RE: 2 Minutes - 2 Button Bucks
 

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote<font size=1 face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>The new thinking from Biologists is that a certain percentage of them will die anyway, so taking them out is still a good part of herd management. <hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote></font id=quote><font face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' size=2 id=quote>

Dale,

This statement needs a little more detail to make sense. What exactly are the biologists saying? Predation will take a certain number regardless of how many are killed by hunters. Carrying capacity should only come into play in certain areas where there is overpopulation or drought. Disease may take more fawns than adults, but why would disease losses be less if more buttons are taken by hunters? If late-born buttons don't tend to make it through the winter, that shouldn't matter, because hunters aren't selective. They will shoot bigger, slightly older buttons as well as the small buttons.

It would seem to me that if a small number of buttons are shot, the biologists wouldn't be concerned, but I can't imagine they advocate shooting them, but then again I haven't read the latest research. Anybody know any links to this subject on the net?

RE: 2 Minutes - 2 Button Bucks
 

Congrats to your dad on his first bow kills. I always tell everyone to shoot &quot;A&quot; deer the first good opportunity you get when you start bowhunting. It'll make you a better hunter and more prepared mentally when the big guy shows up. If you wait 2 or 3 or as some on these boards have done(15 years <img src=icon_smile_shock.gif border=0 align=middle> and your first attempt is at MR Big... you'll probably melt down. NY has some very big button bucks. I shot one once that dressed at just over 100 pounds. Heck, our does don't usually weigh that much. Hey folks, you got to remember this gal is from the BRONX.<img src=icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle> They have a hard time identifying anything that doesn't feed on concrete.<img src=icon_smile_wink.gif border=0 align=middle>

AGAIN.... Congrats to your dad.

RE: 2 Minutes - 2 Button Bucks
 

For a second time Ladybowhunter, congrats to your father in law.

Grim Reaper in Va. you can take 2 deer without tagging the first before the second, as a matter of fact this year I could have taken 2 doe in less than 3 minutes, I knocked the first down in plain view of me and after I nocked another arrow and lite up a well deserved smoke to celebrate and wait, I spotted movement to my left, another doe was walking towards the one I had already knocked down. Well I was totally unprepared and she busted me and took off as I started to put the pin on her.

Mike from Texas you say a bowhunter is unethical if they can not tell if a button is a button or not!! I have to assume that there are no real buttons where you hunt for you to make a statement like that, I have seen buttons where the antler/button was not visible above the hair as a matter of fact in fact if it is bucks only in Va. and you kill a button where the antlers are not visible above the hairline you can be written up for killing a doe.

I do not remember who said it, but I laughed out loud when they said something about &quot;you should be able to see both thier antlers and there balls&quot; I am paraphrasing here, but who ever said that must have some well hung young bucks in the area they hunt! LOL

The worst thing about this whole thread is how instead of being a congradulatory and teaching opportunity about making sure your bow is well tuned and you practice with what you are shooting, it turned in to an insulting thread that took everything away from someone who has every right to be proud of his accomplishment.

The Tazman aka Martin Price
Founder and President of
Virginia Disabled Outdoorsmen Club

RE: 2 Minutes - 2 Button Bucks
 

I hesitate to even respond, since a certain element found another thread to bicker and whine aout, but here goes...
Bob Zaiglan
Deer & Deer Hunting

&quot;although hunters might shoot fewer buck fawns by using binoculars or waiting until several deer are visible....any restriction decreases the antlerless harvest and hurts management goals.&quot;

&quot;hunters hsould strive to reduce antlerless deer numbers with little or no effort to &quot;spare&quot; buck fawns&quot;

For those who don'tknow, Bob Zaiglan was a pioneer of QDM, and managed Texas herds for a living before anyone on this board heard of QDM. Heck, he was promoting shooting does and letting little bucks walk before most of us picked up our first bow.

In the article, I believe he was stating that the vast majority of hunters hunt a few days a year, and these types of hunters make up the bulk of the harvest, so placing restrictions on their antlerless harvest would hurt the goal just about every state has of reducing deer numbers, and managing for quality.
You get the feeling he would certainly reccomend to seasoned, experienced hunters to shoot a doe, since the people who are in the woods dozens of times each year don't find it difficultt to identify a bb, and have little trouble finding a doe, or doe fawn.
Most hunters don't spend all day on the internet talking aout hunting, so the people here are the minority, and I'd certainly recomend passingg bb, but not if you're a new hunter.
I've also had some formal teaching in Wildlife Management, I took classes under Dr Dave Samuel at WVU while obtaining a Biology degree, so while I'm far from an expert like some here, <img src=icon_smile_wink.gif border=0 align=middle> I do undersand the terminology.

