NEED HELP, QUICK!!!
07-27-2008, 07:25 PM
#11
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 6,867
RE: NEED HELP, QUICK!!!
i never said anything about a 308. i said a 7.62 i guest i should have made it clear the 7.62x39
ORIGINAL: homers brother
Over and over I've seen folks here eithersuggest its possibilityor ask about putting a 7.62mm (or .308/.260/.243) AR upper receiver on a5.56mm (.223) AR lower receiver.
Folks, let's think about this....
Will a .308 (.243, .260, etc.) fit into a .223 magazine?
Since the magazine well in a .223 AR lower receiver is EXPRESSLY designed for .223-length magazines, does it matter that the upper might be designed for .308-length cartridges? Try jamming an M14 or L1A1 magazine into the magazine well of your .223 AR-15 and you'll understand.
See where I'm going here? Neither the suggestion or the question pass the common-sense test.
I have yet to see a .308-length upper receiver that's designed for a .223-length lower reciever. The AR-15/M-16/M-4 has been adapted to cartridges such as the 7.62x39, the 6.8mm SPC, and the 9mm (all shorter or similar in length to the 5.56x45mm NATO), but a .308-length cartridge requires a .308-length (AR-10) lower reciever.
Over and over I've seen folks here eithersuggest its possibilityor ask about putting a 7.62mm (or .308/.260/.243) AR upper receiver on a5.56mm (.223) AR lower receiver.
Folks, let's think about this....
Will a .308 (.243, .260, etc.) fit into a .223 magazine?
Since the magazine well in a .223 AR lower receiver is EXPRESSLY designed for .223-length magazines, does it matter that the upper might be designed for .308-length cartridges? Try jamming an M14 or L1A1 magazine into the magazine well of your .223 AR-15 and you'll understand.
See where I'm going here? Neither the suggestion or the question pass the common-sense test.
I have yet to see a .308-length upper receiver that's designed for a .223-length lower reciever. The AR-15/M-16/M-4 has been adapted to cartridges such as the 7.62x39, the 6.8mm SPC, and the 9mm (all shorter or similar in length to the 5.56x45mm NATO), but a .308-length cartridge requires a .308-length (AR-10) lower reciever.
07-27-2008, 08:14 PM
#14
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: WY
Posts: 2,056
RE: NEED HELP, QUICK!!!
Tim, Stubble: YOU'RE NOT LISTENING (or reading!)
I say again: (quoted from above) "I have yet to see a .308-length upper receiver that's designed for a .223-length lower reciever. The AR-15/M-16/M-4 has been adapted to cartridges such as the 7.62x39, the 6.8mm SPC, and the 9mm (all shorter or similar in length to the 5.56x45mm NATO), but a .308-length cartridge requires a .308-length (AR-10) lower reciever."
Tim: Please read above. Where did I say that the 7.62x39 is not compatible with the AR-15 (.223) receiver? I didn't say that, did I? Didn't I say that"The AR-15/M-16/M-4 has been adapted to cartridges such as the 7.62x39, ....."? If you're under the impression that 7.62mm (x39 Russian) = 7.62mm (x51 NATO, aka .308 Winchester), I suggest you go find a reloading manual or something that'll describe the difference. If you compared the two cartridgesside-to-side, we wouldn't be talking about this now. Please also note that the original poster is asking about a .308 (7.62x51) AR, not a 7.62x39.
Stubble: Thanks for the link, but I feel the need to point out that this retailer has mis-labeled the DPMS product you're referring to. A quick trip to the DPMS site will yield that the rifle you're pointing out is marketed by DPMS as the "Panther(TM)LRT-SASS", not the "DPMS LRT-SASS ar15 .308". Generically, their .308 rifle appears to benamed the LRT. Your dealer added the "ar15" on their own. Yes, it's an AR-type rifle, but it's less AR-15 than it is AR-10. Rock River calls their .308 rifle the "LAR-8", Armalite calls it the...you may not believe it... "AR-10."
Again, the danger posed here is to the unknowing, who'd unwittingly buy a .308 upper and find that it will not work with their .223 lower. If you still don't believe me, please contact Bushmaster or DPMS (or Rock River, or Armalite)directly and ask this question:
"Will a .308 upper receiver fit on my .223 AR-15 lower?"
If they say their .308 upper will fit on my .223 lower, I'll stop posting here completely and recognize you as the masters.
I say again: (quoted from above) "I have yet to see a .308-length upper receiver that's designed for a .223-length lower reciever. The AR-15/M-16/M-4 has been adapted to cartridges such as the 7.62x39, the 6.8mm SPC, and the 9mm (all shorter or similar in length to the 5.56x45mm NATO), but a .308-length cartridge requires a .308-length (AR-10) lower reciever."
