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Will you stick to the f#$%!ing subject. This is a venison recipie thread.

Tom

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Red; You are making an interesting observation but to me it has always been a matter of preference regarding large game . I prefer the 06 I like the options I can get handloading ie bullet weight powder charge.
It is not that I don't want to try anything larger I don't really have the need for one.

I don't have to tell you that a well placed shot with an 06 and any of the larger game animals will go done like a stone.

Anyway, keep shootin those magnums and I'll see you in camp.

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You guys can find it funny or just plain assnine,but it is what it is.

Yes it was partly bullets I was using,(Federal Classic 180 gr SP)but the bullet never came apart,there was 4 perfect mushroomed bullets laying either in the rib cage or just under the skin.Now to me that seemed under powered.
I have used the sameshells but out of a .338 win mag and 225 gr and at 200 yds have drove through the shoulder and to be never seen again.
For me I lost confidence in the 30-06,and I have always been a very,very big advocate for Premium bullets out of the 30-06 for elk.It has been my personal minimum for elk.I like something that can drive premium bullet at least 2800 FPS of 165 gr or more thats why I opt
for a Magnum.My much anymore go to gun is the 300 Ultra Mag (180 noslers)or my .338 Win Mag. (210 gr Noslers).
You never be under gunned,why use something that is adequate when you can use something great,it's all gravy after that.
BBJ

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Well Jack, if you've lost confidence in the '06, then by all means switch to something in which you will have confidence. Nothing at all wrong with that. Your conclusion about the '06 (based on your own observation) is certainly valid, for you. Others who have had dissimilar results, may have drawn a differnet conclusion. Your experience could be the result of just bad luck. But, in any case, do what works for YOU.

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I put five shots through the chest of a Mule deer Buck some years back with one of my 280's After the firstr shot his front legs spread just a tad. but he just stood there and took four more rounds. When I went to put more shells in the gun and looked back at him, he was laying there dead. I am sure now looking back that he was stone dead after the first shot. His nerves and muscels must have just locked up for a minute because I know that it doesn't take five 140 grain Nosler Bullets at 3000 fps to drop a mule deer. Strange things happen and I am sure that in this case the result would have been the same with my 7 Mag shooting the same bullets.. In all my years with the 30-06 I have never had it fail to drop elk, deer and moose pretty close to where the stood.. In some cases things happen and I have seen it happen with magnums as well. A guy that I guided several different years hit a Mule deer doe three times with his 340 Weatherby and still required a finishing shot. Any one of his shots should have flattened that deer. He was one of the fellows I mentioned earlier that kept bringing a bigger rifle every year. I never saw the guy again after that fall but he is probably using a 50 BMG by now.:D. Nothing is for sure in hunting. All you can do is place the shot well and wait for the results..

Sorry about interupting the reciepe session.:D

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Lemme add my whiff of stink to this discussion :D Back in my 400 pound days I used to eat tons of beef...now in my 200 pound days I stick to wild game..usually venison. Yes BC good ol northern WV stinkin acorn gorged run to death scrawny whitetails. :DJamesB the grain fed mule deer was some unfair teasing...lol. I told ya I want one of those..lol. Elk seemed to be real good..just havent ever got to kill one or eat very much of it. One of these days. Yes I plan on using the .270 for it also.;)

As far as the magnum/non magnum deal more than once I have read about the non magnum shooters like myselfbeing sissies on here and whining bout recoil. So I will stick to my SPS theory on the magnum shooters.:D

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Man that chicken fried deer steak was great the other night. There are few better meals IMO. I mix Beef with my Deer Burger though. The pure deer burger is pretty dry. I like a 50/50 mix.. 270 for elk??? How could you? You better hope its not one of the saber tooth elk.:D:D:D

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Now we are talking food????? That's another subject i happen to be very fond of... :>))

I'm lucky to have lived my entire life in game rich area's and i've ate my share of moose, deer, caribou, bear ect.. ect...

I just about can't even stand the smell of a mose any longer, and wouldn't shoot one if it hung itself up in my back yard. I do still like Caribou and deer, but i pretty much only hunt deer these days.

I kinda like to add about 1/3 pork to my venison burger when i cook it so i tend to do that. As for steak, it is hard to beat a chicken fried back steak!!!