That's the latest thinking in managing deer for higher quality, balanced sex ratios, etc.





&quot;In heaven, even the fish have antlers&quot;

RE: 2 Minutes - 2 Button Bucks
 

Ok now lets realy piss down our tarsel gland. In the states that you have to take an anterless deer before you can take a buck, how many of you have killed a button just to get a chance at a buck? And don't lie.

RE: 2 Minutes - 2 Button Bucks
 

Ladybowhunter38,

It would seem that you have stirred up quite a bit of a hornet's nest here. It is very rare that I take off to go hunting and come back to find a thread with 80-some responses-4 pages in only a 2 or 3 day time span.

First, I would like to congratulate your father for harvesting two deer. It is quite an accomplishment.

As for the other comments related to this issue....I would sincerely suggest that he spend a little more time with his equipment since we do owe it to the animals to offer a clean, humane kill. I would assume that he was to some extent proficient with his equipment if he shot two deer and recovered them in under 45 minutes. Regardless of whether he shoots fixed blades or expandables a bow should be properly tuned prior to any hunt. Now, these last few comments were not a lecture or my condemning your father. Quite the opposite actually. I was just offering some friendly advice.

As for the issue of the deer being button bucks.....

...I think JRW summed up my feelings rather nicely....

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote<font size=1 face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>

The only argument that I've seen thus far against shooting button bucks is that they will never have a chance to become antlered bucks...and possibly a trophy buck. Folks, this is NOT an ethics issue, it's a trophy hunting issue. If you're a trophy hunter then fine, let them walk and wait for a deer that will make you happy. It's your right, and your decision to make. Please remember though, some of us never were, are not now, and have no desire to be, trophy hunters.

JRW
<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote></font id=quote><font face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' size=2 id=quote>

RE: 2 Minutes - 2 Button Bucks
 

Ladybowhunter38 - Congratulations to your dad-in-law.

This issue with button bucks has been a disgusting read. What's the big deal people? A button buck might well be next years trophy, but harvesting a doe does more harm to a deer herd population.

I support harvesting deer within the legal boundries. I don't bowhunt for racks, I have enough of those. Does or button bucks still fit in the freezer.<img src=icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle>

Just my opinion.



GForce

Shoot often - Hunt always

RE: 2 Minutes - 2 Button Bucks
 

6ptsika,

So if I'm interpreting that correctly, they are not actually advocating shooting buttons, just saying it's unavoidable if they are going to meet their goal of reducing the deer herd. That I can understand.

RE: 2 Minutes - 2 Button Bucks
 

LadyBowHunter,
Send your FIL my congratulations on his first two bowkills. They will make for some very good eating. I never did like the taste of horns myself. You have to cook them too long to make them soft enough to eat.

The only difference between a doe and a yearling (either sex) is how I'm gonna butcher it up. A big fat doe gets the regular treatment and the tender yearling gets quartered for the grill. Yummy!!

Like some of the other true archers who really want to improve our sport instead of degrade it, I would recommend your FIL spend some time tuning his setup before the next hunt. We all have to start somewhere and I'm sure he has learned from his experience and I wish him the best of luck on the next hunt.

To the trophy police,
Shut up and go away!!! If the guy pulling the bow doesn't care if they're buttons why the hell should you???? He's not hunting on your land and with your attitude, not many novice hunters will hunt with you. We have always had novice bow hunters and we always will have novice bow hunters since (thank God) there are more born every day. What our sport does NOT need are idiots claiming they are experienced running off the novices who are trying to learn. I've shot quite a few buttons and them little horns didn't get in my way one bit and they certainly didn't keep you and your kind from your horn hunting. Since when does trophy management have anything to do with ethical shot placement anyway??

