My experience with the 30-30 has continued since I got my first deer rifle, a 336, over 29 years ago. As for the leverevolution ammo, I myself got caught up in the hype and bought one box and even more foolishly bought a box of federal 30-30 loaded with nosler partitions that were even more expensive and an evenbigger waste of cash. As far as pointed bullets from what I hear they don't make any difference until the bullet has traveled like 400-500 yds downrange. From my own experience I can say that at 100 yds and 200yds a 165grain 30 caliber bullet hits the exact same point of aim whether its pointed or a round nose which tells me that it don't make any difference at those ranges and with 30 caliber bullets of that size. If it did I would expect the pointed bullet to be shooting a little high which they weren't. As far as the overall info, just read the the manufacturers own info /ballistic tables and you can draw your own conclusions. Anyways, I am not saying the hornady ammo is bad, in fact it is very good ammo, just very expensive and maybe not worth the price for the tiny benefit it actually gives you. Also please note I personally think the 30-30 is an awesome round, cheap accurate and good for most anything. However if the price of 30-30 ammo becomes the same as other higher power ammoits chief advantage in my bookis gone. If it costs the same as a 30-06 or 308why use it as those cartridgesdo everything better. Take care all.

I agree with the 10gauge comment......

I really wanted to get a 10gauge just because I had a 12, 20, 28, 410 already,

then I looked at the loadings and they were either the same as 12gauges or even worse/less!

I also kinda want a 16, but knowing they only load in 2 3/4" .....so to date I have neither.

This topic has been and will be discussed for as long as shooters and hunters are around to talk about it. I amskeptical of the industry when it comes to "new" cartridges. I am because I hold twonearly useless rifles ... a 6.5 Rem. Magnum Mohawk and a 358 Win. Model 88. I saved and skrimped for both back whenI was a young man.These were my first and second "deer" rifles. Not long afterward I bought the Mohawk, as a teenager, Remington quit on rifle and then for all practical purposes quite on the 6.5 Rem. Magnum cartridge too.The 358 Win. factory ammo has beenscarce for decades. I think only Browning still chambers for the 358 Win. in the BLR. .... and I know no one that owns one of these. I was not yet into hand loading, so when the ammo went bye-byeI was more or less stuck with scrounging.I long ago gave up on that and these two sit side by side on the back row of my gun safe. I am of the opinion that the "super shorts" and "ultra mags" will have a similar fate to these two rounds.One need only be observant and honest to see andcipher the signs.The "buzz" about these is starting to wane. Factory ammo is becoming inceasingly tough to locate and the price is rising steadily. There is not a wide variety being offered by the industry. Of the dozens of folks, probably well over 100, that I have hunted with over the past 10 years I know of none using any of the Ultra Mags or Super Shorts, only 1 using a 300 STW, only 1 using a Weatherby cartridge, and only 2 usinga "Short Magnum". The cartridge selection across the group with whomI huntregularly ... something like 50 +/- guys and 2 ladies ... is overwhelmingly dominated by the 30.06 Spr. and 270 Win. I'd say these two make up 75% of this number.Then several use either the 308 Win., 243 Win. or 7 mm Rem.Mag. There is 1 30/30 user, 1 that uses a 25.06, and 1 guy uses a 7 mm Mauser.

As for me? I am old school, which should be obvious. I'll stick with my stuff ... 22 LR or 410 for small game, 308 Win. for deer/hogs,300 Win. Mag. for stuff out west, 416 Rem. for big critters thatI'll porbably never hunt, and a 12 ga. pump for birds. All old school too and all work well, though I'm still guessing on the 416 Rem. !!!

I'd rather that they churn out the 'staple' cartridges like .223,.308, 30-30, 270, 300WM ,and 30-06 than to spen production time and tooling on 'boutique' or 'niche' cartridges that very few people will buy and which the manufacturers will have to subsidize by raising the prices on their more popular cartridges. Case in point: Hornady makes a larger variety of cartridges than anyone else, but their prices even for common chamberings are usually much higher than anyone elses'.

The answer is, "no, we don't need new rounds"... BUT, the gun and ammo manufacturers need to convince us that our .243's and .270's and .308's, and .30-06's will no longer kill stuff (and a significant number of us fall for it, as if deer skin has somehow evolved into kevlar...). Thus they can sell us more guns, thereby keeping a healthy bottom line (which is a good thing, and, therefore I'm happy that a lot of you folks buy into the hype...).

Briman Thats a very good point.
I would rather see accurate quilty ammo at a fair price than a whole slew of new stuff. A 22K-Hornet, 222rem and a 22-250would be all the center fire 22's that arerealy needed. I am not a minamolist and due like choices but most newer cartridges aren't needed but some of the older ones that are fainting are.

Read a book from a big game hunter out of africa.....his thoughts were that the only .416 that'll be around in 20+ years will be the .416 Rigby. Though if Ruger necks up their .375ruger to .416 I think it could easily take over this market, IMO it would be the best .416 round on the market, and for the avg guy in africa, could be the goto.

I'd buy a .375H&H or a .458 Lott before a .416 Rem, but if ruger did make a .416 I'd probably pick that. If not and I really wanted a .416 it would be a Rigby.

Just curious... Why do you pick the .222 Rem. over the .223 Rem.?

I'm glad they give us the choices we have. The choices we make will determine what will stick around. "Only the strong survive!" Just the fact that we are on this web site discussing the subject is great! I love this chit!

Show me a .270 that can't kill everything on the planet! Even a 30-06 for that matter.

New is good, but old has been tried and trued.