RE: MOUNTAIN LION PICTURE IN PA.
 

All I can say is look at the West Virginial Abagoochee.

It will open some eyes. :eek:

RE: MOUNTAIN LION PICTURE IN PA.
 

yes i haveseen BOBCATSin wild. clinton county and potter county have some of wildest areas in state. i hunt both and have for over 50 years.are you trying to say that cougar i saw was a bobcat or i dont know difference?lets talk a little bit here,its up to you if you dont believe they are here. i may have felt same way if i did not see 1 myself in pottersdale,pa and all friends i know that dont lie and grew up with me and hunt a lot, i mean we hunt all time when wives will let us, ha. they are seeing lions also and you can bet that i believe them.let me tell you this.if FINE was not so high and JAIL sentence,you would have your evidence by now.in my opinion, i feel there are more than a few here to.trust me, a COUGAR looks no way near what a BOBCAT looks like ........................35 pds vrs over 100 pds, ha, well, i will let you laugh on that one.take care.

RE: MOUNTAIN LION PICTURE IN PA.
 

What the heck is that?

RE: MOUNTAIN LION PICTURE IN PA.
 

hello, when i called the PGC they also would not come out to pottersdale,pa. to take prints. first, WCO at clearfield,pa.was in his mind telling me THAT LIONS DONT EXIST, I DONT BELIEVE IT.then i said come make prints, i will meet you. he said, GROUND IS TO HARD. so, for whatever reason the PGC does not want public to believe that COUGARS are here.sad, isnt it. this was 13 or so years ago.

RE: MOUNTAIN LION PICTURE IN PA.
 

Yes,I believe the PGC is incompetent.Look at how they handle their deer managment program, their pheasant program, their finances, etc... Speaking of finances, they don't have money to investigate cougars in PA. They're worried about raising hunting license fees because they're going broke. They are lowering the amount of pheasants they stock. They don't have money to continue raising them. How would they fund a cougar study with all the bells and whistles? It is easier to do a half-ast investigation and just say they don't exist. can't say much about PSU. In my mind these are just a bunch of kids doing they study. Maybe I'm wrong.

RE: MOUNTAIN LION PICTURE IN PA.
 

Sproulman judging by your testimony i have no reason to not belief that there are cougars in Pa.

RE: MOUNTAIN LION PICTURE IN PA.
 

DOn't forget PSU and the NYDEC. What's going on with all these keeping it a secret?

btw, anybody know what he meant by West Virginial Abagoochee?

RE: MOUNTAIN LION PICTURE IN PA.
 

They have other things to worry about. They don't care if cougars are here.

RE: MOUNTAIN LION PICTURE IN PA.
 

West Virginial Abagoochee. is a fictious creature. Like a land dwelling piranha. Its a myth like the jackalope.

RE: MOUNTAIN LION PICTURE IN PA.
 

thanks, you will not believe how small thehead looks on a COUGAR in relation to his body,ha. i had to think back at what stuck out the most, the tail, color, head and way he ran.my words were ,WHAT THEH WAS THAT!ha, take care.

RE: MOUNTAIN LION PICTURE IN PA.
 

I can understand not caring about it but with all the evidence that proves their existence why do they go out of their way to keep it quiet and out and out say there isNO evidence. Sproulman is right, it is sad...strange too... like I said before, they must know the truth so why not just admit it? What harm would it do to anybody to just admit what most hunters already know anyway?

btw, thanks for the explination of the West Virginial Abagoochee. Never heard of that one before. Thought it might be another name for big foot which of course has been sighted many times in PA.

RE: MOUNTAIN LION PICTURE IN PA.
 

DougE,
Don't you think it makes perfect sense? Think about it. Colorado is a much bigger state than PA with a lot less people. The mountains are also much bigger and more remote. Given more people and less hiding places it shouldn't be suprising that more are sighted in PA.

RE: MOUNTAIN LION PICTURE IN PA.
 

hmmmmm

still no picture? and did I actually read earlier that someone thinks the PGC stocked hawks and ladybugs too?????

RE: MOUNTAIN LION PICTURE IN PA.
 

Hey, I posted several pictures! You guys just don't believe they prove anything. You won't accept the truth when its right in front of you. Soon livbucks will post more irrefutable evidence!

RE: MOUNTAIN LION PICTURE IN PA.
 

Sorry Sylvan,I didn't see your pictures.... That really is good evidence, my mind is made up.

