anything. Therefore, no matter how you slice it there were six less deer the following year because we harvested those BB. than if we would have passed on those deer. The simple fact is that trying to save BB and small buck protected by AR is the reason that HR has failed. The OW herd would have been reduced by over 85K is we simply had harvested the bucks that were protected by AR.

RE: Alt on Penna. Outdoor Life
 

You would be better off picking door number two. I know, .....my opinion.

RE: Alt on Penna. Outdoor Life
 

You are entitled to your opinion , but apparently it is based solely on your desire to see more buck, with no regard for reducing the herd or protecting the habitat.

RE: Alt on Penna. Outdoor Life
 

The lot isn't posted and there are other hunters that hunt the area so that has nothing to do with it. Also you are saying that all of these AR legal deer are making it from one season to the next so what is the need for AR. Well, I'll make it real simple. First without AR in place these AR legal deer would have been shot well before they were this size. And also, these deer were carried over from a year when AR was in place which means that most of the male offspring they produced weren't filled with 20 pounds of lead the first 2 hours of opening day by someone who just had to have the 4 inches of antler to add to their pile.

You just love turning words around don't you. No wonder you'll never be for AR because you read what someone posted which to most people makes perfect sense and then turn them around to further help your argument regardless of what was posted. I NEVER said don't believe what I posted. I said that I have seen alot of AR legal buck this year. I also said that I have seen more buck than doe this year. What you ASSUMED was that by those two sentences that there MUST be less doe than buck. Just further proof that you jump to conclusions as long as they help your argument. This thread is getting rediculuos and turning into a pi$$ing contest. No one is ever going to change their mind so I'm not wasting my time and this will be my last post on the issue. But now I realize that even if the game commission came out and said they counted every deer in the state and had 100% proof that AR was working you would still come up with some way to turn around their findings in your favor. I'll tell you what, this season go out and shoot the first 40 pound button buck you see and I'll send you and extra 10 lbs of meat and the brow tines of the buck I shot last year then you can pretend you shot a spike, would that make you happy? ;):)

RE: Alt on Penna. Outdoor Life
 

You are wong again!! I would be extremely happy if the PGC could show AR was working and the buck harvests retrurned to normal , we doubled the number of 2.5 + buck and the number of 8 pt. buck harvested.

Sorry , but it would be extremely difficult for me to harvest a 40 lb. BB. Almost all of them weigh 70-80 lbs. But , you can still sent me the 10 lbs. of venison , but keep the spikes. I'm not a rack hunter anymore.

RE: Alt on Penna. Outdoor Life
 

A 70 lb BB will yield about 25 lbs of meat, if you are lucky.
Again, a good waste of a resource.

RE: Alt on Penna. Outdoor Life
 

Now that is pretty funny! Suddenly you wat to save BB in order to aviod wasting the resource. well let's see how sincere you really are.

If hunters would have passed on the 68 K BB in 2003, 15-20% of those deer would have died from normal ,non-hunting mortality. So , 68K X.15 = 1020 deer wasted. That equates to a waste of 20,400 lbs. of venison. Therefore, you should congradulate our group for not wasting 120 lbs. of perfectly good venison.