zrexpilot

This is what .22 Hornet did to the neck on a 110 lb spike.

octafoil

Ridgerunner.....I've "never" shot a deer with a .223. I ask again "WHY" would I want to? I'm retired military, I know a few things about the round and the results from the round. Nuff said. Why take the chance of that round bouncing around the gut, I have heard of that exact result as many times as a "dropped dead" in his tracks. My point is, I wouldn't take a chance of tainted meat, bullet shards embedded in my steaks, or just plain not finding a blood trail. Just the way "I" roll. I was raised to make a quick, clean, efficient kill at all times, not roll the dice. I know that many have made the perfect shot, and I commend them, as could I. But that weapon is"well" designed for other things. Just my opinion.

the_sandman_454

Would you take the shot with a .30-30? Both rounds have more or less similar energy depending on load. There are projectiles in bothcalibers that are designed to hold together/expand rather than fragment. (Edited here) I apologize, I mis-spoke abovedue to having acase of .22-250 on the brain today, when referencing the similarities in energy. Obviously .223 has a bit less energy than that. Sorry for the disruption. (Editing completed)

Just wanted to comment on the .223 being designed to wound and that being why the military chose it, yadda yadda. I've seen a few articles on why the military went away from the .308 and .30-06 for the primary weapons. The sources seemed to unanimously agree that the reasoning behind it was the fact that the average soldier just wasn't taking advantage of the long range the .308 afforded and the fact that full auto/suppressing fire was uncontrollable.For those reasons, the decision was made to switch to a round that was smaller and lighter which would allow for an individual to carry a lot more ammunition and have more control during burst or automatic fire. From what I've been able to gather, the tumbling effect was due to improper (or maybe proper if you want that terminal effect) twist rate versusbullet length/weight. With the proper twist, bullet constructionand bullet weight you shouldn't have to worry as much about the bullet bouncing around as penetrating and doing its job.

isatarak

You can't use the military use argument. They have to use full metal jacket ammo in the military and I know in Oklahoma full metal jacket ammo is not allowed.

I will say this. You can't take a .223 out and make a bad 300yd shot on a deer and blow a leg off and recover the deer like you might on some other calibers. Yes, there are shots you shouldn't take that you might take with a larger, more powerful caliber. The case would be the same for a 30-30. You have to know the limitations of the gun you are using. The .223 will work and work well for deer. It does have its limitations. End of story.

BigTiny

The .223 is not designed to wound anything, it is designed to kill. The military went with it because one soldier can carry beaucoup more ammo with the .223 than he can with a .308 or .30-06. More rounds can be stored in available magazine space and more rounds can be shipped to the battlefield in the same cargo space.

The military has changed the way they train snipers, which has resulted in more enemy wounded. They expanded the target zone from the "T" to include center mass hits as critical. This was a result of having to lower standards for snipers due to the decrease in new recruits as well as the increased demand for them on the battlefield.

I didn't start off as a big fan of the .223, but the more I have used it, the more I like it.

ipscshooter

Haha... The thread that wouldn't die.

I guess one of the benefits of this thread is that we no longer appear to have the clueless ranting and raving about what a weak round the .243 Win. is and how it's a poor excuse for a deer cartridge...

octafoil

Ridgerunner, I not arguing with you. I carried the weapon most my adult life, "my point is moot?" You say you have killed over 100 w/ your .223, is that 101 or 128, or 147, 199, 1000??? Then you state you "own 5 .223's", WOW 5? Then you go on to state that I don't think that 30/06, .308, 45/70 or my favorite one the 30/40 "CRAIG". It's "KRAG" Norweigen. And yes, you're right it is getting stupid, I offered my opinion when the question was posed on the subject, and you attacked my so-called uninformed opinion. Why would you bring up the other calibers, when the question was .223? I guess you felt it made your point?

swamp rooster

ok,,you shoot him with your 7 mm stw,,,

ipscshooter

He was implying that the other cartridges were "designed for other things", just as you stated the .223 was. Those other cartridges were all of military origin as well.

FWIW, since 38 of the 43 states that allow rifle hunting authorize the use of the .223 for deer, it seems to me this is rather a ridiculous argument. It's a legal cartridge almost everywhere, so, the question of ethics comes down to whether the shooter has the discipline to wait on that perfect shot. Frankly, I'm more impressed by the opinion of someone who has used it successfully many, many times, than the opinion of someone who simply says "it'll never work" without ever having used it in the field.

BarnesX.308

Where are you getting that notion? The heart is going to pump the blood out the where the vessels have been severed. The deer's lungs would have to fill up to send the blood out his nose and mouth. Sure they have some blood coming from the nose and mouth sometimes, but a ton more is coming out of the exit would.