On the management issue,
I hate to dissappoint the horn hunters, but I probably live in one of the hardest hunted areas in the U.S. Our deer get dog hunted, still hunted with rifles, bowhunted and smokepoled in continous cycles for 4 1/2 months each year and it is not unusual to hear poachers shooting in the middle of the night either. With all of that hunting pressure, I killed a 6 1/2 year old nine point last year and have seen two large racked deer so far this year. One of them VERY large. You could go out bowhunting for button bucks on your managed land every outing and you still won't get them all so stop being so anal about your management practices and try to enjoy hunting a little more. Killing a button buck now and then is NOT going to ruin your precious little trophy kingdom. You need to do a little MORE hunting and a whole lot LESS preaching.

RE: 2 Minutes - 2 Button Bucks
 

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote<font size=1 face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>On the management issue,
I hate to dissappoint the horn hunters, but I probably live in one of the hardest hunted areas in the U.S. Our deer get dog hunted, still hunted with rifles, bowhunted and smokepoled in continous cycles for 4 1/2 months each year and it is not unusual to hear poachers shooting in the middle of the night either. With all of that hunting pressure, I killed a 6 1/2 year old nine point last year and have seen two large racked deer so far this year. One of them VERY large. You could go out bowhunting for button bucks on your managed land every outing and you still won't get them all so stop being so anal about your management practices and try to enjoy hunting a little more. Killing a button buck now and then is NOT going to ruin your precious little trophy kingdom. You need to do a little MORE hunting and a whole lot LESS preaching.<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote></font id=quote><font face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' size=2 id=quote>

That funny, after having just read your sermon!

RE: 2 Minutes - 2 Button Bucks
 

Ok my 2cents. First of all I dont remember her asking for any dm advice. So if its not your land he was on, get off his back. secondly, after the year this man has had, its nice to hear he found something to make him run around like a kid at xmas. So it wont make the &quot;Hunting with (your name here)&quot; video collection. Some of you are treating this man as if he poached these deer just because he didnt drop down and cry when he found out they were bb's. Congrats on the deer.
By the way do all you trophy hunters also let the legal, but &quot;sub trophy&quot; fish and birds go too? Or is this policy only in deer season?<img src=icon_smile_wink.gif border=0 align=middle>

RE: 2 Minutes - 2 Button Bucks
 

Consider it a sermon if you will. I consider it something that really, REALLY needed to be said.

Let's recap what has happened with this thread. LadyBH comes on here to post about a successful hunt and it is very easy to tell that she is ecstatic for her father-in-law and some of these morons rain all over her parade because THEY consider shooting a button buck beneath THEM. I honestly can't remember ever reading anything that has pissed me off more than some of the posts on here.

If anyone wants to give advice, fine. You might try to do it with a little moral decency like some of the better members of this forum did. If I hurt any of your feelings GOOD!!!! as I'm sure your comments didn't do much for LadyBH's feelings either!

RE: 2 Minutes - 2 Button Bucks
 

I would be glad to sum it up for you, some of us Johnny doo gooder wild life manager's don't have to shoot fawns to make our selves feel better and just to fill the freezer. To the people who say how challenging it is to kill fawns well he killed the second fawn becouse after he shot the first one the second on was too young and nieve to know what happened to the first one. I agree with the guy from texas at bow hunting range you should be able to tell if it's a button buck. If he want's to shoot them fine but don't come here looking for respect and act like your some big shot. I don't care where you hunt or what state you live in you can wait for a mature deer every state in the us has more mature deer than fawns. I waited for a mature deer when I was a kid and my son will too. I don't see the sense in saying ahhh if your new to hunting just shoot a fawn WHY? WHY can't you wait for a mature deer. In that case your just shooting a fawn to say ahhh look at me I got my first deer it dressed out at 60 lbs. I have no problem with some one shooting a leagal deer but please don't come with up bull s#it about how shooting fawns is sound deer management. I have never seen the big rancher's say go out and shoot one those management fawns boy's we need to thin em out a little. Some of you guy's just come up with excuses for any thing. Good luck with bambi this year guy's I hope ya all fill you tags with those monster 60lb button bucks I am sure the local taxerdermist will be flooded with work.

RE: 2 Minutes - 2 Button Bucks
 

Stickemup,

I dont' really disagree with what much of what you said. But, what the heck is wrong with wanting to manage the herd and questioning some management practices?

I never said he shouldn't shoot a button buck. I said if it's legal and someone wants to, then go ahead. I simply guestioned the statement that, killing buttons was good for the herd. I was trying to find out the rational behind that. Then you get on here and start name calling and putting down those of us who do want to manage the herd. You are acting no different than those who are putting this guy down for shooting buttons.

