i read the article to be found at the link below. this article indicates that an alternative for a MMP sub-base is the gas seal trimmed off of a 28 gauge shotshell wad. the cost savings here is unbelievable. 500 shotshell wads cost $9.00. 500 sub-bases from MMP cost $77.50. however, i measured a shotshell wad base and it is 0.533. the sabot measures 0.503. the bore in my rifle is 0.505. it seems like compressing the 0.533 wad down into a 0.505 bore may be something which will increase pressure levels.....maybe to a dangerous level, maybe not....i do not know. for that matter, i don't know for sure that it will increase pressure at all.

do any of you have any experience using the shotshell bases as suggested in the article linked below? the only real reason for doing this is economics, but it really one heckuva savings if it works. please advise.

http://www.gunweek.com/2004/feature0610.html

bill smith

The first sub bases to be used, by Toby Bridges I believe, were28 guage shotsell bases... and it is still recommended a lot by different shooters... With the new Polymere sabots that really contain pressure better than the older Plastic sabots have almost made sub-bases un-neccesary. That may be different story in the case of the Savage with smokeless powder.

I have a couple packages of sub-bases and have used maybe 10 of them - did not see any difference.

The 28 guage sub-base should not create a great of extra pressure unless you believe you are leaking pressure with your current sabots...

I used them when I was experimenting with a 54 hawken years a go they fit my 54 just right done wonders for conicals. Lee

Ireadwhat the article saysaboutothershootersbeingable to make the plastic28 gauge wadbases fit, but with those oversizeddimensions,they dosound like they would be tight to load.
Maybe there's another option?
Why does a base wad need to be made out of plastic at all?
Folks haveoftenmade their ownwads out of hard felt (like Wonder Wads), milk cartons, playing cards or shotgun over powder card material,or harder or softer commercialfiber wads. Maybe some other kind of suitable gasket material can serveas a gas check in atrial runfirst to see if it helps,hurts or has no effect on your rifle'sperformance.
Either make apunch out ofa piece of copper pipewherethe edges have been ground down to be sharp enough to cut through the wad material you've selected, or buy a cheap set or a single punch and try experimenting with different materials to use as an effectivewad.
I would thinkthat a tighter wad would lead to some additional feltrecoiltoo.
Would the.50 caliber Wonder Wadsbe too expensive per shot for you to considertrying it as a gas check/sub base?

"used maybe 10 of them - did not see any difference."

Tried them myself and they did nothing for me. IMO-They are not needed. Good qualitysabots perform really well even with150 grains of Pyrodex granular. The only sabots that i ever hadtrouble withwere someolder green onesseveral years ago when i was using130-150 grains of granularPyrodex. If the load shoots a good group at 100 yards there is nothing wrong with the sabots you are using.

The Savage M/L may be different.

arcticap - no, Wonder Wads would not be out of the question, nor would the idea of making my own out of felt or some other material. most anything would do, if i needed it. i was just asking about these shotshell wads because i have a bag of 500 and haveno 28 gauge shotgun. my real concern though was the tight fit,and any pressure issues it might cause. however, from the other responses, it sounds like the issue has been resolved by the manufacturers of sabots using better materials.

so, everyone, thanks for the advice. i appreciate it. i have several Knight "high pressure" sabots. from the packaging, it sounds like these are made specifically for use with heavier loads. thanks again.