Whitetail Deer Hunting Gain a better understanding of the World's most popular big game animal and the techniques that will help you become a better deer hunter.

For All you 223 Fans

Old 02-05-2008, 09:10 PM
  #71  
Boone & Crockett
 
ipscshooter's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: The Republic of Texas
Posts: 12,084
Default RE: For All you 223 Fans

ORIGINAL: Killer_Primate

There is nothing wrong with your example. However, rightfully so, you’ve customized your example to suit your argument. And it is a good example of what could really happen. But how many examples could we use?


Obviously, my hypothetical was just that. Hypothetical. I don't have a clue what the real numbers might be.

I would pose the question to you, using your example, why not try to get all 2900 ft-lbs of energy into the animal? You could do it, if you got a faster expanding projectile, but why? It is excessive, in my opinion to try to do so and would probably look more like an explosion took place than an animal getting shot.
I try to use bullets that are reasonably suited to the quarry. They expand properly and don't waste a lot of meat.

In your example, you’d be sending a projectile beyond your target with 1100 ft-lbs of energy. Is that responsible? In most cases, sure, in some, probably not. Since in your example you wasted 1100 lbs, you wasted gun powder, brass, copper and lead.
I don't think it's "wasted". It's there if needed for a slightly longer shot, or a quartering angle that might require a little more pop.

You probably spend more money on your rifle and the same rifle chambered in .223. And this situation is fine, but so is not wasting the energy.
Assuming the same rifle, I don't think it costs any more to get, say, a 700 SPS in .30-06 than a 700 SPS in .223. I've got three rifles that I use for deer. My 700 ADL .30-06 was a gift from my wife. Free. My 700 BDL 7mm Rem Mag was inherited. Free. My 700 ADL .243 was on sale for $249, with a two gun hard case thrown in for good measure. So, all three combined cost less than my AR15 .223...

Now, what if you only put 350 ft-lbs of energy into the deer? Keep in mind that is about the power of a .45 ACP which I’d have to assume that we’d agree is capable of traveling through the ribcage of a deer. Now you’ve got 2550 ft-lbs of energy going beyond your target.

I think that the second example is closer to reality than the first. I guess we’d have to compare a lot more than just energy and speed though to come to any real conclusion.
Taking an example from my martial arts classes, when breaking bricks and boards, the object is a full strength blow THROUGH the target. Not, hitting the target but instantaneously decreasing the velocity of hte strike. As I said earlier, I think a harder blow all the way through the target would logically be more devastating than a mild blow decreasing to virtual zero at the off-side of the target.
ipscshooter is offline  
Old 02-05-2008, 10:03 PM
  #72  
 
BigTiny's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Louisiana
Posts: 3,145
Default RE: For All you 223 Fans


ORIGINAL: ipscshooter

My 700 ADL .30-06 was a gift from my wife. Free.
You are a lucky man. My wife buys me stuff using my checking account, not exactly free, but I guess it's the thought that counts.
BigTiny is offline  
Old 02-05-2008, 11:08 PM
  #73  
JPF
Fork Horn
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Briercrest, Saskatchewan
Posts: 116
Default RE: For All you 223 Fans

ORIGINAL: octafoil

I "live" in a shotgun only zone, so I use my 20ga Mossberg exclusively, and I get razzed for it's small GA. Kids gun, they say. But what they can't razz me about is the wall of fame. Using the 20ga Barnes Expandable Sabot, I'm flat out to about 90-100 yds. Funny thing with that is you can't see more than 50yds clear anywhere in my swamp.
I believe RR's " to small" .223 also has an impressive wall of fame. You are both proving the same point. 'Some may think its small, but its legal, I shoot good with it and it works.' Strange that you seem to very against using a .223 when there is better choices out there, but use 20 guage, when there are better choices out there, ( better by whose standards?? he who thinks his way is best?).
As for me .223 isnt legal here so not an option ( its my coyote gun). As long as the kill is clean, use what works.
enjoy the debate.
JPF is offline  
Old 02-14-2008, 04:22 PM
  #74  
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location:
Posts: 99
Default RE: For All you 223 Fans

JPF....Had to step out for awhile..business. Never stated for or against, I only asked "why". Never gotdefinitive answer. There were a few on here that took my question of "why", as I'm "against" it's use, wrong again. I was also questioned about "my" experience with the rounds affects, even after i stated my long history with the weapon, again, all because I asked "why". Pretty funny actually.
octafoil is offline  
Old 02-15-2008, 12:34 PM
  #75  
 
