RE: Heavy arrow, more KE....light arrow, more speed..??
 

Acc's 349 - 390 27" long 100 grain G5 striker 70# pull 28 1/2 draw. 280 fps I know this set up has passed thru and killed many deer.These are the only facts I know. Does anybody know what this arrow might weigh and the k/e it produces? 4 inch vaines

RE: Heavy arrow, more KE....light arrow, more speed..??
 

Doesn't really matter, now does it.:D

RE: Heavy arrow, more KE....light arrow, more speed..??
 

No, your right, I guess it doesn't sans the sag.

RE: Heavy arrow, more KE....light arrow, more speed..??
 

Your ACC will weigh in the 360 gr. range....A 360 gr. arrow flying at 280 produces 62.68 ft. pounds of KE.

It may be just a little heavier than that, but not much...that's gonna be pretty close.

RE: Heavy arrow, more KE....light arrow, more speed..??
 

:)[8D]:D[&:];):eek:

RE: Heavy arrow, more KE....light arrow, more speed..??
 

I'll give up my speed for smoothness and quietness any day. I did about three years ago, and I won't go back!

RE: Heavy arrow, more KE....light arrow, more speed..??
 

MO HO, That is my exact arrow. It weighs in at 380 grains with Blazers.

The Allegiance puts it out at 301. I'm just sayin....My Vortec was 285 at 68lbs.

RE: Heavy arrow, more KE....light arrow, more speed..??
 

So the only difference is the broadhead and MO HO wimpy Kansas deer, correct

RE: Heavy arrow, more KE....light arrow, more speed..??
 

Rob, I knew you were a fart smeller I mean a smart fellow.:D:DI'm getting pass thrus so I'm just saying, it might be time to change that BH. OfcourseI mentioned that many pages back. Your bow is faster no doubt, 280- 300 I wouldn't want to get hit with either one. Oh one more thing, Merry Christmas.

RE: Heavy arrow, more KE....light arrow, more speed..??
 

LOL, Well next season I'm going to get a doe tag ( I know Jeff) so I'll shoot one with the Snyper and one with a Muzzy just to see. Of course there is the difference in my KE now so I don't know what for experiment that will be other than some good venny. Merry Christmas to you to HO HO, I mean MO HO.

RE: Heavy arrow, more KE....light arrow, more speed..??
 

buckeye, so I am old feller and set in my ways? Yeah, I agree.:) I am just using my field experience, know what I have witnessed the last few years, and heard from talking with other archers. I am not a numbers cruncher and am not impressed with KE numbers. Heck, I have only had a bow chronographed one time in my life.

All in all its what works for each individual and some prefer more speed while others prefer more weight. As long as we as bowhunters get the job done is what counts. To each and everyone here, have a Merry Christmas and Happy New Year!:D

RE: Heavy arrow, more KE....light arrow, more speed..??
 

Rob.that arrow could be your problem.


You are slightly weak at 285 fps.I am sure paper doesn't show it but penetration will,ESPECIALLY with a 2" expandable.


At 301 fps,it is way underspined.[:o]

RE: Heavy arrow, more KE....light arrow, more speed..??
 

I somehow get .....through reading this thread.....that a "complete pass-thru" has a somewhat "macho" overtone". I don't get it (and I don't get 'them"), either. Like Rob/PA....I didn't have a pass-thru on the first 4 deer I took with the bow, this season. The first I hit in the shoulder.....and got complete penetration of the arrow....but no complete pass. The second and third I pretty much stuck to the ground. The fourth was a great shot.....quartering away...that stuck in the opposite side shoulder. Fifth was my biggest deer....and first pass-thru.

I shoot my current arrow set-up based on this advice, only. I trust Gary in many realms.....and this is one of them. I was shooting my Switchback at 64#'s/29"DL to get the results, above. My Allegiance is @ 71#'s/29"DL.I have no idea what my fps is......but I know it's enough to get the job done.;)

Jeff

RE: Heavy arrow, more KE....light arrow, more speed..??
 

Gobblers, I don't think it's a macho overtone as much as trying to get an entrance and exit hole so you get the maximum blood on the ground. Shooting from elevated stands like most of us do, if you don't get an exit hole and because of the angle hit high on the deers body, blood can be quite skimpy at times without an exit hole. Also, if you have the set up to drive the arrow completely through most deer you know you've got enough momentum built up that you'll probably get through heavy bone if the shot isn't perfect andyou happen to hit the wrong spot. It doesn't mean you can't kill a deer without it, but you do improve your chances with the occasional marginal hit. A hole out the bottom means you usually don't have to wait for an animals chest cavity to fill before you get good blood flow. Not a macho thing at all, just a preference of most to get that punch through.

RE: Heavy arrow, more KE....light arrow, more speed..??
 

If you think pass thrus are over rated you better rethink it.

RE: Heavy arrow, more KE....light arrow, more speed..??
 

That may have sounded harsh, Dave.....but I DO think people regard a "complete pass-thru" with some "macho-ness" either for themselves or their bow. Call me a skeptic (and I mean no malice in this observation).

I ONLY know the deer I've tracked. I saw 2 deer die right below me, this season.....and the blood was unbelievable. Like I said....I pretty much stuck these 2 to the ground.....and I'm not really sure if it would have passed thru or not. I knocked them down (where they stood)......and put another arrow in them within seconds. The first buck I took had a very sparse blood trail for much of it......and the arrow had penetrated the off side shoulder (never found the BH end.....but the fletching end protruded the entrance wound when he left my set). The best shot I made all year .........there was NO blood trail (I saw this deer go down about 60 yds away). My best deer of /06 was a complete pass-thru.......and I was scared to death at the MINIMAL amount of blood I had to track him by. It was a perfect hit......but blood was extremely minimal. I was surprised to find him within 40 yds.

