Your opinions please...
I want to buy a big bore, probably a 45-70. Local shops have several to choose from but I don't really have much experience with short barreled rifles. The muzzle velocity is fairly low already, how would the shorter barrel affect it?, also in terms of recoil. I use my friends 1895 22" barrel regularly with handloads that are a little hot and feel comfortable with that. Or should I just say the heck with it and get the 444 and have a mv in the 2200 fps range?

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i just a marlin 45.70. i use a 300 gr jhp. shhot just fine but kicks like amule. having deaccelerator pad put on.

Either rifle would be a fine choice, I have the 444p Outfitter and it does an excellent job on whitetails, but the noise is brutal even in hunting situations. I would sooner have a sore shoulder than bleeding ears! <img src=icon_smile_blackeye.gif border=0 align=middle> I would suggest: if you can, get one that isn`t ported, because the dampened recoil just isn`t worth it..

ALL DAY, EVERY DAY,IN THE WOODS...

They make those big bore lever guns in shorter barrels because it doesn't take a bullet long to stabilize if it's only moving at 1800fps and incredibly fat. I love my short barreled .44 mag Marlin 1894 rancher, fast handling, and pretty hard hitting with the handloads I've packed in it.

As far as your choice, I'd go with the .45-70 just for personal preference and tradition (family thing), but you'll HAVE to roll your own, the factory ammo available isn't worth much since it's really loaded down to keep those guys that still shoot the old weak trapdoor rifles from blowing up their rifles.

That said, the .444 is showing A LOT of promise, and will probably phase out the .45-70 in time (thicker case walls with lighter bullets=fast and powerful, and in the same gun). I've heard, although never measured one, that it's only a .44 mag case plus an inch, so your bullet diameter really isn't a .44&quot;, it's a .429&quot; (right? manuals aren't handy at the moment), so it's not really that close to the .45-70 in bullet shape/weight, but close enough, and with the added velocity, deer won't tell the difference.

My vote will stay with the .45-70, just because I love it, but it's your call to make.

Screw the 10 ring, keep them in the zero!!!

It's been my experience and the ballistics will tell also that the faster & lighter bullet of the .444 shoots flatter farther than the heavier 45\70. Both will stop a train though. The Marlin .444SS has a longer barrel than the outfitter model. The .444 is a great round out to 200 yards but if your looking for a big bore, then range isn't your primary reason for buying a rifle. Either rifle has impressive knockdown power. It's personal preference, kinda like between Ford and Chevy..... This didn't help a bit did it?

&quot;Fast is fine, but accurate is final&quot;. &quot;Wild Bill&quot; Hickok - 1869

The biggest problem with the 444 is there aren't many choices of ammo available and most companies don't make rifle bullets in .429 caliber . I haven't seen anything but remingtons loaded for it .

Remington, Corbon, Buffalo bore, and Hornady (again) loads for the 444 Marlin. IMO the .444 offers better ballistics and has plenty of punch for anything on this planet. The 45-70 is a great cartrige but it just hasn't impressed me that much.

get what i have...

a marlin 1895M in 450marlin. a fine round with little kick

I would take the 45/70. You can buy hot loads from the same places as mentioned above. I have three 45/70's and there is just something about this old cartridge that kind of grows on you. IMO