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RE: PGC and Gary Alt' Newspaper comments?
Things that make you go HMMM!
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RE: PGC and Gary Alt' Newspaper comments?
ORIGINAL: ddear Now lets see if I was blowing smoke about the effects of AR's. the following is the harvest data for 2.5+ buck both before and after AR's were implemented. Note that the 2004 harvest of 2.5+ buck was also 62K. Statewide data from 1981 through 2003 showing the buck harvest, percentage of 2 1⁄2 and older bucks harvested and the number of 2 1⁄2 year old and older bucks harvested for each year. Year-------buck harvest------% 2.5 plus years old---# of 2.5 year old buck harvested 1981--------N/A------------------18.4------------------------N/A 1982--------122,264-------------20.3------------------------24,819 1983--------120,291-------------21.7------------------------26,103 1984--------135,388-------------22.8------------------------30,868 1985--------136,104-------------20.0------------------------27,221 1986--------150,363-------------21.2------------------------31,877 1987--------157,559-------------18.9------------------------29,779 1988--------163,113-------------19.0------------------------30,991 1989--------169,814-------------19.4------------------------32,944 1990--------170,099-------------17.9------------------------30,448 1991--------149,633-------------18.0------------------------26,934 1992--------163,195-------------18.5------------------------30,191 1993--------165,250-------------20.8------------------------34,372 1994--------157,030-------------17.5------------------------27,480 1995--------182,235-------------17.4------------------------31,709 1996--------153,432-------------16.2------------------------24,856 1997--------176,677-------------18.6------------------------32,862 1998--------181,449-------------19.4------------------------35,201 1999--------194,371-------------20.0------------------------38,874 2000--------203,221-------------18.3------------------------37,189 2001--------203,247-------------21.6------------------------43,901 2002--------165,416-------------31.8------------------------52,602 2003--------142,270-------------43.6------------------------62,030 Now please note that the 2.5+ buck harvest increased more from 2000 to 2002 before AR's were implemented, then it increased from 2002 to 2004 after AR's were implemented. The increase prior to AR's was due to low BB harvests, more BB being recruited and fewer adult buck being harvested as antlerless deer. the exact oppposite has occurred since AR's were implemenetd so the 2.5+ buck harvesat will continue to decline and we will sooon be harvesting fewer 2.5+ buck than we did in 2002. Now as far as the B/D ratio is concerned, I can provide a link that shows our B/D ratio in 1983 was 1:1.99 ,if you are still interested in seeing that I can support my postion with facts and that it is not based on my personal opinion. I agree that the increase in button buck kills leads to lower recruitment of yearling bucks, and therefore, fewer yearlings become fewer 2.5, and so on down the line, but I don't see in the table where the 2.5 yr old harvest has started to decline. I think it will merelybe a function of drastically lower deer numbers, but I don't see that in this table yet. Maybe the missing 2004 numbers show that? |
RE: PGC and Gary Alt' Newspaper comments?
I think AJ and BT have hit the nail on the head when it comes to DD. I spent some time reading alot of his past posts and he is quite negative. His calculator also seems to work differently than mine also.:D
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RE: PGC and Gary Alt' Newspaper comments?
ORIGINAL: PADOUG I think AJ and BT have hit the nail on the head when it comes to DD. I spent some time reading alot of his past posts and he is quite negative. His calculator also seems to work differently than mine also.:D T in PA3 knows who I am...he sold me a couple of great trail cams last year. |
RE: PGC and Gary Alt' Newspaper comments?
when dd posts something there are a few that gang on him and then it gets negative. but i look at it as others are negative first. also once you get more than one or two agree w/ dd then a MOD will lock it up.. funny how it works here
ORIGINAL: PADOUG I think AJ and BT have hit the nail on the head when it comes to DD. I spent some time reading alot of his past posts and he is quite negative. His calculator also seems to work differently than mine also.:D |
RE: PGC and Gary Alt' Newspaper comments?
WE all like ddear!
