Rob/PA Bowyer

[quote]ORIGINAL: Copper31

Great job Rob. I am one of the members that was helped by this post last year. I made a poor shot and in the middle of tracking it down poured. I was ready to to post the classic I hit one now what thread but instead I reread the post which was filled with tips from other hunters. I went back out, took my time and found my deer.

One item that I will always carry with me on a track job is peroxide in a spray bottle. It will help you with an old rain washed blood trail like you would not believe.

The other thing I would add is give yourself time. An hour of looking isn't enough. Exhaust all your avenues. If you know you can't take the time for a decent track then don't shoot.
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Thank you Copper31, great example and why this thread (meaning everone's advice) goes up every year. Like I said, I learn as much as anyone.

MountainHunter

Rob, I think this is one of the most valuable posts you make. And that's saying something! I seem to remember a response (maybe more than one) to your last year's post about how to tell (or at least make an educated guess) where you hit a deer by looking at the arrow and/or blood trail and/or the behavior of the deer. I know that if a deer goes downhill, it's usually apositive sign that it is mortally wounded, and I think very dark red meant a liver shot. But I can't remember the rest of it.

Ithink it would be really valuable if you re-posted that, or if someone else offered their insights on this aspect, just in case one of us doesn't see exactly where the arrow hit.

Thanks to anyone who can help on this.

jmbuckhunter

You know what? I don't see that VOID AREA in any of those pictures.

Come to think about it, they aren't around here anymore either.

Rob/PA Bowyer

Original mez, thank you for this post mez.




Here is the picture, study it well. The no man's land exists but NOT in the deer's chest cavity. The lungs fill the entire thoracic cavity. Before someone jumps in and says but I dressed a deer and there was a bunch of space around the lungs............ Yes there was and always will be. The lungs work in a negative pressure environment, atmospheric pressure in the chest is lower than that outside. Take away negative pressure and the lungs immediately collapse and will not reinflate, hence the term collapsed lung. As soon as you enter the chest via the diaphragm or though the chest wall they deflate and appear much smaller than in a live scenario. The only way to see the lungs in their natural state is with and ultrasound or CT scan. There is no space between them and the chest wall.

To answer the original question, you can absolutely hit a deer through both backstraps and not kill it, knock it down or even hurt it badly. I would guess about 99% of the shots where people say I shot right under the spine and above the lungs actually was above the spine and through the backstrap. How this happens, look at the picture above, the blue line denotes the path of the spinal cord, it travel within the vertebral body in the vertebral canal, totally encased in bone. Each vertebrae has what is called a dorsal spinous process, these are the bones you see sticking up along the top of the spine in the picture. In the cervical and lumbar spine these are very short. In the thoracic spine they are long, 6-8 inches in a mature buck. The backstraps, composed of the epaxial muscle group attatch to these processes. In the picture, essentiall everything above the blue line (spine) is backstrap and dorsal spinous process, you can even see the top of the shoulder blade overlies this area. If you hit a deer high near the shoulder you will go through both backstraps, maybe or maybe not break a dorsal spinous process and exit with the deer basically unharmed. Make sense?

For you guys that dress your own, this fall after you remove the front legs and take off the backstraps take a look at these bones sticking up off of the indiviual vertebrae. You will see what I'm talking about. Take a pair of pliers and break a couple off, it won't open up the vertebral canal and you won't be able to see the spinal cord.

jdbowhunter

Hey, Rob! I am fairly new to the forum but I would like to commend you on several of your posts. Even though I have been hunting since I was 7 years old, I always want to learn. I am a firm believer that you learn something every time you hunt. I amnow learning from people like yourself as well. Thank you.

Rob/PA Bowyer

Thank you, I try and I learn from these forums daily as well. I really appreciate that and all the forum members.

smitdog

O.K. here's a dumb question, if the deer is exhaling at the time of impact, would that have an effect? go easy on me ...remember the only dumb question is the one that is not asked.

Copper31

Just like on a human when you breath in your chest expands and when you exhale it contracts. While the lungs may be a bit smaller during the exhale so is the cavity that encases them, thus not leaving a void.

Mdbowhunter16

Great information. Cant get any better.

txjourneyman

This thread last year played a major part in the recovery of a doe I hit a little far back. I got 1 lung and liver. I sat in my stand thinking about this thread and what it suggested I do. I found that doe, the only deer I have ever killed that did not fall in sight. Without the knowledge shared here I don't know if I would have been successful. Thanks again Rob.