Drilling Man

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There is so little fat in Elk and many other similar game meats, that they don't hold together well, when ground and made into burgers. Adding a little fat (in the form of some other type of meat) works well. I prefer my Elk sliced into medallions...then grilled medium rare. It doesn't get much better than that, IMO. Also, for the "gamy" flavor of these meats (which puts off some people), I have found that adding 1 teaspoon of dry or brown mustard kills all of the "gamy" flavor. My wife would even eat Elk that way...and she was as finicky as one could be.

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I mix some pork and sausage seasoning with some of the burger and beef with some. I like elk steak about any way but oven baked is hard to beat. Very good food when shot with a standard or Magnum rifle.;)

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North America = 1 gun ........300 Ultra ....nothing else needed!!:D

*and yes Bigcountry, I got in this late, but I would have said "You only carry that darn slug gun anyway"!!!!:D

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Mossy, I can't take any of your post seriously with Rick James up there. I am sorry man.:D:D

I think all member should email mossy and demand he changes his picture.

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I guess I am just lazy but most of the time I put the deer burger in the George Foreman salt it and eat it....I dont have the patience for all these exquisite recipes.:DYes I do use the Magnum version of the Foreman grill!! [8D]

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Some of these answers go back a few pages. I was gonna adress the point that was made that the magnum guys are as bad as the anti-magnum guys. I disageePARTIALLY. The anti-mag guys bitch and name call EVERY SINGLE time a mag is mentioned.I dont recall a mag lover EVER raiseing hell about useing standard calibers on deer sized game. When it comes to elk and the lower end standard calibers(270 25-06ect...I cant recall a mag lover ever saying that a 30-06 is worthless or inadequate for elk, some have said that they preferr bigger, but not that the 06 WONT do.) the mag loversARE as bad. The thing that kills me is when guys say the MAGNUM CALIBERS are no more effective than the standards. COME ON.... the shooters may not be as effective w/ a magnum, but that is not the caliber not perfroming, thats the shooter. Any comment about the smaller calibers being as effective needs to be qualified w/a comment about the shooter not being able to handle thecaliber. I catch hell both ways, I have my wife and kids shooting 6mm (which James B ,whos oppinions i do respect, keeps telling me are an inferior caliber:D), while I shoot the 300win. mag. Bottom line, if your hunting big and tough animals like elk the 6mm is better than the 243, the 25-06 is better than the 6mm, the 270 is better than the 25-06, the 280 or 7mag are better than the 270, the30-06 is better than the 280or 7mag, the 300mags are better than the 06, ....ect. The real issue is whether yourresponsible enough to know your limits. If you cant handle recoil very well, just say so use a 280, no problem, youdang sure dont want to use a 338 ultra mag. But dont go on about how the 280 is just as good a performer as the 338RUM. TheCOMBINATION ofYOU and the 280 are better suited to hunting elk than areYOU and the 338RUM.The coment about the 20 hunters w/ standard calibers VS 20 magnums is ignorant at best. Come out west and me, BBJ,And red will take you on with our deer wounding magnums. James B - the point I was makeing about the# of woundeddeer by caliber was based on the number people useing those calibers. The more popular a caliber is the more slobs your gonna get useing it, not thatany caliber is inherently a deer wounder.

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I don't put any fat in my ground venision. I just cook it to medium rare. If it doesn't stick together put an egg white in it or the whole egg.

Mossy - The Rick James thing is hilarious. Keep it.

Tom

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I'm fixin' to go home and eat some deer venison barbeque. My German/Yankee wife can do anything with venison.:D