These conversations and these different aspects of the entire hunting "experience".......I find fascinating. I never thought tracking would be as much of an adventure as I've found it to be.

Jeff

RE: Heavy arrow, more KE....light arrow, more speed..??
 

I didn't say they were overrated, Motown (those are your words).

Jeff

RE: Heavy arrow, more KE....light arrow, more speed..??
 

10-4

RE: Heavy arrow, more KE....light arrow, more speed..??
 

I like pass throughs, you shoot enough deer, and you'll see where the benifit comes in eventually. Holes can and do plug up. If you've only got one hole and that plugs up on a less than desirable hit, you'll wish you had a pass through.

RE: Heavy arrow, more KE....light arrow, more speed..??
 

No greg that would be macho.

RE: Heavy arrow, more KE....light arrow, more speed..??
 

GregH.....again....I didn't say they were overrated. I've had limited experience with them (ONE). it was a VERY sparse blood trail (even for 40 yds.). He could have bedded before he started to bleed EXTENSIVELY......but there was really no blood where I found him.

The good thing is....in Rob/PA's case AND mine is......we have 100% recovery rate.

I'm proud of that.

Jeff

RE: Heavy arrow, more KE....light arrow, more speed..??
 

I have to say I'm disappointed. Last year when this same topic broke out you would have thought you were on a physicist's forumwith all the formulae and calculations going on. This year, outside of GregH, I haven't seen one post even come close. I don't even think I've seen the formula for velocity yet.

Tighten up guys!


:D

RE: Heavy arrow, more KE....light arrow, more speed..??
 

This is the way I look at it.

Take a 9 iron swing as hard as you and hit me in the head, there is a 98% chance I will not get up.
DO the samething with a baseball bat with the sasme swing speed and there is 99.9% chance I will not get up.

Pretty much both will kill me, one just has a better % inkilling germs;), and not by much.

RE: Heavy arrow, more KE....light arrow, more speed..??
 

Sounds good Germ, when can we start? [X(]

RE: Heavy arrow, more KE....light arrow, more speed..??
 

I just filled out new life insurance policy and turned it in, so have at it, LOL

RE: Heavy arrow, more KE....light arrow, more speed..??
 

I know.

RE: Heavy arrow, more KE....light arrow, more speed..??
 

My deer are macho, my bow is macho, my arrows, maybe not so much, my broadheads are macho and I'm macho from time to time, my camo...yup you guessed it, macho, my treestands are macho but damned if I haven't gotten a macho passthru in years. I must be loosing my MOJO. All this macho must be counter acting itself...[8D]

RE: Heavy arrow, more KE....light arrow, more speed..??
 

at Rob.

RE: Heavy arrow, more KE....light arrow, more speed..??
 

WEll heck, you mean no one is going to say a thing about all of Robs "Macho" things and not mention his short shaft islike deducting odd ball points.[8D][8D] I just had to do it Rob.... the opening was there and I took the shot.[8D]..... and GMATT has told us on more than one occasion your deer are far from Macho. LOL

RE: Heavy arrow, more KE....light arrow, more speed..??
 

Something doesn't seem right. I've shot a lot of deer with bows ranging in poundage from 60 to 66 lbs. Arrow speed from 215 fps to 275 fps. Arrow weight from 400 gr to 560 gr. Unless the shot was extreme quartering away or a spine or shoulder blade hit, all have been pass throughs. I've never tried a mechanical broadhead. Do you think that this could be the difference?

RE: Heavy arrow, more KE....light arrow, more speed..??
 

Thats it.

RE: Heavy arrow, more KE....light arrow, more speed..??
 

YUP. If you recall the early videos all the "Experts" were putting out, they always had pass throughs. I don't know how many videos shots I've seen in the last 2 or 3 years where they got what I call terrible penetration. They're using mechanicals too. If they had been my shots the first words out of my mouth would have been "OH SH--!!!!" It would be a sinking stinking feeling.

RE: Heavy arrow, more KE....light arrow, more speed..??
 

Thats right Dave because you know the blood might be minimal at first even with a pass thru but 20 30 40 yards down the trail its going to start showing up big time. That inch and an eighth hole isn't going to heal.

RE: Heavy arrow, more KE....light arrow, more speed..??
 

You know DaveM I never thought about the older videos compared to the new.

RE: Heavy arrow, more KE....light arrow, more speed..??
 

I know.

RE: Heavy arrow, more KE....light arrow, more speed..??
 

Is this your new thing "I know", LOL

RE: Heavy arrow, more KE....light arrow, more speed..??
 

No.

RE: Heavy arrow, more KE....light arrow, more speed..??
 

I know:D

RE: Heavy arrow, more KE....light arrow, more speed..??
 

Germ Knows football..... oh wait, that was Bo. Mo knows.

RE: Heavy arrow, more KE....light arrow, more speed..??
 

We'll see, like I said earlier in the thread, I had Muzzy's and Snyper's both grouping together so this year I'll shoot a deer with each of them and see what happens. Oh by the way, the Muzzy's are macho too, muy macho! But the only downfall is I'm shooting more KE with the Bowtech then the VorTec.