The 243 is fine for either. If you can truly shoot 243 is fine. The 243 has been used on much larger game than black bear. Just use a good hard bullet. Plus the 243 is faster and easier to group at long ranges.

I would choose the 30-30 for both. My son shot a a mule deer at 150 yrds with one shot using the same ammo! So i would pick the 30-30 for both! and just think they used the 30-30 for everything when there was no such thing as a mag!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I Agree with you 100%

If you hit a bear in the lungs with good bullet from either he will never know the difference...I have killed about 130 whitetails with a .243 and 6 black bears with the same gun...

PS...A .243 is good to at leat 300 yards on deer I have killed several that far...

yep the 30-30 has the lead ( mass ) to back up the lack of velocity next to the 243. " You can't replace mass ( bullet Mass ) with velocity" Col. Jeff Cooper I guarentee Col Jeff Cooper would choose a 30-30 over a 243 for either application wether it be black bear or deer.

Either cartridge is fine for deer. The 30/30 was designed with deer in mind and it kills them about as good as any other cartridge since it's inception. Some may argue with that comment but if all we had to hunt deer with was the 30/30 we'd still be taking 95%+ of all the deer we are taking now. That being said, the .243 is much more capable than a varmint cartridge. It's very good as killing yotes and chucks but I wouldn't feel under gunned taking it out for deer. It's more of a varmint/deer cartridge as it can handle both very well.
Bears are a different matter. The .243 is normally seen on bolt actions that are designed for longer range shooting, the 30/30 is designed for shorter range lever guns that can be easily used in tight quarters and snapped into action quickly. The typical bear hunt is a close range affair from a tree stand. Long range accuracy isn't needed for that.
Go for the 30/30 using 170 grain loads.

Kinda of funny that you quote this statement, seeing as how you brag of your 17hmr's killimg power. So which is it that you belive ? velocity or bullet mass ?
I for one, firmly believe you can more than overcome mass with sheer velocity. Of all people you should know that, just look at your 17 hmr. Velocity baby ! It does wonders.

Back to the question, I prefer the .243, it can do everything better than the .30-30, including kill.

I never bragged about my 17 HMR's killing power......, I simply said I use it for coyotes and I feel its enough gun for western coyotes............ I believe in both aspects of velocity versus mass, but for certain game animals like deer and black bear I prefer mass, because mass ensures good penetration and controlled expansion. Why do you suppose I use CCI's 20 grain hollow points in my 17 HMR instead of the 17 grain v-max, because the 20 grain bullet is sturdier in design and ensures good penetration. If i had to choose one way or the other I think i would lean more towards mass than velocity, because High velocity low mass bullets tend to be less stable and are usually quite explosive on impact and usually dont provide the best penetration. does this help you understand better about my ideas on bullet and or cartridge choices.

**applause** That is pretty much the standard knock-em-down load. I use 150gr for target shooting, but ALWAYS use 170's for deer hunting.

The 30-30 has been around for well over 100 years, and has a solid, legendary, reputation. The .243 can't hold a candle to the venerable 30-30, IMHO.

Butch A.

Butch, have you ever tried the PMC 150gr "Star Fire HP" 30-30 on hogs?
You ought to see the what it does.