RE: 2 Minutes - 2 Button Bucks
 

I was going to stay out of this, but just can't! first congrats to your father on the deer. ANY deer taken with a bow is somthing to be proud of. I have shot button bucks, and will probably shoot one again. If given a choice I would shoot the bigger doe, but thier is NOTHING wrong with shooting any legal deer you wish. If you do it within the law. Hey I take what I can get for the first deer or two of the year, and then I get pickey. I have been blessed in that I have been a fairly successful bowhunter, and deerhunter in general, but when I take someone out for their first deer, I tell them to shoot the first legal animal they can. Davidmil has the right Idea with that. I do agree with the others in that proper bow tuning will help solve the broadhead flight problems and I cringe everytime I hear someone say &quot;use a mechanical becuase you won't have to tune your bow&quot;<img src=icon_smile_shock.gif border=0 align=middle><img src=icon_smile_dissapprove.gif border=0 align=middle>Nothing could be farther from the truth, and that is one of the reasons mechanical heads have had recieved so much &quot;bad press&quot;. Again though congrats on the deer and some very fine eating!

TAKE YOUR KIDS HUNTING AND YOU WON'T BE HUNTING FOR YOUR KIDS

RE: 2 Minutes - 2 Button Bucks
 

Grim Reaper, that's the dumbest post of the day, congratulations!
1) Nobody said it's very challenging to kill fawns, they said those little buggers are tasty!
2)The man didn't come looking for respect, OR acting like a big shot, his daughter-in-law came to share a great story with us of a new bowhunter's success. Hopefully she learned something to pass on about tuning a bow. You're the one with the ego problem.
3)They're not mounting the buttons, they're eating them, some hunt for tasty venison, you're the one who wants a set of horns to brag on, and act like a big man.
4) You haven't been around many ranches, have ya? Most offer antlerless shoots in the winter, after you big shots go home. You can get some good deals on a package for 2-3 antlerless deer, usually, and in some states, they'll tack on hogs, ect. Yes, they shoot the fawns, the does, any deer without a rack.

Straightarrow, I interpret it the same way.
Done with this thread..

&quot;In heaven, even the fish have antlers&quot;

[Deleted]
 

[Deleted by Admins]

RE: 2 Minutes - 2 Button Bucks
 

I'm makin my next on a BB in honor of this thread.

~Will Hunt For Food~

RE: 2 Minutes - 2 Button Bucks
 

SPIKEY open mouth insert foot.#1 Go back put your glasses on and read yes a FEW not just one person in this thread did say that. So don't give me your stupid comments.

#2 Lady didn't come here looking for repect but other's that posted in this thread made comment's such as I have shot em before and I'll do it again and They are very tender and tasty. So yes they are saying they like shooting fawns and will keep doing it. It sure sounds to me like they enjoy and are happy with doing this.

#3 I was being sarcastic about them mounting them. The one's who say it's such a challenge to kill fawns well why not get their big kill mounted so they can remember how thrilling it was to kill it.

#4 Yes I have been to a few managed deer properties and WHILE YES THEY DO HARVEST DOE'S I can assure you no outfitter would be happy about one of his hunter's that are supposed to be takeing management doe's shooting a fawn button buck. So once again you have served a nice pile of sh!t on silver plater. Why in god's green earth would a rancher want to take a button buck that will potentialy make him 2 or 3 thousand dollars in a few year's when it grows up? He wouldn't!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Of all the tv. shows even that I see where they were shooting management deer yes I seen them take doe's and yes I have seen them take rack buck's but never a fawn.


Please if you can't come up with any thing better why bother. You try to make a case by saying they remove antlerless deer but you know as well as I they try to remove mature doe's not button buck's.

RE: 2 Minutes - 2 Button Bucks
 

OK I have to throw in my comments here. I am not going to even begin to comment about shooting the buttons, that's been beat here and I just don't feel further comment about that part will do any good. THe part that really bugs me is shooting and missing 6 deer, going out and grabbing some mech's to make up for poor prepartion in the preseason. That is a more glaring problem than what he actually shot. a person must enter the wooods knowing they can kill a deer within a preset range, not just hope thye can hit something.

