I was looking at buckeye's post about climbers, i have an old one i bought off of a good buddy, It has the shooting rail, and i would be lost without it, how do you climb with and open front?? becaus i always sit on the rail as a pull the bottome up... do you just have to hold yourself up with your arms?

Im sure its simple, but I'm not quite getting it....

Yeah I feel the same as you Buck, I would be lost without it as well!

Yep. Just hold yourself up with your arms. You can alsotake the top part up higher and push down with your arms and lift up with your legs at the same time. Kind of like doing dips at the gym.You can climb really fast using the second method. BTW the API Bowhunter is a great stand.

Ignorance forgiven, Buckmaster.

I use a Loggy Byou light climber. It has no shooting rail. Like many climbers it has to parts - the platform and the climber. The climber on this one is square stock alumiumu and goes around the tree. It has a belt that hangs from the climber behind (away from the tree) that you sit on like a sling THe belt is used after you've raised the climber up and while bracing w/your arms you sit your but in the sling as you drag the platform up by your feet. So I guess the short answer is the belt/sling replaces the shooting rail that you sit on.

PS this is a light (11.5 lbs) stand and very easy to use w/ no parts that can get lost or jammed.

have fun up there!

Once I get both pieces of my summit attached to the base:
[ol][*]Hook bow to gear hoist, and attach hoist to carabiner clip on backpack.[*]I leave enough "slack" in my seat to flip it up and push it back against the seat frame.[*]Strap my safety belt to the seat portion.[*]Kick my feet into the bindings.[*]Then, Iplace the left and right seat rails in my armpits, stand up as tall as possiblepull my feet up (hanging from my armpits and gripping the seat trusses)and kick in the base.[*]Repeat.[*]Once I'm at the desired height, I unbuckle my safety harness from the climber and engage it on the tree trunk.[*]Install small hook.[*]Hang up backpack.[*]Open backpack.[*]Remove and install large bow hook.[*]Hoist bow.[*]Wait.[/ol]

That's the fastest way I can get up/down with or without the front restraint bar. I can get a couple feet per cycle.

I've been up and down so many trees using that method that I'm 100 percent certain I can do it blindfolded.
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For at least 10 years, I used a Loggy Bayou one-piece climber - and hugged the tree to pull my feet up. Eventually, I got sick of ruining the forearms and zippers on all my hunting clothes - so I made the quantum leap to the two-piece climbing system. LOL

Yep just lift with your arms...mine doesnt have a rail and thats how I do it

It was a love hate relationship with me and my climber... I hated how I sweated when I got to my desired height... but I loved being able to set up whenver whereever... oh how I miss my climber