todb,

I don't have an account there yet. Can you paraphrase what was written there?

i feel that its the wind that knocked him off so much, you can never guess wind mph. Its like trying to throw a football accuratly to the north against 18-20mph wind blowing west, you have to shoot and practice to get an idea where it will hit. i feel that if you do not have the patience to try to work things out with this one, then muzzleloading is not your sport.

Pglasgow

Here you go un-paraphrased... Big 6X6 wrote this I think he is a more than fair person and very knowledgable... just my thoughts

Quote:

I have to admit but I've owned a total of four, two .45s and two .50s. The first I bought was a .45. It wouldn't shoot. I mean it wouldn't shoot an 8 inch group at 100yds! I sent it back and they sent me another. Same results if not worse. I tried 225gr/275gr Powderbelts, 200gr SSTs/XTPs, 195gr Barnes Expander...90-100gr Triple Se7en. No luck. Sent it back...they replaced IT with a .50cal Apex. No luck, same results. We're taking 8-10 inch groups here. Replaced IT with another .50cal and I sold it without shooting it for $225.00 NIB, lost my BUTT but was glad to get it! It's too bad because it was one great looking rifle, good sights(I mounted a scope of course), and a really nice stock.

Okay there's my story...I HAVE heard of a few that did shoot. Do you have a scope mounted? Everything good there? I too would start out with some XTPs or Shockwaves. Start with the 250gr .452 XTP or 250gr Shockwave and use 90-100gr ffg Triple Se7en OR two pellets, Pyrodex or Triple Se7en. If THAT doesn't group try 200gr Shockwaves with the same charge. In my experience if it doesn't group with that, it probably won't group. Be sure and spit-patch between shots and don't get your barrel TOO hot.

_________________
Chuck

Txhunter58,

Why don't you give T/C another chance to resolve it. But before sending it make sure someone there knows what it will take to gain your satisfaction. If you feel its the tight spot in the barrel, ask them for warranty replacement on grounds of defects in workmanship. Let them know that it will take replacement of the barrel to give you satisfaction. Maybe they will meet this demand if you request it.

Owned a total of four what?

Added: Oh Apex, well I guess he is the big cahuna. Mine shoots great so far, so does Scoutdad. Zurenics has one. teachhunt has taken a deer already. My dad has one. If the problem is as bad as he describe, there will be problems on calm days with some of ours. This will be interesting. Anyway, nothing can fix the point of impact with a 245 PB in a 18mph crosswind. I know how low BC conicals shoot in this kind of wind and it isn't pretty. One must measure vertical spread to get any idea of precision.

Pglasgow, Have you tried 20gr of corn meal with an over the powder wad on top of it? for some reason thats what it takes to get my Omega to shoot conicals [except for PB of course] Lee

Outdoor's rifle is a shooter, atfirst it was, it wont group after 12 shots,didnt swab because its to much work, then its i swabbed between every shot and i love it now and then its,throw up my arms,i shot out in the wind and didnt hit anything. We cant figure out the problem all the time, 18mph wind is very powerful. Shooting in wind thats going west to east or the other way is like shooting at a walking deer, gotta lead it! I offered to buy it at the price he paid and then some. I think my offer was more than fair for a rifle that doest shoot forsquat and doesntoffer a warranty to me. What else is there do say or do? You can only do so much.

Pglasgow
OOPs! - forgot the title - Winchester Apex

Lee I haven't tried that yet. I've not been out on a calm day but I get sub-MOA vertical spread at 80 yards with the 270 ballets and 80 grains BP. That's better than my Sidekick, at least as good as it. I really want to stretch out range, but beyond 100 yards I need a better bullet than a 270 ballet. I really liked how the cornmeal worked in my sidekick, so I look forward to testing it in the Apex.

I don't know about you guys, but I could never get a good group when cleaning after every shot, however if I shot a fouling load, which was always high and right, then 3 shots I was getting good groups, then I'd clean the gun. reshoot a fouling load and then 3 shots. I got great groups doing this, but I shoot one of those cheap CVA's

Just my 2 cents.

My philosophy is I want to see how it shoots in the field if I have to reload and shoot again, which I have had the opportunity to several times. I don't know how many guys want to carry wet and dry patches adn then try to clean their gun in a tree stand all while trying to hurry before the target leaves the area.