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I am not sure that within reason I consider any caliber inferior. I have seen as a guide, a lot of deer wounded with the 243. However just as elk are wounded with 30-06 and 300 win Mags, it not the caliber as a rule.. I have hit deer and bigger critters at times with the 300 Win Mag and had them drop in their tracks just as I have seen my wife kill every deer she has taken with one shot from her 250 Savage. I have hit deer with the 300 Win mag that ran just as they did when hit with any other cartridge. A heart shot with any caliber is apt to leave the critter with the ability to run a 100 yards or so. There is a difference to be sure between a 30-06 and a 300 Win Mag. However, they shoot the same bullet and depending on the load, there may be very little difference. Sometimes as little as 100 fps. In those cases I on't expect to see much difference in performance. Likewise as a long time shooter of the 300 Win Mag, I have seen very little difference in the performance of the 180 grain bullet driven 300 fps fastet than the 30-06 given good shot placement. This is a must with either caliber. There is of course more difference when you compare the 30-06 or 308 to the 30-378 Weatherby. However, and this is where my disagreement sometimes starts. There is a cartain level of performance that I deem a must for certain situations. Now you can have more than you need without a problem but I am of the mind that you can have enough without going to the excess. More is not always better to me and thats where I differ from many others. Just as I believe that there is almost never a case when the margin of error pays off. A poor hit with any caliber is just that. A poor hit a wounded animal is the result. Then it comes down to many who shoot to far in some terrain, have almost no chance of recovering the animal. I have seen guys take shots across canyons that would take them several hours to get to the animal if they did hit it well. This is not just a magnum problem. Again its a hunter problem

To much velocity is as bad as not enough when it comes to bullet performance but many don't give a thought to that. Just velocity. I have many examples of this but it would take pages to get accross and while some understand what I mean, others will never see the light. I don't disagree much with what NV Mike has said.;). I am no stranger to shooting the magnum rifles. I can now set back and see both sides very clearly.

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yeah, I hear ya James, I would rather trail elk for you w/ handloaded 06, :Dthan 90% of the Joes out there w/ factory loads in a 300win. mag[:o]. Did you ever get my PM with my questions about the various 6.5mm's and 7mm's. Also could a 280rem be loaded light to start w/ until the kid gets a bit bigger? If so he may never need to go any bigger.

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I had several friends who took 300 Win. Mag. cases and necked them up to .375. I'm not sure why, as i never liked that wildcat. Anyway, i always said .375 bullets need to be 270 grain of heavier to get decent penetration in bigger game, and then you need a fairly big charge or powder to make that heavy bullet perform and along with all that comes the recoil.

One of my friends shot a moose with his quartering away at about 200 yards. The bull ran off, but bled out and died. When my friend quartered it he found his 270 grain bullet stuck in the brisket and i think you could have reloaded it again, only the little bit of lead on the tip was missing!!! All it had hit was some rib bone and went to the brisket not haveing penentrated more than 12" in all!

Where am i going with all this? Well, i'll say what "you said" only in another way. Bullets are designed with a certain speed in mine, go over that and they expand too fast, go below it and they don't expand at all. Why guys don't understand that, i have no idea???

Drilling Man

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NVMIKE. No I didn't get your message. I don't know what happened there. You could give it another try. I can comment on what you asked here though. I have not loaded the 280 down with heavier bullets but the load I like for deer with the 280 is the 120 grain Sierra Pro Hunter bullet @ about 2700-2800 fps. That load is about 25-06 level for recoil. The 7MM-08 is a fine caliber for young shooters and while I have not reloded a lot of ammo for it, the factory 140 Corlokt ammo performs well and is pretty easy on my bad shoulder. I have had a couple 260's and it shares the same qualities as the 7mm-08. The recoil is about the same. I like the 120 grain Ballistic tip best for this caliber for deer. The 140 X bullet if it shoots well is a real elk load for the 7mm-08 and the 260. It should be about the same as the 260 but I find that the bestof the best low recoil yet very effective calibers is the 6.5x55 Swedish Mauser. While these rifles are not as easy to find, they just outperform their paper ballistics by miles. I started out loading the 140 grain Hornady spire point in my first Swede and it grouped 5/8 inch at 100 yards. That about ended my load development for that rifle. It is so effective on big game that you would swear that it was twice as big a caliber than it is. You hit a big game animal anywhere in the vitals and its over. My 6.5's are all military rifles which are pretty heavy but the recoil is almost nil. I had one in the 700 Classic for a while. It had a bit more recoil but still not bad. You probably can't find a 250 Savage anymore but as a low recoil deer rifle, it hard to beat. I got one for my wife in the 700 classic the year it came out and it was love at first shot. We both love that rifle and with 100 grain Ballistic tips it does a fantastic job on deer. I would not push the issue and try it for elk but I agree with Jim Carmichael in a recent artical where he names the 250 Savage as his favorite deer rifle. This one has no recoil yet for me has made the 243 look pretty sick. I know it shouldn't but the 100 grain bullet with a bit lower SD that the 243 and a bit less velocity has just worked better for mulies than my 6mm's ever did. The best 243 load I ever used was the old 90 grain semi spitzer partition from Nosler. I don't know if they make it anymore as I pretty well quit on the 243. Sorry ZX.;)