RE: 2 Minutes - 2 Button Bucks
 

Well, I truly can't believe the trouble this thread caused. I am so sorry for even posting it, and it will make me think twice (or maybe 3 times) before I post again. I was looking foward to getting my 1st deer with a bow and posting the picture here, but now I don't think I will. I was so happy for my father-in-law when he got those 2 deer. It is legal, he wouldn't do anything that wasn't. They were tagged as does because that's how it's done here. Yes, he should have tuned his broadheads, and my husband is working with him on that. Also, by the way, he did not wound that other deer, every shot was low. I know he would be the first to feel horrible for wounding and not finding a deer. Everybody could use a little instruction, maybe some of us more than others, but the main reason for the post was because I was just so happy for him for the joy it brought to him. I certainly DID NOT come here to BRAG about shooting 2 button bucks. I am as ethical a hunter as anyone here, and I really didn't see the harm in it. We butchered those deer last night, and I can't wait to eat the tasty venison - all venison is tasty to me - a big doe, buck, yearling or button buck. We have not done well in the past few years in putting venison in the freezer, not for lack of trying, but for lack of seeing deer. So when those 2 showed up at Dad's stand, I'm sure he saw the venison that's been so hard to come by lately. I did think that was one of the reasons we were out there for - putting food on the table. I DO KNOW that he thought they were does. He did not purposely go out in search of button bucks to shoot. Why do some of you make it sound like he did? <img src=icon_smile_dissapprove.gif border=0 align=middle><img src=icon_smile_blackeye.gif border=0 align=middle>

RE: 2 Minutes - 2 Button Bucks
 

Straightarrow,
There is absolutely nothing wrong with YOU managing YOUR herd. I never heard LadyBH calling any horn hunters unethical or saying anything derogatory towards them for THEIR management practices. What I want to know is what gives the horn hunters the right to judge her or her father-in-law for shooting any legal deer they want?

Any of you that want to practice QDM or TDM until your bucks have massive antlers growing out of their rear-ends go right ahead. Nobody is stopping you or calling your practices unethical, but how dare you chastize someone for enjoying a good HUNT!!!

RE: 2 Minutes - 2 Button Bucks
 

Ladybowhunter, to discourage you from leaving or not posting your first kill, here is a quick review of the thread.

You had positive responses from about 36 individuals, most posting only once.

You had negative responses from about 8 individuals, many posting multiple times.

You also had a handful of what I would call neutral responses.

So positive response was 4 1/2 times greater than negative.
Don't let the vocal minority drive you away. I doubt if they want that.

[img]http://gra.midco.net/gingerichs/moose.gif&quot; &gt;

Edited by - Dacotah on 11/12/2002 11:24:26

RE: 2 Minutes - 2 Button Bucks
 

Nice recap Dacotah.

At this point I would kindly ask anyone that is going to continue to post that they remain civil in regards to this topic.

If you disagree with one side of the issue or another then please do so appropriately. Calling people names and making fun of their opinions is not.

Thank you.

RE: 2 Minutes - 2 Button Bucks
 

GrimReaper:
<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote<font size=1 face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>
So yes they are saying they like shooting fawns and will keep doing it. It sure sounds to me like they enjoy and are happy with doing this.
<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote></font id=quote><font face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' size=2 id=quote>

I don't think it has anything at all to do with enjoyment of shooting fawns. It has to do with the enjoyment of shooting DEER. Thats why it is called DEER HUNTING. I think you, and a few others have lost sight of the big picture, and what it's all about. I have never met a single hunter that specifically seeks out yearlings. But I know several people who will fill their freezer (the whole point for the majority) with whatever present an opportunity. This year, it might be a yearling, next year, it might be a 10 point. Also, it is absolutely no concern of yours what he shot, I don't know why you have your panties in a bunch. You have complained more about the button buck issue than you have about him having obvious tuning issues. If your a big buck only hunter(and I do have my doubts about that), then that is great, more power to you. But get off your high horse, &quot;your way&quot; is no better than anyone else's.