RE: MOUNTAIN LION PICTURE IN PA.
 

OK, i have sat back and watched this long enough. All of you cougar beleivers, and I will say that I beleive that there may be a few lurking around the state and other areas. All of you are shooting your own selves in the foot by trying to press the issue and make the state and or governmentadmitthese animals being there.

Ok, now when we get the state to admit what you saw was in fact a cougar and that they do exist in the wild. What happens now? The eastern cougar has been deemed possibly extinct, and the proof that they are roaming now brings in the Feds with all their knowledge and the ever popular greeinies and Peta marching right behind them.

Now according to the experts, it will be hard to tell if there are actually genetic differences between the 2 species, if there are two species indeed. But hey, we better protect them just in case, and god forbid don't shoot one. The state will be forced by the feds to alter seasons, close down areas etc. etc. etc. And when populations get to be too many the state WILL NOT be able to shoot even the problem ones because of federal protection. It will take about 2-3 years of battling lawsuits from the greenies before the state could even think of killing a dangerous cat without any recourse in the matter.

IMHO I beleive that you all are trying to pry the lid off pandoras box. I have seen it here in Idaho with the wolves. I saw a wolf here before all the wolf hoopla, I know what I saw was a wolf at the time. I was told that I saw a coyote. I told the Biologist B.S. and it was left at that. The feds stepped in and left a bunch of stray dogs behind. Now the state is crawling with these fleebags and we have to fight to be able to get rid of some. Elk populations are dangerously low in some areas, and I would not even think of archery hunting anymore without a side arm. Myself and others have had wolves circling us while cow calling. Not a pleasant thing to go through.

I have a hard time beleiving any pictures that I see anywhere on the internet, that is why I will almost always question pictures presented onany topic. I do however beleive that it just may be possible that a few cats could be roaming the north east. That is enough for me.

Be careful what you ask for, you just might get it!!!!!

RE: MOUNTAIN LION PICTURE IN PA.
 

:)Very well said Elkcrazy8 !! As far as all you Pa. boys go have any of you picked up a newspaper latley? I will link a few for you. As far as I am concerned I enjoy being told these are escaped pets, that takes that cat right off the Endangered species list!

http://trackincats.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=138&sid=f8522614fe4e103cb5b15d 8cd836df02

RE: MOUNTAIN LION PICTURE IN PA.
 

:DHere is another one for you, Part one and two, also includes a place to make comments.....

http://trackincats.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=155&sid=4d0d74562578da3c62435e 6adc2e1933

RE: MOUNTAIN LION PICTURE IN PA.
 

Cougardaville, thanks for the links, that makes for some interesting reading. If in fact that was the cougar that was shot in 1969, it was a youngster with a female. If this is the case, the cats were from a breeding pair at the time.

I always have to click on these threads and see what is being said. I cut my teeth on hunting in New York and PA, and every year it seemed that someone had something to say on this issue.

After moving to ID,(known big cat country) I have seen several in the wild and there is nothing like it. I missed one with my bow a few years back, the following year I went back to generally the same area on a rifle hunt for deerand had a run in with a 7 foot 2 inch female. I didn't want to kill her even though I had a tag, because I have a fettish for takingpredators with my bow and not a rifle. But she displayed agressive actions and I felt unconfortable with her a meer 15 feet from me. So I did the duty and she now hangs on my wall as a rug.

These animals are everything that the wilds are all about. I can't wait til the next time I see one again.

RE: MOUNTAIN LION PICTURE IN PA.
 

very good info on pa. cougars.i hear today that someone interviewd people in clinton county on the cougars.some did not want to tell their story because they did not want made fun of, like some do on here.thats why if we dont agree that all of us are telling truth, dont make fun of ones that are and you may disagree. we all have our opinions on here,lets just respect the ones that did see a cougar.it hurts their feeling and may keep some from reporting what they saw.i know i was laughed at to and made to feel i did not seeCOUGAR.even the PGC was not interested enough to come out and investigate it back in 1993. tourism that these cougars could bring into our areas here in state of pa. is unreal .this could bring in a lot of tourist dollars to our areas along with elk.

RE: MOUNTAIN LION PICTURE IN PA.
 

A somewhat related note. Panthers are now documented in Iowa. However, there has been no effort to place them on an endangered list. The reason why is that it would be bad press with local folks who do not want legal problems for shooting an animal that is threatening them or livestock.

