atlasman

He can't...........but he CAN tell me how he sneaks into his.......what time?, what direction?, any wind or certain wind only?, uphill or down?, slow stalking walk......or just get in as fast and quiet as you can??.......what does he do if he bumps a deer??......when does he go back?? What time of season??......any weather?.....stay all day or get in and get out??.......are his setups looking into the bedding area or focused on the edges?.......what part of the bedding are fringe??......focus on exit routes, food, cover..........ANYTHING that I could put into play when I hit the woods. Most guys know WHAT to do........a little help of HOW to do it better is what we really need.


Yes..........I showed one to you.........great subject though (one he didn't even mention in his book). Does he start here and identify what he THINKS are bedding areas and then confirms it on foot??.........or does he glass for deer movement and then go back to the maps and combine the info for a better analysis??..........How the heck does he KNOW for sure that a big buck is bedding in there and not just a bunch of what he calls "lesser" deer?? I also hate when people say they can't pattern big bucks but then go on to tell you how they set up outside their bedding area...........IMO if you KNOW where a buck is bedding each morning then you have him patterned (not completely........but a darn good start).


I do............I showed you that on the topo map we discussed........that is another great question...........what if the bedding area is not on your land??.........then what is plan B???



I'm not looking for anyone to hold my hand and do all the hard work for me...........just tangible, useful tips that I can't readily employ in the woods if I so choose.............like the Eberhart books we talked about, they differentiated what they consider a primary scrape area from a scrape line and then they add in more terrain to the puzzle and show you (with map examples) of where to TRY to set up based on the info you find out scouting............THAT WAS GREAT........it gave people some info maybe they didn't already realize they were seeing AND it showed how to take that info and make a game plan out of it. Will it work???.........who the heck knows and maybe it's bad advice.........but at least I can read it, learn something new, understand it.........then go out and APPLY it to my hunting regimen. If it works GREAT, if not maybe I learn something else along the way.........EITHER way I have another tool in the shed.


I don't want a word for word.........step by step treasure map with a big X on it..........just some helpful SPECIFIC hints and tips I can actually apply to see if they make a difference.

davepjr71

Maryland has a bunch of big bucks. Especially the Eastern Shore. Problem being that most of the land is private property and people want you to pay to hunt their land. There are places where I used to hunt in PA that used to have huge bucks but the land was sold or it's on no hunting property. The farm land they used to go onto, that I hunted, was bought out and made into a developement. Haven't seen any of the big bucks around there since.

atlasman

Whatever I want to..........but "Welcome to retirement" sounds pretty good to me

davidmil

It has some and yes, they're on the Eastern Shore. Not in the mountains or where most of us hunt. Land access is a real bummr on the Eastern shore. Even the public land is in many cases on a sign up register and no more than two such sign ups at a time. It's really tough in a situation like that. The places are full every day and you can't work a pattern or anything because you may not get in for another couple weeks. That's after driving 2 or 3 hours to get there if you get in. There are a few decent bucks killed every year, but not a BUNCH. Most of us here in Maryland hunt 5 acre to 50 acre patches. Many of the big bucks killed every year come from someones yard backing up to a state park where no hunting is allowed.

Outdoor writer

Hey Atlas, I fully understand that in your eyes the book sucks. I think everyone else understands your position as well. That does not bother me nor would it if you all thought it sucks.

My issue at this time is that people are somehow getting the notion that I promote taking time from family to chase big bucks. I thought my book clearly emphasized the importance of family and friends ABOVE hunting. I started the book with that theme and ended it with that same idea. It is the other things in life, our hobbies if you will, that I am suggesting MAY be preventing SOME hunters from tagging the class of buck that they desire. (also our jobs and financial commitments) Heck I also say that if you are happy with what you are killing then GREAT! it is your life, have fun ... just dont make excuses or belittle others who have made sacrifices in terms of OTHER INTERESTS (not family)to devote more time to hunting.

Oh and Atlas, by the flood of personal messages that I have gotten over the past 3 days I think you may have already won a scholarship to the class that I am paying tuition for .... "MakingFriends on the Internet 101"

atlasman

That's a shame..........I would think you would care if everyone thought your book sucked.


How do you explain the statement on page 132 I mentioned??