If you try the 7mm-08, try the 130 grain Speer hot core. I found it a bit fragil for full speed 280 use(meat destruction,bad). but at lower speeds in the 7mm-08, I think it would work very well. I have some loaded but have not tried them on deer yet. The didn't group real well in my current 7mm-08. It loves 140 corlokts as well. This one is the NEF youth model which fits my bad shoulder better that a long stock. You can start outwith youth models then just get the full length stock for almost nothing from NEF. My current 280 is also an NEF. I have ownedthe 7mm-08 caliber in the 700 BDL and the Browning BLR. I don't care for the newer lightweight BLR's.

You are correct in that the 280 would make a great one rifle battery for NA. It is very versitile. I have a friend who has countless dozens of rifles but now days his 280 is about all he ever drags out of the dungeon. Its a Browning a-bolt with a Shepard range finder scope. Does that combo ever work. His next favorite is the Browning Semi Auto in 308. That one soaks the recoil up pretty good although some lightweight 308's like my Lightweight Stalker can recoil pretty hard.

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The .280 is about as good as it gets in a Mountain rifle,I have always like it and the 160 Noslers it tosses out.I have no clue why it has not caught on.
If I could have 6 guns it would be one of them
1.22-250
2.25-06
3.280 rem
4.300 ultra
5.338 win mag
6.416 rem mag
With that line up I would be happy for probaly a week or so.:D:D:D
BBJ

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My light weight bolt action rifle also is in 7 express Rem.. (280 Rem.) Anyway, i remember useing it on caribou, deer, and a blk bear or two, and i've mostly shot 145 Speer boat tails out of it. In fact these days that's all i use in it as it's just used on whitetail deer. My rifle really loves this bullet, so i just kept on useing it.

The 145 Speers are decent for a non premium bullet, but a bit soft for bigger animials (or end to end shots) soi'd go to 150 NP's if i was going to shoot "one bullet fits all" in this cartridge.

I really like the 280 and i could live with it for the rest of my life on everything from moose on down. (with the proper bullet and loads of course)

Drilling Man

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Ain't that funny thats the reason my dad doesn't shot a 30-06 nemore, but he shot a a4x4 buck at 125 yrds and my uncle was looking threw a scope and he seen where the fur flew up in the air and it was in a well placed shot and they never found that deer and the following year my dad got him self a 300wm and he shot a 3x3 buck and killed it on the spot, so yeah you could say hewasa true blue 30-06 six fan till that happend. (and to add up to the top they shot him and he fell then he got back up a few minutes later and never found him)

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Becareful Hunter,
You are trashing the 30-06 and that is not alowed by the STANDARED caliber fanatics,us magnum users (according to them)are over gunned and over compensating for well lack of better terms "our mannly hood".This canot be tolerated in the hunting world cause you only need 3 guns for everythin .243,270 and 30-06,or if Zerex was here it would be .243,.243,.243.:D;);)
BBJ

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LMAO We got all kinds on here thats for sure.

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If your "manhood" looks like a .30-06 may I suggest you trade it for something of size!!!!!!!!!

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I have two words to say about those who can't kill a deer with a 30-06. But I won't use them here.;)Yup drag out the 50 BMG boys, its a four point.:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D

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No need for a .50 BMG when a 7mm Mag. will do. ;)

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All I can say is that if the deer up in their neck of the woods have become immune to well placed shots from a 30-06 then those bad boys must be wearing kevlar these days. Thank God the deerI hunt are no so well protected. I have been on a lot of blood trails where the shooter claimed a good hit only to discover when we finally found the deer a half a mile away and often the next morning that the hit was not nearly as good as they thought it was. If this has usually been the case with deer that are difficult to recover I strongly suspect it is most likely the case when they are not recovered as well.

