BP guns blowing up?
02-09-2005, 04:20 AM
#11
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Jim Thorpe, PA
Posts: 536
RE: BP guns blowing up?
I had a CVA once but I would never use 150 grains of anything in it. But I also had prior ML experience with a flintlock and knew that high a powder charge isn't warranted. I agree that a lot of people are new to the sport and don't know what they are doing.
Alcohol maybe?
heard on the radio the day after New Years someone was carrying on a tradition and firing a blackpowder gun and it exploded and killed him.I was just wandering what causes this to happen.
02-09-2005, 06:08 AM
#12
Guest
Posts: n/a
RE: BP guns blowing up?
livbucks, no your not taking your lives in your own hands as much as some think, I believe. I just think there's alot of people that has taken safety too far in life. Same people that child proof thier house rounding off all sharp corners and putting GFI's in every socket with covers. Randy is one of them.
I am not a huge randy wakman fan, as I have read his stuff on several pages. I believe he has a niche and is playing it as far as it will go. I don't believe, that the ML are blowing up cause of magnum loads. A ML is a special thing that you can place in the category with reloading. You do it enough you are going to make a mistake. Bottom line.
The internet is a horrible thing sometimes. It puts people in a panic, and really takes away thier balls IMO.
Since the internet took off in 1994, and people got together discussing things, it has been crazy. I got a friend in customer service at Harley Davidson. In the 80's and early 90's, HD had some serious issues with the evo's bearings. Not too many made peeps about it. Since the internet took, off, it exploded. Customer service could not keep up with the calls, people saying, "I heard on the internet", then followed by, "I know 10 people with the same problem" just to throw in some credibility of the call. Now, I know people with the 99-2000 bearing issue, that won't take long trips cause they heard on the internet a problem. Holy cow, where are people's guts. I still ride my 99 Roadking with 35K miles. Long trips, short trips. Life is too short to be in fear constantly worrying about things that never happened.
I am not a huge randy wakman fan, as I have read his stuff on several pages. I believe he has a niche and is playing it as far as it will go. I don't believe, that the ML are blowing up cause of magnum loads. A ML is a special thing that you can place in the category with reloading. You do it enough you are going to make a mistake. Bottom line.
The internet is a horrible thing sometimes. It puts people in a panic, and really takes away thier balls IMO.
Since the internet took off in 1994, and people got together discussing things, it has been crazy. I got a friend in customer service at Harley Davidson. In the 80's and early 90's, HD had some serious issues with the evo's bearings. Not too many made peeps about it. Since the internet took, off, it exploded. Customer service could not keep up with the calls, people saying, "I heard on the internet", then followed by, "I know 10 people with the same problem" just to throw in some credibility of the call. Now, I know people with the 99-2000 bearing issue, that won't take long trips cause they heard on the internet a problem. Holy cow, where are people's guts. I still ride my 99 Roadking with 35K miles. Long trips, short trips. Life is too short to be in fear constantly worrying about things that never happened.
02-09-2005, 08:11 AM
#13
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 1,263
RE: BP guns blowing up?
I've asked this before here and other forums - I'll try again. What are the signs in a ML rifle that pressure is getting too high? They're pretty well known when using centerfire cartridges - but I've seen nothing that explains what to look for in a ML with respect to high pressure (other than accuracy declining).
02-09-2005, 08:45 AM
#15
Boone & Crockett
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Idaho
Posts: 11,703
RE: BP guns blowing up?
Rwalter63 ,
You are correct CVA uses the cold drawn process as does Traditions and Austin & Halleck...
The article in your reference and the article that was quoted in this string, written by Randy Wakeman, are Randy's attempt to create a problem. Randy has an agenda, Traditions, BPI/CVA/Winchester, have never replied to his liking when asked a direct question, and when they did he didn't like their explanation. Since then he has been on a one man campaign to rid us of these two companies. Another factor, he is a huge "buy" American fan which I agree with when possible.
Randy basis his campaign on the "Proof Stamp" on the barrel - He interprets this stamp to indicate the maximum pressure the barrel can successfuly stand over a large number of discharges... Traditions - CVA both maintain the stamp is not a pressure test and using a quote from Ray Crow Austin & Halleck. "and he is speaking for Austin & Halleck only"
I have a huge amount of resect for Ray and what he does so I really lean to following his words.
If in doubt always refer to your manual and if necessary follow up with a conversation with the manufacture - they really do want you to be safe...
You are correct CVA uses the cold drawn process as does Traditions and Austin & Halleck...