That's funny..........cause the PM's I have gotten tell a different story

pjhunts

Okay, can you all hear me from my high pedestal here where the P&Y's are tripping over each other to come by my setup, Let me colaborate a little on the point I was trying to make. I arrowed a P&y the 3rd yr I bowhunted(strictly luck) then went for a drought that lasted almost 20 YEARS. Yes almost 20 yrs here where there's one under every rock. Then I consciously made the choice to sacrafice other stuff that I enjoyed and focus on the pursuit of a decent buck. I ate a few more tags, while passing on young deer that i would normally be happy zipping an arrow through, but then things started to change, plans started to come together, my style of hunting evolved and I started to reap the benefits. I t is now 6 years later and I've taken 7 bucks that will score over the P& Y minimum. It's not that there weren't any good bucks here for my long dry spell, I just didn't have the desire, passion, or whatever you call it to sit out in the woods from daylight to dark, through pouring rain, freezing cold, other hunters tripping over me, etc,, to get the job done. Every single day of the year i think about deer hunting. It may be as simple aslooking for deer while driving down the road or shed hunting or scouting, anything that might tip me off to a big buck. I'm by no means rich, I work full time and them some building scaffold, help my father farm, I burn fire wood year round, and I still find plenty of time for my family of 4 childern and my wife and am still able to hunt quite a bit. During the heat of summer, I pick anywhere from 100 -130 gallons of black berries to provide for my hunting endeavors, so as not to spend any of our "regular" money and take away from my family's financial needs.We budget our money so that I am able to take off as much work as I can afford during hunting season. My wife is very understanding, and she too has a great desire to pursue big bucks. When I say that i hunt quite a bit would be an understatement compared to what most others hunt. The year before last I logged ~500 hours in the woods, last year I had to work more and was only able to hunt around 300 hours. When I'm not working, hunting is my "job". I by no means find it easy and sometimes it's not all that enjoyable, but that's just fuel for my fire.
I do realize that there are some exceptions, like the guys that hunt in florida and other places of the like, that there is a limited #(if any)ofP&Y deer. but that doesn't mean that there is no hope. I believe that age grows bigger antlers, so by letting a buck that you would normally shoot go for a year or two, he is going to grow a lot more in inches. I know what most would now say, "Well around here, if I don't shoot him so and so over there will" I know this because that is what I used to say. Ive long since kicked that motto to the curb. I've been hunting public land and have nice young bucks stroll by that another hunter was also watching, and they would always be shocked that i didn't shoot it. Obviously not everyone would do that, but that to is one of the sacrafices that I've learn to make. Realistically, odds are that the guy over there will never have the opportunity to shoot the deer that you've just passed on. And there are even higher odds that you will ever see that deer again. that is just a chance that you have to be willing to take.
I dunno, Ive kind of lost track of what I was wanting to get across, but just want to note that EVERYONE goes through a learning curve and progression in their hunting careers, some just get stuck in some phases longer than others, some may never reach the pinnacle, I know that i have a long way to go, but feel that I'm on the right track. Also, there is no sure fire method, no magic call or scent that is going to do it for you. A lot of hard work, effort, and yes, sacrafices are necessary to move to the next level of progression.
As a sidenote, I only use the term P&Y because it is a common reference, I value the age of a buck a lot more than the inches on it's head.

tsoc

No offense to the poster but please,you are from central Illinois.To make a blanket statement such as you have is not realistic for those of us that do not live in such prolific area's.You cannot kill what is not there and for someone else to assume they know some one else's woods and what is possible there is a bit on the arrogant side.If 25% of your buck population would make Pope and Young and 2% of mine would who has a more realistic chance of killing a qualifier given equal amounts of time spent in the effort to take such an animal.
There is no one in my area who consistently kills bucks that score over 115 with bow or rifle and I know and am friends with or am acquantainces with the most dedicated hunters in my area.

pjhunts

I hate to burst your bubble, but there really aren't that many P& Y deer here. Out of the 300 hours i hunted last season, i saw a grand total of 5 bucks that would make the cut off. 2 of which I killed. I worked extremely hard to get these deer. There are 11 other people who hunt in the same general area that i do and there mature buck harvest number was 0. So please tell them how easy it is to tag one in Illinois. I don't think I'm some super hunter, i'm just saying that i try much harder than most and it has been paying off for me. By the way, I went to Kansas and hunted public ground that i had never seen before and was able to put a tag on a 5 yr old 8 pter on day # 6. He was the only big buck I saw while hunting.

davepjr71

That's what I'm finding out from talking to people.