The true carrying capacity of the land varys so much from one area to another they can never be a set number of deer every where.With alot of small farms being turned in to housing deer are losing alot of ground fast. Our area in the north west could support more deer than we have now.Most land here is private & most is posted because we don't want the does slaughtered.One of the questions I have with the QDM people is why you would want a 1 to 1 ratio of bucks to does on your land.Once that doe is bred your buck heads to my woods where we guard the does.Its kind of like "the build it and they will come" idea. As far as antler restrictions ,the deer hunter in me likes them but it is not fair to the average joe that hunts deer 2.5 days per year.AR were put in place as a bait & switch idea by the great one.Kill all the does and you will be rewarded with wall hanger bucks. ddear posts alot of #s to prove that the buck kill is down & it is, but that is because of the over all drop in dear numbers.I think the kill reports do not tell the true story in the success of AR because once a buck lives through a full year as an adult their habits change dramaticly .Dear seasons are long with archery,early ML regular rifle, late archery & ml a buck that lives through this is a lot smarter next year & every year after that these dear become very hard to kill. The PGC 100 year forestry plan is one of the worst ever.We are loosing millions of dollars by not harvesting these trees.This timber should be cut at least three times in 100 years.A younger forest would be beneficial to all wildlife. |
RE: PGC and Gary Alt' Newspaper comments?
i stated the the 2004 2.5+ buck harvest was 62K. I didn't add it to the table because I would have been accused of altering the data. The total harvest in 2004 was 124 K ,so we only harvested 62K 1.5 buck and carried over 62K 1.5 buck to 2005. If we lose 15% to normal non-hunting mortality there will be 52.7 K PS 2.5 buck. If we harvest 85% of those buck the 2.5 buck harvest will be around 44.8K plus the few 3.5 buck that were carried over from 2004.
I think it will merely be a function of drastically lower deer numbers, but I don't see that in this table yet. Maybe the missing 2004 numbers show that? |
RE: PGC and Gary Alt' Newspaper comments?
The true carrying capacity of the land varys so much from one area to another they can never be a set number of deer every |
RE: PGC and Gary Alt' Newspaper comments?
If that was someones attempt to suggest that I am ddear reinventing himself, you done messed up. :D Accepting you at your word that you're not him, heres some history you might wish to know. He got banned as deaddeer with hundreds of similar posts and turned around and came back on with a womans name in his profile butwas quickly exposed. (The banningwas not for the content of his posts but for the personal attacks and intentional flame wars worse than anything you presently see here)I, for one don't dislike him but it is easy to get riled up when he starts his barrage of statistics that often include his own spin.A look back in the archives will showsome of those distortions having been exposed. He is crafty and clever when he inserts his own spin and most points he makes require a bit of research to exposed the lie within. When he's faced with a cold hard fact disputing his position he changes the subject or hits with a new twisted barrage. He does have a talent for crunching numbers and could be quite helpful to allof usif we could simply trust him to keep his biased mission out of the mix. I welcome you as a new member but maybe a little research into the past here would have been in order before you jumped into something you admitted you've only seeen a small part of. I'll also mention some of his most blatant distortions have been deleted byseveral of the mods and NOT just by AJ52 Anyway, welcome to our forum!!:D Germaine, I'd rather push a Chevy than drive a Dodge! A statement I can truly make cause I've never had to push my Chevy;). Oh and I just had the boom lowered by my doc. No beer till further notice.... maybe never:(Had a bout with pnuemonia last week and the virus got to the ticker. It'll heal but it's gonna take ayear or moreand no barley pops till its better:(:(:(:( |
RE: PGC and Gary Alt' Newspaper comments?
Accepting you at your word that you're not him, heres some history you might wish to know. He got banned as deaddeer with hundreds of similar posts and turned around and came back on with a womans name in his profile but was quickly exposed. (The banning was not for the content of his posts but for the personal attacks and intentional flame wars worse than anything you presently see here) next time try and get your facts straight. If you had done your homework and checked the members list you would have known that deadear is still an active member. deaddear Fawn 0 12/10/2003 |
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