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I always love the guys that hit them "right in the chest, or heart, or lungs", BUT never find the animial!!!! Like the glass in there scope is made from a "crystall ball"!! hahahahahaaa

Drilling Man

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Believe it or not, I have seen just as many deer run off after being hit with the 7Mag as I have with the 06 and 308. There is no earthly reason to loose an animal thats well hit with any reasonable size cartridge. Certainly not with rifles of 25 caliber and larger.

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I agree. A well placed shot is what it is all about.

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I'm afraid if it were a 6x6 or bigger the deer would of turned around and said put away the bb gun(30-06) cause that tickles my tummy. I don't mean to put the 30-06 down but its just not my kinda gun:). yeah sure it has killed more big game than any other cartridge i'll give it that but from my dads experince if it couldn't kill a 4x4 buck at 125 yards what in the hell would it have done to an elk???

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the 30-06 can easily kill at 125. that cartridge was used in by snipers up until the end of the vietnam war and kills were made out to over 1000 yards. did you ever think that the error of the deer not being killed may not have been the cartridge but the shooter.

about the elk. a man hunting elk in ky last year shot a huge 6x6 at 400 yards with his 06 and it went right down.

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The example you used is as rare as chickens fangs. You will find darn few cases where the 30-06 has failed to kill almost any NA game. I have long ago lost track of the critters I have killed with the 30-06. I have yet to see ANY animal fairly hit in the vitals with a 30-06 that didn't give it up PDQ. In some rare cases strange things happen but it has nothing to do with cartridge size. How many people do you think in this country hunt deer with rifles way smaller than the 30-06? 243. 250 Savage, 260 6.5x55, 270, 280 7MM-08 7x57 Mauser, 30-30, 308, muzzle loaders and handguns? All these guns are smaller than the 30-06. Are you saying with a straight face that none of these are suitable deer rifles? Are you saying that nothing short of Mr. whiz bang Magnum + will take elk.? If so you better start doing a little research on hunting. Do you think that the entire buffalo herds in this country didn't die because the buffalo hunters didn't have any WSM's and Ultra Mags? Maybe they are all still alive just hiding in the bush laughing. Maybe all the big game taken with the 30-06 including Elk Moose and Grizzlies will come back to life and start kicking butt.:D

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acctually i am quiet formiluar with the what kinda guns are used in wars and now 308 are being used as snipers B/C of its accuracy

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to answer teh 1st bold ? yeah they are all sutible for deer but with experince that my dad had he never went back to the 30-06 again and he still says yeah it a good gun but not for him and he refuses to get me a 30-06.
(The second bold sentence) maybe......................... but i'm not saying it won;t kill an anmal like buffalos, elk or moose but what i'm sayin is what went threw my dads head well if that deer got away then what will happen to an elk if i get a long shot at it, b/c after taht he lost all faith in his old 30-06, yeah sure i will say he shot deer with that ol 30-06 but he lost all confidencein it,so what i'm sayin is that if you shot an elk3 times in the heart and lung area and you know that you hit it with all3 bullets and you never find that bull and you look at mountain say to the north of you and you see that same bull runing full speed uphill and you follow him for 5 miles, what are you going to say and are you going to be dissapointed, well yeah. but if you know for a fact that you hit him in his heart and lungs3 times your are going to blame it on your gun, so the next year you don't wanna have the same thing happen so you are going to bring something with a lot more punch. NOW I'M NOT SAYING THAT THE 300 WON'T KILL AN ELK I WAS JUST GIVING AN EXAMPLE I'VE SEEN WHAT A 300 DOES TO ELK AT 300+ YARDS.

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Welllll....not exactly....it's used because it's a military cartridge.

some branches of the service are using the .50 BMG as a sniper rifle and some are using the 7MM Rem Mag.....

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Start with a 378 Wetherby so the next time the gun screws up, you will still have room to go BIGGER and BIGGER and BIGGER. That would be the answer.The buffalo were wiped out by calibers like the old Black Powder 45-70 shooting at the Blazing speed of about 1300 fps. Of course they kept the range down to 300-600 yards,.;)

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i didn't say currently. i clearly stated up until the end of the vietnam war.