--Sign In Chinese Pet Store: &quot;Buy one dog, get one flea...&quot;--

RE: 2 Minutes - 2 Button Bucks
 

Indyhunter I may not exclusivly shoot big buck's but atleast I don't shoot every fawn that come's by my stand. When people say I have shot fawns before and I will do it again and shooting fawns is a challenge becouse they are smaller they are people who will not hesitate to shoot a fawn and while they will shoot a big doe or rack buck if they see it they will also take a fawn just to shoot some thing. This is an opions board and I am giving my opion if you like it or not. Does anyone have the right to shoot a fawn heck yea it's leagal but it sure as #ell isn't the most sporting thing to do. Making excuses that the meat is tender and first time hunter's should shoot any thing and fawns are more challenging are just that excuses people make up to convince them selves that what they are doing is some wonderful hunting accomplishment and not running out into the woods shooting the first thing you see. How many people here can honestly say with out deer meat they would go hungry? probably none so why not wait for a mature deer instead of just killing the first thing that comes along after all it is called hunting. The lady who started this thread said he shot them becouse they don't see many deer so they shoot what ever comes along. Well they must see some deer if he missed 6 once again it's just an excuse to kill the first thing that came along. I am glad that guy got a deer and it doesn't realy matter what it was becouse it was leagal but hpeful next time he will practice with his bow and wait for a mature deer.

RE: 2 Minutes - 2 Button Bucks
 

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote<font size=1 face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>
Straightarrow,
There is absolutely nothing wrong with YOU managing YOUR herd. <hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote></font id=quote><font face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' size=2 id=quote>

Are you saying it's inappropriate to talk about deer manangement when the issue arises? I was simply responding to the statement that &quot;killing buttons will improve the herd&quot;.

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote><font size=1 face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>Nobody is stopping you or calling your practices unethical, <hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote></font id=quote><font face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' size=2 id=quote>

I do get the feeling that I'm not welcome to ask about management principals. Also, there seems to be an implication that if it's legal then we should have no concern over the practice, and have no right to debate it.

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote><font size=1 face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>but how dare you chastize someone for enjoying a good HUNT!!!
<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote></font id=quote><font face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' size=2 id=quote>

I don't know what you're talking about. I never said a single negative thing about her dad taking the button. My whole reason for posting on this thread was to question the deer management philosophy of shooting buttons. Also, this has nothing to do with QDM, just deer management. Maybe you're confusing me with someone else. Go back and read mine and then tell me where I chastised her.

RE: 2 Minutes - 2 Button Bucks
 

Ladybowhunter38 Dakota summed up what the majority of people felt here, do not leave nor stop posting because of a few folks on a high horse. I am basically a happy person because I try to look at the good side of life and try to make others lifes better by praise and teaching. I wonder how unhappy someone must be to find joy in critisizing others.

I, and others here truely do hope that we get to see pics of your first bowkill, I got my first bowkill this year after 3 seasons, it was a nice fat doe, as a matter of fact I just finished eating some of the first batch of jerky from her. Remember when that first opportunity presents itself, do not think about what others will think, as long as it is legal and it makes you happy, TAKE IT!!!! Then we want to hear the whole story and see the pics to boot.

You know I have a nasty feeling that some newby may have started to read this thread and seen how harsh a few individuals could be and figured why bother asking, all these folks are going to do is rip me to pieces, because I may have made a mistake or I may ask a question that they view as stupid, I hope I am wrong.

The Tazman aka Martin Price
Founder and President of
Virginia Disabled Outdoorsmen Club

RE: 2 Minutes - 2 Button Bucks
 

Straightarrow,
I posted back to you specifically because you responded to my first post. I don't have a problem at all with your asking about management practices. My comments were directed toward those that acted like LadyBH and her FIL were doing something wrong. The first part of my last post was to you, the second part was to the horn hunters in general who seem to look down on anyone who doesn't hunt the way they do. Sorry for any confusion.

LadyBowHunter,
Please don't let this stop you from posting about your hunts. As you can see, the idiots are everywhere at once and can't be stopped, but they can be ignored. There are many more hunters than idiots so there is still hope. Good luck with getting your first deer and I hope your FIL gets many more.

RE: 2 Minutes - 2 Button Bucks
 

Well, this is it. I am going to move away from this thread after this post.
I want to thank all of you who congratulated my father-in-law on his bow kills. It's nice to know fellow hunters can be happy about someone elses success.
I especially want to thank Tazman, PABowhunter,Stickemup, Dacotah(for pointing out that the vast majority are not above me or my father-in-law), and Royak1, Lady Forge & Coueslite for their e-mails making me feel a whole lot better about starting this whole thing to begin with. Thank you also for your condolences, I will pass them on to my Dad.
I will post the story of my first bow kill and post pictures. That is, of course, only if I am blessed to be able to have one of those magnificent creatures come within my range.I can't wait until Saturday to be out there again. Take care all and HAPPY HUNTING!!!<img src=icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle>