RE: MOUNTAIN LION PICTURE IN PA.
 

Who do you think pays for the endangered species within the states borders................THE STATE. If anyone thinks otherwise, they better look again. We have the ever so popular wolf within our borders. The feds have given one million dollars to our state to fund the wolves. One third of that goes to the Nez Perce indians to do their share. That leaves a whopping 2/3 of the amount to manage these critters. This goes to reimburse ranchers for lost cattle, population studies, and problemed animal removal after a court hearing. After that the state picks up the bill or turns it all over to the feds.

These cougars are not going to act like they are in a petting zoo for everyone to come and see. I have logged several thousand hours in the cougar rich back country and have seen 5 total in all those hours. They are elusive animals and can be right next to you without you even knowing it.

You had better hope that if they are there, the powers to be don't acknowledge it, or you will be stuck paying the bill to care for the new predator on the block.

I have lived in New York and am very aware how the voting system works.Most people in New York city will never see a cougar in the wild and will have no clue as to what they are voting on when it comes to these cats. The people who will be most likely to encouter one will have to deal with whatever the people in the city have voted for.

I don't want to turn this into a political arguement, but it sure solidifies the reasons that I left such a wonderful place. Guys I still know back in NY are worried about being able to legally keep their 50 cal. muzzleloaders. They would really love a price increaseto lisc. feesfor ongoing analysis of kitty crap and a reduction of doe permits to help maintain a viable food source.

I am afraid that the negatives would outway the positives in any case, and I can see why the states might hold back from anouncing the population of cougars, which to me seem like very few, and not a viable reproducing population.

I am surprised that in all of the reading and studies that have been done, none have centered around a population data base.In areas that have had multiple sitings, it could be checked for population. Here in the west, they will put up scratching posts laced with catnip. Go ahead and laugh but it is done. With the hair samples left at the site. It is possible for biologists to identify how many cats are in the area by looking at the DNA. In this case, it could show that the cats do roam the eastern woods, not only that, a check could be done on the DNA to see if the cats are related to the western species and so forth. ALOT could be gathered from that information.

Then again, it could let the cat out of the bag.................no pun intended.

RE: MOUNTAIN LION PICTURE IN PA.
 

I'm not sure if that is it or not. I think it's something more than
that.Like around here on 2 different occasions the eastern timber
wolve was shot in 2 different years and on different parts of the
state here. One on the western side and one on the eastern side.
And they had to go see the federal magistrate and still we aretold
there is no wolves here? I think it's the same thing here. Several
reportsof the mountain lion and tracks in the snow. They say it is someone's pet, that wasout roaming.At any rate I think it's restore taking a hold up here. I've also seen some pictures of wolves taken
just north of here. The ones that had the pics. was told by our fish
and wildlife personal to shut up about it and not to say a word. So
you would have to figure it out as the real answers will soon show themselves I think.

RE: MOUNTAIN LION PICTURE IN PA.
 

You know, the thing that really ticks me off about all these folks seeing these cougars is the fact that all of them say that if these animals weren't protected they would bag one and that would prove their existance! Well PLEASE, PLEASE bag one!!!!! Don't have any pictures taken with it or anything! Just drop it off along a busy road and walk away. Let someone else find it! That way you could prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that they truly exist, and keep you out of trouble (unless you get caught moving it).
Believe me, I'm a very honest sportsman, and won't kill over my limit on any game, or hunt past legal hours, or hunt over bait, etc.! But as far as I'm concerned IF there are big cats here they are not WILD animals, they are pets that were released or escaped! And that, in my eyes, places them in the catagory of invasive species and should be dispatched with great prejudice!
I get a huge kick out of these folks who say it would be neat to have cougars re-introduced into our commonwealth. The 'yotes are gobbling up our pets on the outskirts of towns all across the state, and they feel things would be better with cougars?

RE: MOUNTAIN LION PICTURE IN PA.
 

Sproulman, tourist trade your kidding right?

RE: MOUNTAIN LION PICTURE IN PA.
 

:eek::eek:Now we are thinking, as far as dropping it off, things happen??.....You are so right about the coyote we are saturated with them! People have no clue what this cougar will do to the deer herds, livestock, pets and then humans:(http://trackincats.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=126&sid=411d7a0137553becc8dd1f ab6907d40b

RE: MOUNTAIN LION PICTURE IN PA.
 