Tim: Please read above. Where did I say that the 7.62x39 is not compatible with the AR-15 (.223) receiver? I didn't say that, did I? Didn't I say that"The AR-15/M-16/M-4 has been adapted to cartridges such as the 7.62x39, ....."? If you're under the impression that 7.62mm (x39 Russian) = 7.62mm (x51 NATO, aka .308 Winchester), I suggest you go find a reloading manual or something that'll describe the difference. If you compared the two cartridgesside-to-side, we wouldn't be talking about this now. Please also note that the original poster is asking about a .308 (7.62x51) AR, not a 7.62x39.
Stubble: Thanks for the link, but I feel the need to point out that this retailer has mis-labeled the DPMS product you're referring to. A quick trip to the DPMS site will yield that the rifle you're pointing out is marketed by DPMS as the "Panther(TM)LRT-SASS", not the "DPMS LRT-SASS ar15 .308". Generically, their .308 rifle appears to benamed the LRT. Your dealer added the "ar15" on their own. Yes, it's an AR-type rifle, but it's less AR-15 than it is AR-10. Rock River calls their .308 rifle the "LAR-8", Armalite calls it the...you may not believe it... "AR-10."
Again, the danger posed here is to the unknowing, who'd unwittingly buy a .308 upper and find that it will not work with their .223 lower. If you still don't believe me, please contact Bushmaster or DPMS (or Rock River, or Armalite)directly and ask this question:
"Will a .308 upper receiver fit on my .223 AR-15 lower?"
If they say their .308 upper will fit on my .223 lower, I'll stop posting here completely and recognize you as the masters.
07-27-2008, 08:19 PM
#15
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: fort mcmurray alberta canada
Posts: 5,667
RE: NEED HELP, QUICK!!!
Again, the danger posed here is to the unknowing, who'd unwittingly buy a .308 upper and find that it will not work with their .223 lower. If you still don't believe me, please contact Bushmaster or DPMS (or Rock River, or Armalite)directly and ask this question:
07-27-2008, 09:18 PM
#16
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Body in SE WI, mind in U.P.
Posts: 4,781
RE: NEED HELP, QUICK!!!
You can get an upper for an AR-15 that will handle everything up to and including the .50 BMG. If you have a case OAL longer than 2.260" it will be a single shot.
The various 308s, 243s, 260s etc are normally chambered in AR-10s.
The various 308s, 243s, 260s etc are normally chambered in AR-10s.
07-28-2008, 07:27 AM
#17
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 6,867
RE: NEED HELP, QUICK!!!
you do not need to do that i called bushmaster man. you Can take a factory 556 lower and drop a 7.62x39 on it with the only change being a mag sized for the 5.56
ORIGINAL: Adirondack Hunter
if i did that id have to get a new lower, the mags are WAY bigger than the 556 mags
if i did that id have to get a new lower, the mags are WAY bigger than the 556 mags
07-28-2008, 07:36 AM
#18
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 6,867
RE: NEED HELP, QUICK!!!
i have seen them side by side i know you can not use a 7.62x51 in a .223 i never said you could use the .308 in the .223
I guest i should have typed 7.62x39 not just 7.62
but i would not go buy a 5.56 and then a 7.62 upper. if it is for long range.
I would buy the 308 and use it for anything .
in fact i am looking at buying another it will be the
lrt sass in 308 from dpms. i love that rifle
here is the available cat. sizes from dpms[*].204 Ruger[*].223 Remington[*]5.56x45mm[*]6.8mm Remington SPC[*]7.62x39mm[*].243 Winchester[*].260 Remington[*].308 Winchester[*].300 Remington SAUM[*].338 Federal[*]6.5 Creedmoor
I guest i should have typed 7.62x39 not just 7.62
but i would not go buy a 5.56 and then a 7.62 upper. if it is for long range.
I would buy the 308 and use it for anything .
in fact i am looking at buying another it will be the
lrt sass in 308 from dpms. i love that rifle
here is the available cat. sizes from dpms[*].204 Ruger[*].223 Remington[*]5.56x45mm[*]6.8mm Remington SPC[*]7.62x39mm[*].243 Winchester[*].260 Remington[*].308 Winchester[*].300 Remington SAUM[*].338 Federal[*]6.5 Creedmoor
ORIGINAL: homers brother
Tim, Stubble: YOU'RE NOT LISTENING (or reading!)
I say again: (quoted from above) "I have yet to see a .308-length upper receiver that's designed for a .223-length lower reciever. The AR-15/M-16/M-4 has been adapted to cartridges such as the 7.62x39, the 6.8mm SPC, and the 9mm (all shorter or similar in length to the 5.56x45mm NATO), but a .308-length cartridge requires a .308-length (AR-10) lower reciever."