Edited by - Ladybowhunter38 on 11/12/2002 13:21:00

RE: 2 Minutes - 2 Button Bucks
 

All I can say is congratulations on the 2 deer. If they only ran 30 and 100 yards, he must have done some good shooting. Just get that bow tuned, and go get another! <img src=icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle>

Edited by - joshkeller on 11/12/2002 16:07:45

RE: 2 Minutes - 2 Button Bucks
 

&quot;The drawback to bowhunting's popularity is, the woods are becoming overcrowded and there aren't enough &quot;old-timers&quot; passing on the ethics and skills necessary to become what I call a &quot;real hunter&quot;.

&quot;What I mean by that is, it takes skill and experience to be a hunter. Anyone can shoot game. A real hunter will always strive to make the best shot and pass up a bad shot (even at a trophy-class animal). A real hunter has a deep respect for the animal hunted and the environment in which it lives.&quot;

&quot;There isn't an unlimited supply of game and a real hunter is not a game hog. Hunting season and bag limits are set for a good reason. In my family, we have self-imposed limits.&quot;

Linda Thompson
Writer/hunter


&quot;Today there is no need to battle with the beasts of prey and little necessity to kill wild animals for food; but still the instinct persists. The love of the chase still thrills us and all the misty past echoes with the hunters call.&quot;

&quot;In the joy of hunting, is intimately woven the love of the great outdoors. The beauty of woods, valleys, mountains, and skies feeds the soul of the sportsman where the quest of game only whets his appetite.&quot;

&quot;After all, it is not the killing that brings satisfaction; it is the contest of skill and cunning. The true hunter counts his achievement in proportion to the effort involved and the fairness of the sport&quot;

Dr. Saxton Pope

Edited by - c903 on 11/12/2002 13:54:48

RE: 2 Minutes - 2 Button Bucks
 

Congratulations on two quick, clean kills. Forget the negative posts, they mean nothing to anyone but themselves.

Those kind of responses make me worry that our biggest threat to our sport may not be the anti's but rather our own backbiting.

RE: 2 Minutes - 2 Button Bucks
 

Come on the two biggest problems with all of this is:
1) THE NAME CALLING AND BASHING IS REDICULOUS.

2) THE USE OF THE WORD FAWN. THE LAST TIME I LOOKED A FAWN IS A VERY SMALL DEER WITH SPOTS. IT HAS NEVER BEEN ESTABLISHED THAT THESE DEER HAD SPOTS. LAY OFF OF IT PLEASE.

I don't remember who it was but there was a kid that posted about the same time this thread was, and he was writing about the dogs barking. The kid out right said that he pulled down on a FAWN (and these were his exact words) and had every intention of killing it. It is strange how he was told to keep trying and he would get one and not one person blasted him for it. Not quite sure what the difference is but this has gotten way out of hand.
Can't we all get along and try to help each other?
:)

RE: 2 Minutes - 2 Button Bucks
 

Grim Reaper, one person said that shooting fawns were harder because they are harder to hit, and that person was CLEARLY joking. see your post below:

&quot;When people say I have shot fawns before and I will do it again and shooting fawns is a challenge becouse they are smaller&quot;

Lets stick to the real topics here and not twist words. Congrats to this gentleman on his hunt, glad to hear he has the passion, and glad to hear he learned what an improperly tuned setup will do without having to wound anything to find out.

And for those of you who can tell a button at 20 yards, walking through a small opening, God bless you, I can't. I have no desire to try and please those 'hunters' who feel shooting a young deer is beneath them. I hunt because I enjoy it, and am selective when I want to be, and to be honest I kind of wonder how many 'trophies' the trophy hunters around here have shot.

RE: 2 Minutes - 2 Button Bucks
 

I got news for all of you, if a button buck gets close enough for me to have him for dinner, that is exactly what I will do. Eat him for dinner, and enjoy every delicious bite!

And I can tell you right now, if I didn't get excited everytime I killed any deer I wouldn't be hunting anymore. Mistake? I think not sounds, like they have a years worth of venison in the freezer. However, I am a little concerned with six missed shots, not tuning a bow before steppng in to the woods isn't a mistake it is sacrilege. Because, if a button buck gets within range, and you missed for lack of tuning you should hang up your bow and find a new sport like crochet.