DoveshooterII's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Elmore, Alabama
Posts: 305
Default RE: For All you 223 Fans

Hey splitear, a 800 yd. shot on a deer is nothing. Me and some friends shoot a metal dong that is 1ft. in diameter, at 900 yards, w/ a .308!
DoveshooterII is offline  
Old 02-15-2008, 09:15 PM
  #76  
Typical Buck
 
Seif5034's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Mississippi
Posts: 600
Default RE: For All you 223 Fans

i'd probably take the shot if i had decent optics and was very comfy with my gun. I don't really like the .223 but i know it has alright penetration. If you think about it 100yds isn't all that much for a rifle. there are people capable of taking deer at that distance(broadside) with a bow.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8F0-jKmvCCI
Seif5034 is offline  
Old 02-15-2008, 10:03 PM
  #77  
 
BigTiny's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Louisiana
Posts: 3,145
Default RE: For All you 223 Fans


ORIGINAL: DoveshooterII

Hey splitear, a 800 yd. shot on a deer is nothing. Me and some friends shoot a metal dong that is 1ft. in diameter, at 900 yards, w/ a .308!
Why you own a metal dong that size is your business, but nobody's going to believe you got it just for shooting.
BigTiny is offline  
Old 02-19-2008, 12:41 PM
  #78  
Typical Buck
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 590
Default RE: For All you 223 Fans

Your "response" to my post is a crackup for evading my point. My main point is that shooting with a .22-caliber is a lot like shooting with a bow. You can't break down a shoulder, so you have to wait for a broadside shot. So what?

Your reply goes on to make my other point, that big caliber guys seem to feel it is an affront to their manhood to ever pass up a shot. I wonder frankly if that attitude, that your shoulder cannon entitles you to shoot at any animal at any angle doesn't result in more wounded game than a disciplined small-caliber shooter.

Finally, I know a fellow who kills elk with a .223. I'm not really arguing for or against any caliber, I think virtually any caliber can kill game if it's used right, and absolutely any caliber can wound game in the hands of a moron.

P.S. I'm on my way to the library to get a book about an old elephant hunter who killed over a thousand elephants with a .25 caliber rifle.
Dirt2 is offline  
Old 02-19-2008, 02:37 PM
  #79  
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Missouri
Posts: 1,429
Default RE: For All you 223 Fans

ORIGINAL: Dirt2

P.S. I'm on my way to the library to get a book about an old elephant hunter who killed over a thousand elephants with a .25 caliber rifle.
I believe you will find that it was actually a 6.5x55 swede (.264" bullet) but I digress!

Anyone that thinks a deer at 100 yards quartering to with a 223 shouldn't be taken is mistaken. A 223 will absolutely turn that buck inside out. If you make that shot the buck will most likely drop like a ton of bricks. You undoubtably find that the bullet sprawled down the spinal column producing massive shock to the central nevous system.

Why do you think the military uses the 5.56 nato? I mean do you honestly believe that they use a completely inferior round. The reason they use it, is because its an effective round. The round has a tendancy to travel along bones until all energy is gone. thats why shots in the lower extremities have proven fatal and the bullet is generally recovered in the chest cavity even thought the entry wound is in an extremity.

I don't hunt deer with a 223. I have a 280 for that. But I know first hand what a 223 can do to a deer. Never underestimate what the little round can do in the right hands. As a matter of fact I witnessed a large doe bang flopped at 95 steps with a 22 hornet by a 8 year old boy. I told him to hold on the point of the shoulder on a broadside shot, and thats where he hit. Deer floped like it had been hit with a 338 win mag.
ShatoDavis is offline  
Old 02-20-2008, 06:32 AM
  #80  
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Asheboro NC
Posts: 56
Default RE: For All you 223 Fans

ORIGINAL: BigTiny


Why you own a metal dong that size is your business, but nobody's going to believe you got it just for shooting.

I know 223 will kill deer, but that is one of the funniest statements I've ever read on a board.....
Coleridge is offline  
Related Topics
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
rybohunter
Turkey Hunting
24
05-25-2007 09:22 AM

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off


Quick Reply: For All you 223 Fans


Contact Us - Manage Preferences - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service -

Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.