The article in your reference and the article that was quoted in this string, written by Randy Wakeman, are Randy's attempt to create a problem. Randy has an agenda, Traditions, BPI/CVA/Winchester, have never replied to his liking when asked a direct question, and when they did he didn't like their explanation. Since then he has been on a one man campaign to rid us of these two companies. Another factor, he is a huge "buy" American fan which I agree with when possible.
Randy basis his campaign on the "Proof Stamp" on the barrel - He interprets this stamp to indicate the maximum pressure the barrel can successfuly stand over a large number of discharges... Traditions - CVA both maintain the stamp is not a pressure test and using a quote from Ray Crow Austin & Halleck. "and he is speaking for Austin & Halleck only"
The markings are from the proof house and does not necessarily mean that that is what they are proofed to.
Austin & Halleck, Inc.
Ray Crow
Operations Manager
2122 S. 950 E.
Provo, UT 84606
(877)543-3256
Fax: (801)655-0847
www.austinhalleck.com
Austin & Halleck, Inc.
Ray Crow
Operations Manager
2122 S. 950 E.
Provo, UT 84606
(877)543-3256
Fax: (801)655-0847
www.austinhalleck.com
If in doubt always refer to your manual and if necessary follow up with a conversation with the manufacture - they really do want you to be safe...
02-09-2005, 08:48 AM
#16
Boone & Crockett
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Idaho
Posts: 11,703
RE: BP guns blowing up?
rick_reno ,
Write Cayugad a PM (personal Message) and ask him about pressure signs, there are some and I can not think of anyone that will give you straighter answers than him.... He has been in this game a long time
Write Cayugad a PM (personal Message) and ask him about pressure signs, there are some and I can not think of anyone that will give you straighter answers than him.... He has been in this game a long time
02-09-2005, 08:52 AM
#17
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Bergen Co. NJ
Posts: 129
RE: BP guns blowing up?
ORIGINAL: bigcountry
I don't believe, that the ML are blowing up cause of magnum loads. A ML is a special thing that you can place in the category with reloading. You do it enough you are going to make a mistake. Bottom line.
I don't believe, that the ML are blowing up cause of magnum loads. A ML is a special thing that you can place in the category with reloading. You do it enough you are going to make a mistake. Bottom line.
I for one have people counting on me to make it to work on Monday morning...(part of the commitment I took when I said "I do"). Sure I have insurance in case I don't, but I owe it to them to make every effort that I do.
And generally speaking when I have powder igniting and pressures building inches from my face I want to know that the components containing them are capable of doing so even if I do make a mistake.
I work in an industry that is considered to be in the top five of dangerous jobs and safety is priority one.
I buy the best equipment I can, in all my endeavors, because someday my life could depend on it. If there are safety issues involved with a particular brand or type of firearm I want to know about it. Normally, when I get a safety recall on the vehicle my family is riding in, I at the very least read it....
Jim B.
02-09-2005, 10:16 AM
#20
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 2,922
RE: BP guns blowing up?
Many of the ruptures are avoidable. The 777 crud ring has caused alot of problems with short projectile seating. Pellets have caused problems after repeated breakage while loading. When breaking pellets repeatedly, they SLOWLY decrease bore wall strength where the powder sits. Swab often using 777... don't take chances... make sure the bullet is against the powder. When using pellets, it's SAFER not to use a grunting, tight-fitting bullet in combination with pellets.
If your sidelock suddenly starts pulling the hammer back to 1/2 cock.. somethings wrong that's creating back-pressure. If it gives you a burning spot on your hand, arm or face after firing, somethings wrong in the nipple thread area.
If the barrel becomes difficult to load (or) becomes too easy to load, there's a problem with it's iron/steel integrity. If blowback around the breechplug/209 primer area increases or the primer becomes distorted, frayed or mangled-looking, change that breechplug immediately. Also check the bottom holes in your nipples & breechplug for size variations & check the permanent seal & tightness on sidelock breechplugs.
If your sidelock suddenly starts pulling the hammer back to 1/2 cock.. somethings wrong that's creating back-pressure. If it gives you a burning spot on your hand, arm or face after firing, somethings wrong in the nipple thread area.
If the barrel becomes difficult to load (or) becomes too easy to load, there's a problem with it's iron/steel integrity. If blowback around the breechplug/209 primer area increases or the primer becomes distorted, frayed or mangled-looking, change that breechplug immediately. Also check the bottom holes in your nipples & breechplug for size variations & check the permanent seal & tightness on sidelock breechplugs.