Love,
KSUIE

RE: 2 Minutes - 2 Button Bucks
 

C903,
Can you expain to me exactly what part of your last post these people violated?? They hunted and they were successful and they were totally within the law. End of story.

If anyone is TOTALLY missing the point of your post it is you. I didn't once see the words trophy buck or mature deer in there. A deer does not have to be huge to be meaningful.

RE: 2 Minutes - 2 Button Bucks
 

You can beat this subject to death and you will never get everyone to agree. Some people are lucky to even see a few deer in an entire year and they will shoot the first deer to come along. Some people get excited when any deer comes within shooting range and then they all look large. If I need meat then I do try to be choisey when I can but I am disabled and cannot climb the mountains anymore and cannot afford a 4 wheeler so I am limited in the places where I can hunt. I also cannot see as well as in years gone by and if I decide to take a young animal then I cannot tell its on the ground if it has buttons or not. I guess some on this board would say then I shouldnt be hunting. Thats their opinion.

This board used to be a fun place to visit and to post on. A place to get help and info now it seems like more and more it is a place if things arent worded just right then you get jumped on.

To me all deer are trophys if they are taken legally and expecally with a bow. I have over 40 years experience in deer hunting and have taken my share of deer with a bow a gun and a muzzleloader and the thrill is still the same today as it was the first time I got one.

Let us not forget most people post on here because they are proud of their kill and if we cant have something positive to say to them then we should just leave the post alone. What we are doing is showing new people that some of us are (perferct hunters who never make a mistake and always take hugh animals) which if you are then I should soon be seeing your show on tv.

In WV this year I can take between 9&12 deer I'm not even sure which but in reality what if I take 9 what will I do with them but thats what the DNR wants it is entirely possible that all the deer in WV could be wiped out in this one season alone. Will it happen NO but it could they say there are entirely too many deer but I also know several hunters that have not even saw one.

Come on guys lets turn this thing around and turn this board back into what it was a great place for hunters new and old lets say congrats to someone who lets us know he has scored and try to help those in need of tracking help, or the ones that need help tuneing their bow and stop this knittpicking and running them off.
Just one old mans opinion

Roy

RE: 2 Minutes - 2 Button Bucks
 

I figured add my 2cents. I personnally don't knock what other hunters decide to shoot long as its legal. I may joke to friends of mine about certain situations, but deep down it was their choice, and if they are happy with it, so be it. Personnally I don't like to shoot fawns. I did take a button buck as my first deer many yrs back, and another button couple yrs later, as it was alreadly hit, and limping bad, so I finished him off. That was close to 18yrs ago. I haven't taken a fawn since. I've learned how to identify fawns in my woods whether alone or with a adult deer. I myself find it fairly easy now. Here in NY I can identify them by simply looking at their face. Fawns always have that short young face unlike adults, especially adult doe who have a longer snout. Body size of fawns varies, and I've seen some good size healthy fawns this season I'm sure others will mistake for doe come gun season. Just like waterfowl hunters need to quickly identify that flying duck before they shoot for species bag limits, we as bowhunters need to learn to identify our targets if you have certain goals in the woods. If not kill as you must.

RE: 2 Minutes - 2 Button Bucks
 

LADYBOWHUNTER38,

JUST MY 2 CENTS, MY DAD IS 82 YEARS YOUNG. IF HE SHOT 2 BUTTON BUCKS I WOULD HAVE TEARS OF JOY IN MY EYES FOR HIM, ESPECIALLY IF THAT MADE HIM HAPPY.

I GUESS THAT SOME OF THE PEOPLE IN THIS FORUM JUST DO NOT REALIZE THAT LIFE DOES COME TO AN END FOR US ALSO AND EVERY YEAR I TAKE MY DAD HUNTING COULD POSSIBLY BE HIS LAST. HE SPENT MANY A DAY IN THE WOODS WITH ME, NOW ITS MY TURN FOR HIM.

IT IS SO OBVIOUS TO ME THAT THIS FILLED YOUR DADS HEAT WITH JOY AND THAT IS ALL THAT MATTERS. WEATHER IT IS RIGHT OR WRONG WHO CARES AS LONG AS IT MADE HIM HAPPY. I SAY &quot;CONGRATULATIONS TO HIM&quot; AND ALSO TO YOU FOR SUPPORTING HIS TRIUMPH.

Hunt on Hunt hard Eat well