All eastern cougars are protected under the endangered species act. Whether the state deems them within their borders or not. The ONLY way for them to be delisted is for the state to file a claim that there are sustainable numbers within its borders to have it delisted and a management plan is in place to control the numbers. The feds can at anytime step back in and retake the control of these critters.

I am not too familiar with PA's governing body, but I do know what New Yorks is like. I can only imagine Hillary trying to battle the feds over the cougars. She would be welcoming the cats back home again, and taking the guns away from all those who legally posess them. What a mess that would be. It is much easier to ignore the few that may be there than to open up a can of worms, is what I beleive the states take is on this. There will be a point where they can't deny them anymore if the populations increase. That will be when the real fun starts.

RE: MOUNTAIN LION PICTURE IN PA.
 

no, i am not kidding.the PGC has deer killed off here in 2g now.tourism is falling off as hunters are not coming in.now state is trying this PA WILDS IDEA.they are STOCKING elk in our area now.so, i could see posters, elk, bear,coyote,cougar, bobcat,eagles,red hawks.i could see the sign on road saying that. this would bring in crowds that dont hunt deer.no sign would say DEER. i really think thats the way they will try to attract tourism into area.now that CAT is out of bag, oh boy, tourist that will come to see if they can see one .yet, they deny they are here but most likely will not to much longer as sighting are really getting to be NORMAL.TAKE CARE

RE: MOUNTAIN LION PICTURE IN PA.
 

Shoot them all.
I was for them, now I'm not.
They don't exist here.

RE: MOUNTAIN LION PICTURE IN PA.
 

okey dokey.

RE: MOUNTAIN LION PICTURE IN PA.
 

okay, here is one more.....
http://trackincats.com/researchslash.php

Now will somebody post this picture?? Although pictures are out there, I admit at this point of researching this cougar, a body will be the only excepted proof! Even when this happens, and it will....it is NOT an "Original Eastern Cougar", they are gone....extirpated ..New York DEC will tell you that. What are we seeing ??I believe are releases, and I don't think it is by mistake....as in ESCAPE[:o] So while you argue {{{ nicely}}} take some time to think about what to do if you do "encounter a cougar"?
Think about what might be in your kids back yard?

RE: MOUNTAIN LION PICTURE IN PA.
 

Sylvan, I'm sorry to say but anybody that has even heard of any of those picture editing programs can tell you that, that pic is a fraud, you can tell by the background of the "mt. lion" and the surrounding land. Its a little different, and the pic is blurry but the mt. lion pic looks a little out of place. Now I'm not calling you a liar or your christian friends liars but somethings fishy bout that pic.

RE: MOUNTAIN LION PICTURE IN PA.
 

wow, I really wish I would have picked up that dead cat I seen....didn't realize that it was such a hot topic.....and yes that pic posted earlier was definitely a fake..adobe photoshop could do that easily......maybe I'll get lucky and see another cat soon!

RE: MOUNTAIN LION PICTURE IN PA.
 

Zdeerslayer,
Do you really think so?Maybe youshould look at the pic more carefully. In it you can find the truthof its authenticity. I wouldn't monkey around posting it if I wasn't sure it represents what I'm trying to say. That picture isno more of a fraud thanany pic you will ever see here thatattempts to prove ML's exist in PA.

RE: MOUNTAIN LION PICTURE IN PA.
 

Could it be that you have received the pics from Sproulman?

RE: MOUNTAIN LION PICTURE IN PA.
 

wait till you get pictures i sent you. dont pee your pants when you see the SIZE of that cougar.

RE: MOUNTAIN LION PICTURE IN PA.
 

hello, one thing you can rest assured is the photo i sent in to livbucks is not doctored in any way.i sent him copy of of original picture. i could not send him original because i had to get it back right away to owner.i hope everyone does look at my photo andgives their opinion on here. trust me, its not doctored and was taken in the pottersdale.pa. area.take care

RE: MOUNTAIN LION PICTURE IN PA.
 

I can't wait. They should be here tomorrow. I will do my best on the scan and post it right up. I believe there are a few here, but maybe not in our best interest to prove it to the federal government, from what I am hearing. Are we better off dealing with them in more discreet means?

RE: MOUNTAIN LION PICTURE IN PA.
 

Me neither! :D:D:D

RE: MOUNTAIN LION PICTURE IN PA.
 

Is it this big?