so whats your point? we still have some of the most liberal limits in the country? and some of the best"trophy"hunting as well. crossbows harm nothing! EXCEPT EGOS OBVIOUSLY!

My point? The same point I keep making as well as others. This is "not" Ohio, it is Pa. People from Ohio and our BOC for the crossbows,keep wanting to use Ohio as a model,that the increase of crossbow users had no affect on deer numbers. Well this ain't
Ohio!

Ohio-450,000 deer hunters
Pa.- 900,000 deer hunters
Ohio- one week gun season
Pa.- two week concurrent rifle season in most wmu's
Pa.-one week early muzzle loader season
Pa.-three day early rifle season

Make rifle season one week.stop shooting little ones. Wha lha. Why have issues with crossbows then be ok with high powered rifles? P.s poaching is also negetive.

[quote=boilermaker85;3445099]Make rifle season one week.stop shooting little ones. quote]

How nice of you to say take away from the rifle hunters what they have had. You do realize today a large portion of hunters only hunt saturdays thus they have 2 days to hunt because of financial reasons. They aren't a new breed of hunter wanting to have an exception made for them at the cost of others. Your suggestion of reducing the length of the rifle season shows who the greedy ones are and that is you and other xbow fans who have always been too lazy or uninclined to go out like the rest of us with a vertical bow and actually participate in "ARCHERY".

So, in short... give you the ability to archery hunt all archery season with a string gun but cut a rifle hunter's season in half. We didn't need the xbow included, especially now. Instead of creating new opportunities to kill deer the PAGC and BOC need to figure out a way to fix this train wreck of a deer management program they have created with their new way of thinking and new way of "managing" the herd. But in typical PAGC fashion they are led by the dollar instead of common sense in securing a future for the PA deer hunter. A new weapon will create an easier method but it will be shadowed out by the ever decreasing amount of deer we have in the larger portion of this state. People have quit hunting because of less deer and the direction the PAGC has taken not because those hunters felt they needed another method of hunting. This inclusion takes us further from what Pa Has been in terms of Hunting Tradition.

You hit the nail on the head.

As far as lazy? I hunted with a compound bow last year and never missed an evening in the first 11 weeks! Dont tell me about lazy or commitment!why do people stop hunting because of less deer? Its hunting not killing! I have as much fun reguardless if i kill a deer! Just being in the stand is enough motivation for me! I pass tons of deer! Its more fullfilling than shooting most of the time! Imo we shouldnt exclude anyone! (just remember)its not all about you!or just your group. It should be open for all to enjoy. If we dont allow crossbows?whats next?rifled barrels?

Got any numbers on how many archery hunters you have there in VA? What about total licenses sold there?


I'm going to gamble that PA has a lot more archery hunters and feel that we will see a bigger impact with xbow use here.


I think what you non res. don't understand is how many hunters we have here in PA.

I hunted for 16 years in my neighboring state of WV and there is a big difference in hunting pressure between the two states.


As for DougE's comment about the bucks being killed with a rifle later on anyway, is probably true.

If they are killed during archery there is a better chance that those bigger bucks with better genes, may not get the chance to pass those genes on, if they are killed earlier in archery season as opposed to getting killed in rifle season.

The PGC has always used the excuse that big bucks will pass on their genes before they are killed in rifle season and us guys that worry about bucks being "high graded" really have nothing to worry about. Seems the PGC's excuse carrys no weight now.

If there is an increase in buck kills during archery season, I would think the PGC would want to shorten the archery season in the following years to prevenrt overharvest. Then again, knowing how they think, probably not.

This whole situation would be similar to the PGC opening bear season, statewide, right with the rifle deer season. What would happen?

I should probably keep my mouth shut. I'm just giving the PGC more ideas. Heck, they could make more money on the bear license sales by implementing this.

Well, if the likelihood of being unsuccessful or not seeing deer is greater than being successful or seeing deer most people aren't going to spend money on a license to hunt what isn't there. I think that is called common sense. Creating new opportunity should start with providing more opportunity at the game we bought a license to hunt.

Hunt hard! Or go home! Its simple math! Deal with it "if it was easy everyone would do it"

Very good point that nobody who has pushed for this inclusion has given any thought to. It seems the only thought is...How do we get this passed and how can we profit the most from it? Deer management once again takes a back seat. But then again when our deer are so few in numbers that most are killed as soon as they are AR legal reduces any chance of efficiently increasing genetic potential.