Got my soil test back from the Ag. department. We have a ph level of 5.3. They are telling to apply 9-12 tons of lime per acre to reach 6.3 for clover. Does this sound right?? I know we need line but that sounds like and incredable amount. I' m glad we only have a 1/3 acre. Plus the field is only accsessible by atv. That would mean alot of trips with bags of lime.

Also. we have sprayed Roundup on the field 2X' s this spring.The grass is dead. but the 12" - 15" tall grass is all laying down in the field. should this be removed? disced under? cut and raked?
This field can get pretty wet when it rains ( water standing 2" - 4" in spots). We tried roto-tilling (what a job)a couple years back and ended up with mud almost knee deep.

[Deleted by Admins]

Uncle Al - Sounds like a tough field - I agree with Pat the soil test sounds right - I' d guess the field is heavy clay/silt with a high buffer (like our land is in NY). Its sad to say - but my numbers were very similar, only a little bit better than yours.

On the bright side - Red clover, and Most White clovers grow pretty well on soils 5.5-6.0 Ph (though better at 6.5) - You can still have a really good plot at 6.0 - just keep applying lime - do not remove the clippings from mowing, and soil test ever three years.


The standing water is likely due to a heavy clay content and/or bedrock not far below the surface (or a low spot - though I didn' t get that impression). The standing water will KILL almost all clover if it stands 2 weeks or more - I have some sections of field like this - I plant them anyhow - but usually lose the clover or rye or corn that goes there.

The hardest part of the soil test for me to understand was the " BUFFER" or " Ex Acidity" on my soil test. Also sometimes referred to as ACIDITY IN RESERVE.

But this is the reason why you are being told to put down 9-12 tons of lime/acre - someone with sandy soil and the same PH might only have to put down 3 ton/acre. The difference is soil type. Its my understanding that heavier soils (loam, clay) will require more lime to adjust the Ph one point because of its ability to buffer the effects of lime. The Buffer (Ex acidity), is an indication of the amount of lime required to have ANY EFFECT on soil Ph. In other words - if you put down say 3 tons of lime per acre - you will first have to erase the buffer before the Ph will change at all- and you may still end up with a Ph of 5.3. Any lime applied once the buffer is 0, will have a direct effect on the Ph of the soil.

To get a better handle on the amount exactly to erase the buffer - you should talk to your Ag Rep. -

If someone on this board can explain this better than I Did - please do - I' d like to better understand it myself.

Good luck, and keep your eyes open for a drier spot, even if some trees have to be removed - It might be worth the effort in the long run.

just a comment here....when i get my soil tests back from the extension office they give me the sheet with the recommendation for my specific plot (tons of lime) and staple a generic lime sheet to the printout.

the recommendations of lime are for a 12" (iirc) incorporation and 100% ECC.

if i just worked the lime in the top 6" , i would just need half the recommended amount.

if my lime is only 50% ECC, i would need twice what they recommended.

hope that makes sense.

Whatever you do, don' t buy your lime by the bag. It' ll cost you alot more. Buy it in bulk. If there' s no way you can get a spreader truck in there to lime it for you then you can have them drop it in a pile, and haul it in yourself for spreading. I' d get at least half the lime on it now, disc it in, put rest on it before winter. Spread your recommended fertilizer in the spring, re-disc & plant. It took me 3yrs to get my soil right for planting. But its definitly paying off.

farm hunter that was a great explaination.

To get a handle on buffer pH think about the surface area of the soil. A 1" square rock has 6 sq. inches of surface area. If you split the rock into pieces 1/2" square you now has 8 pieces each with 3 sq. inches of surface area each or 24 sq. in. total. Sand has large particles with little surface area. Clay is very fine with a huge surface area.

The soil particle surface contains the active chemical sites that hold fertilizer and other materials including the materials that have excess hydrogen or OH- groups. That' s why clay soils need more lime to neutralize the acidity.

Then there' s buffer solutions. Some chemicals don' t follow the straight acid-base titration curves. They undergo chemical conversions at certain pH' s and hold the pH of the solution at that level until they' re fully converted. If you have a large amount of a material that acts this way and combine it with a clay soil with many active chemical sites (large surface area) it can take a very large amount of lime to change the pH to where you want it.

The good thing is that it should also take more crop extraction and leaching to lower the pH back to where it was.

Dan O.

My plots have all been between 4.1 and 5.0. ALL of my tests came back with roughly a 4 ton per acre recommendation.

What could possibly be the difference? Could it be because I have very little top soil and I only ever work it to 4" with the tiller? I did put that I would be working it to only 4" on the soil test.

Also, as you said, getting the lime to the field can be a problem, especially if you are limited to an ATV/Tractor such as myself. If you get bulk lime delivered, that' s a lot of work to shovel it into a trailer, and then to shovel out. I' ve put out about 28 tons in the last 4 years, and I can only go with bags. Guys will try and give me other advice on how to get it spread, but trust me, and save the advice, it' s the ONLY way I can do it. I pay around $50.00 a ton.

I personally think your recommendation must have been based on a greater soil working depth, or something, but a couple tons of lime can be spread easily by 2 to 3 guys in pretty short time. I' ve spread by hand, shovel, hand-spreader, and PTO mounted broadcaster, and when I don' t feel like getting the tractor out, I do it by hand. It is much easier than it sounds. I had a friend help this spring for example, and we put out 2 tons in less than 2 hours. We used 2 ATV' s, and put 500#' s on each ATV, each time. That' s 4 trips in and out, at 15 minutes round trip(including loading lime by bag on ATV racks), with an hour to spread. It' s easy, you just open the bag 1/2 way across the end, and walk and spread as wide as you can, with the angle of the bag regulating the flow. Walk at normal speed, and go around 4' wide, and you are spreading at about a 4 ton per acre rate. Literally, it took us under 2 hours, with an hour of driving, to spread 2 tons. Last spring I spread 4500#' s with 9 trips with the ATV, over about a weeks time, with each trip taking a total of about a 1/2 hour. Really, not a big deal.

By the way, all of my soil tests came back this year at 6.5 to 7.3. Must be working!

Jeff...U.P. of Michigan

i have spread bulk lime (from a quarry, $6 per ton) from the back of a pickup with a small gasoline powered LEAFBLOWER. it' s incredibly easy and quick. you need 2 people, one to drive and one guy that does the blowing.

You should be able to raise the soil pH value one point with 2-3 tons of high dolomite lime per acre. You may want to look into the liquid limes as an additive.