Tim: Please read above. Where did I say that the 7.62x39 is not compatible with the AR-15 (.223) receiver? I didn't say that, did I? Didn't I say that"The AR-15/M-16/M-4 has been adapted to cartridges such as the 7.62x39, ....."? If you're under the impression that 7.62mm (x39 Russian) = 7.62mm (x51 NATO, aka .308 Winchester), I suggest you go find a reloading manual or something that'll describe the difference. If you compared the two cartridgesside-to-side, we wouldn't be talking about this now. Please also note that the original poster is asking about a .308 (7.62x51) AR, not a 7.62x39.
Stubble: Thanks for the link, but I feel the need to point out that this retailer has mis-labeled the DPMS product you're referring to. A quick trip to the DPMS site will yield that the rifle you're pointing out is marketed by DPMS as the "Panther(TM)LRT-SASS", not the "DPMS LRT-SASS ar15 .308". Generically, their .308 rifle appears to benamed the LRT. Your dealer added the "ar15" on their own. Yes, it's an AR-type rifle, but it's less AR-15 than it is AR-10. Rock River calls their .308 rifle the "LAR-8", Armalite calls it the...you may not believe it... "AR-10."
Again, the danger posed here is to the unknowing, who'd unwittingly buy a .308 upper and find that it will not work with their .223 lower. If you still don't believe me, please contact Bushmaster or DPMS (or Rock River, or Armalite)directly and ask this question:
"Will a .308 upper receiver fit on my .223 AR-15 lower?"
If they say their .308 upper will fit on my .223 lower, I'll stop posting here completely and recognize you as the masters.
Tim, Stubble: YOU'RE NOT LISTENING (or reading!)
I say again: (quoted from above) "I have yet to see a .308-length upper receiver that's designed for a .223-length lower reciever. The AR-15/M-16/M-4 has been adapted to cartridges such as the 7.62x39, the 6.8mm SPC, and the 9mm (all shorter or similar in length to the 5.56x45mm NATO), but a .308-length cartridge requires a .308-length (AR-10) lower reciever."
Tim: Please read above. Where did I say that the 7.62x39 is not compatible with the AR-15 (.223) receiver? I didn't say that, did I? Didn't I say that"The AR-15/M-16/M-4 has been adapted to cartridges such as the 7.62x39, ....."? If you're under the impression that 7.62mm (x39 Russian) = 7.62mm (x51 NATO, aka .308 Winchester), I suggest you go find a reloading manual or something that'll describe the difference. If you compared the two cartridgesside-to-side, we wouldn't be talking about this now. Please also note that the original poster is asking about a .308 (7.62x51) AR, not a 7.62x39.
Stubble: Thanks for the link, but I feel the need to point out that this retailer has mis-labeled the DPMS product you're referring to. A quick trip to the DPMS site will yield that the rifle you're pointing out is marketed by DPMS as the "Panther(TM)LRT-SASS", not the "DPMS LRT-SASS ar15 .308". Generically, their .308 rifle appears to benamed the LRT. Your dealer added the "ar15" on their own. Yes, it's an AR-type rifle, but it's less AR-15 than it is AR-10. Rock River calls their .308 rifle the "LAR-8", Armalite calls it the...you may not believe it... "AR-10."
Again, the danger posed here is to the unknowing, who'd unwittingly buy a .308 upper and find that it will not work with their .223 lower. If you still don't believe me, please contact Bushmaster or DPMS (or Rock River, or Armalite)directly and ask this question:
"Will a .308 upper receiver fit on my .223 AR-15 lower?"
If they say their .308 upper will fit on my .223 lower, I'll stop posting here completely and recognize you as the masters.
07-28-2008, 08:02 PM
#19
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: WY
Posts: 2,056
RE: NEED HELP, QUICK!!!
Tim - we're not talking about a 7.62x39. I KNOW you can put a 7.62x39 upper on an AR-15 lower - you have a tendency of abbreviating "7.62", leaving off the "x39", which could serve to suggest instead the "7.62x51", which we're calling the ".308" here and which is NOT compatible (as you've now stated) with a .223 lower.
Stubble - you're probably not the first person to be misled by poor (inaccurate) advertising. Again, go to the mfr's website and you'll see that the rifle you linked is not an AR-15, though yes - it does have a .308-sized lower receiver.
Bri - Now, who in the heck would want a single-shot .308 out of a semi-auto .223?
.50 BMG maybe, but not a .308 (.243/.260, etc.).
Stubble - you're probably not the first person to be misled by poor (inaccurate) advertising. Again, go to the mfr's website and you'll see that the rifle you linked is not an AR-15, though yes - it does have a .308-sized lower receiver.
Bri - Now, who in the heck would want a single-shot .308 out of a semi-auto .223?
.50 BMG maybe, but not a .308 (.243/.260, etc.).
