Carbon vs. Alunimun vs. Wood
01-07-2006, 10:11 AM
#1
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 34
Carbon vs. Alunimun vs. Wood
Hey I've been bowhunting for a while now but recently I've been getting more serious about it. In the past I've just got some cheap arrows off of ebay. just whateverI could find for something like a dollar or two an arrow. As you may be able to guess they don't work as well as they could so my question is what is the differance in all of the arrows and what do you rate them.
Nick
___________________
Weapon - Martin recurve X-200
Target - Turkey and any small game
Example - Gobble! Gobble!>---->zing
Nick
___________________
Weapon - Martin recurve X-200
Target - Turkey and any small game
Example - Gobble! Gobble!>---->zing
01-07-2006, 12:28 PM
#2
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 9,175
RE: Carbon vs. Alunimun vs. Wood
What a loaded question THAT is! [:-]
Well, here's my two cents about it...
Aluminum. Best out of the box straightness, assuming you're looking at arrows in the same price range. Absolutely consistent in spine and weight. Each 2018, for instance,will be exactly like any other 2018 of the same model. They've got good weight to them right off the shelf. They are easy to work with. Hot melt works like a champ for inserts and Fletchtite is great for fletchings and nocks. If you want to change inserts, just heat the old one and pull it out, stick in the new one. In a pinch, you can use a tube cutter to cut them to length. Not recommended, but it works if you're real careful. If you bend aluminum arrows, they can often be straightened back to factory tolerances, or at least good enough to keep using them for stump shooting or small game.
My second favorite selection for arrows.
Carbon. Not nearly as straight, nor as consistent in spine and weightas aluminums in the same price range. Most folks have to add weight to them so they won't make the bow loud and feel like you swatted a boulder with a baseball bat every time you shoot. Adding weight to carbons is the biggest pain I've ever had to deal with and it adds quite a bitto the cost of each arrow.
I haven't found any glue that will keep the insert in the arrow during use but will also let you replace it when you need to. I've lost many inserts in targets trying different glues. The only stuff I've found that will keep them in place is 24 hour epoxy, and then you can't remove epoxied inserts without ruining the arrow.
They're tougher than aluminum in that they'll take a hit that'll often bend an aluminum. Although, I've had some aluminum arrows survive a hit unscathed that would turn a carbon arrow into dust. With traditional equipment, I think the toughness factor is a wash.
Get a bad release with an aluminum arrow and it can ring like a bell. You hear a loud, metallic hum coming from the arrow as it goes downrange. Carbons are quiet, no matter how bad your release is. You can quiet aluminums by stuffing them full of the foam florists use to make up flower arrangements though.
The last arrow I'd choose to shoot.
A type of arrow you don't mention is carbon/fiberglass composite. My favorite in that type is Carbon Express Terminator Selects. About the same price as XX75 aluminums. Good straightness, good consistency in spine and weight. They have enough weight that you don't have to fiddle with adding weight to them like you do with carbon arrows. They are tougher than either carbon or aluminum, but have the same small diameter of ICS carbon arrows. Very good arrows, almost equal to aluminums for accuracy.
My third choice.
Or there are the aluminum/carbon composite arrows like ACC's. If you're concerned about getting the best bang for the buck though, they're a little pricey. You have to be a really goodshot to take advantage of the quality. I'm not good enough to warrent spending the money for them. [&o]
Not at all my cup of tea for a traditional arrow, but for tournament shooting with a compound? Top of my list.
Aluminum, carbons and composites are all best cut to length with high speed arrow saws.
Wood arrows. Ahhhh... WOOD! They're my favorite arrows. Verydifficult or very expensive, or both,to get a dozen matched in spine and weight. They're not all that durable, compared to carbon, aluminum or composites. Although, some of the hardwoods like ash and hickory are pretty tough. Problem is you pay for the extra toughness with a lot of extra arrow weight. (Sometimes you might want a very heavy arrow for larger and tougher game animals though.)They'll warpwith changes in humidity, so you're always straightening them.
You've got to have tapering tools to put the nock and point tapers on them, but you can cut them to length with a fine-toothed saw or even score around them with a pocketknife and snap off the excess. You have to orient the wood grain the same on all your arrows when you fletch 'em up and put nocks on them.
But there is no arrow ever made that's as pleasant to shoot as a wood arrow. Very quiet in flight. When you have them made up correctly, they are as accurate as any of the other arrow types. They just reek of history and tradition. You can't really imagine yourself as Robin Hood striding though Sherwood with a quiver full of carbon or aluminum arrows rattling around. [:'(]
And the aroma of a freshlybroken Port Orford cedar arrow is heaven on earth.
It smells so good that you're hardly even upset to be an arrow shorter.
Preferring wood is irrational, I know. It's one of those things that can't be explained.
Well, here's my two cents about it...
Aluminum. Best out of the box straightness, assuming you're looking at arrows in the same price range. Absolutely consistent in spine and weight. Each 2018, for instance,will be exactly like any other 2018 of the same model. They've got good weight to them right off the shelf. They are easy to work with. Hot melt works like a champ for inserts and Fletchtite is great for fletchings and nocks. If you want to change inserts, just heat the old one and pull it out, stick in the new one. In a pinch, you can use a tube cutter to cut them to length. Not recommended, but it works if you're real careful. If you bend aluminum arrows, they can often be straightened back to factory tolerances, or at least good enough to keep using them for stump shooting or small game.
My second favorite selection for arrows.
Carbon. Not nearly as straight, nor as consistent in spine and weightas aluminums in the same price range. Most folks have to add weight to them so they won't make the bow loud and feel like you swatted a boulder with a baseball bat every time you shoot. Adding weight to carbons is the biggest pain I've ever had to deal with and it adds quite a bitto the cost of each arrow.
I haven't found any glue that will keep the insert in the arrow during use but will also let you replace it when you need to. I've lost many inserts in targets trying different glues. The only stuff I've found that will keep them in place is 24 hour epoxy, and then you can't remove epoxied inserts without ruining the arrow.
They're tougher than aluminum in that they'll take a hit that'll often bend an aluminum. Although, I've had some aluminum arrows survive a hit unscathed that would turn a carbon arrow into dust. With traditional equipment, I think the toughness factor is a wash.
Get a bad release with an aluminum arrow and it can ring like a bell. You hear a loud, metallic hum coming from the arrow as it goes downrange. Carbons are quiet, no matter how bad your release is. You can quiet aluminums by stuffing them full of the foam florists use to make up flower arrangements though.
The last arrow I'd choose to shoot.
A type of arrow you don't mention is carbon/fiberglass composite. My favorite in that type is Carbon Express Terminator Selects. About the same price as XX75 aluminums. Good straightness, good consistency in spine and weight. They have enough weight that you don't have to fiddle with adding weight to them like you do with carbon arrows. They are tougher than either carbon or aluminum, but have the same small diameter of ICS carbon arrows. Very good arrows, almost equal to aluminums for accuracy.
My third choice.
Or there are the aluminum/carbon composite arrows like ACC's. If you're concerned about getting the best bang for the buck though, they're a little pricey. You have to be a really goodshot to take advantage of the quality. I'm not good enough to warrent spending the money for them. [&o]
Not at all my cup of tea for a traditional arrow, but for tournament shooting with a compound? