dbleyepatches

My hunting partner just bought a new Black Ice. 29" draw, 70#, shooting an arrow 408 grains, chronographed 278. Just for your information.

Vabowman

That sounds about right. What does he have on his string? peep, kisser etc..?? I will be shooting a much lighter arrow yet a much shorter DL.

BruceW63

The ShortStop can work with a kisser - a Saunders Kiss-XL. After many tries with other types, I discovered a way to make this kisser work and stay put on my Marquis - over 1000 shots and it's still on the string. As far as the location of the ShortStop - I never noticed it as a hinderance at all. But, in fairness, I took it off 3 weeks ago, and now my Marquis is sporting a MeanV. There was no change in accuracy or sound, for me.

Not many dealers carry the Diamond Liberty, but I have to tell you.... I'm loving the one I got just 2 weeks ago. I paid right at $550, shipped to my door. With a LimbDriver rest, a Copper John DN2 Supreme sight and G5 Meta peep, Carbon Express Ultra Shock stabilizer, and a MeanV suppressor, I'm flinging CX 300's with 100 gr tips seemingly as fast as my Marquis can. Hitting 1" squares of target tape = no problem at all. The Liberty is worth a test!

Vabowman

We will see!! I like the Ally and the Ice and like the way they are designed, the Marquis just doesn't feel that great to me.

twildasin

You will shoot alot faster than 220 with a General at 26" draw length. I think with my set-up I can get you in the 270's 70lbs 26" draw you can be between 260 and 270! Allegience is a great bow and so is the Guardian but you will NOT get any more shock free or quieter than this bow. I really suggest you go and shoot it. Get yourself and easton lightspeed 500 spine arrow cut to your length with a 65 gr. tip and I bet your in the 270's. Im now at 70lbs with mine and am shooting 312fps. With my General!

Vabowman

well, being that I have 2 dozen easton axis 400's I will stay with them, so changing arrows is out, I like these too, at 367 gr it offers me some good penetration with 100 gr tip. Plus, doesn't the General have an 8.5 brace> That's going to be an issue if i want to get in the 270" fps, don't you think?

GMMAT

VA....I love the way the General shoots dead in my hand......but the ally would get my nod (If I were in your shoes)for 2 reasons:

1. Draw cycle
2. Speed

Vabowman

Jeff, how is the draw cycle? I drew one the other day, it was nice, I didn't shoot it and I can only compare it to my X Force. I know draw length can differ with each bow, and the Ally only goes to 26.5" on the DL, my draw is 26.5" butwith some bows I was told it may have to be 26" or could be 27", i like the Ally and it seems everyone does, it looks like I will concentrate on the Black Ice and the Ally, Im not looking for blazing speed and the ally from what i can tell won't give me but a few fps more than the Ice. What ya think??

twildasin

I agree Jeff you will get more speed with the Ally also. The General is 8 1/4 brace height. When I shot it I could not put it down! No bow I ever shot felt like it! I am a 29" draw so I can still get the speed out of the General with all the quietness and smoothness in the world!

GMMAT

I shot the BI this weekend for the first time. It's a nice bow......but it isn't an ally (IMO). You have to weigh these things for yourself (cost/characteristics/etc...). The draw on the BI is gonna be better. The speed is gonna be better on the ally.

I've shot (I think) every bow in the Bowtech line, and that's what I'm basing my "opinion" on.

Good luck.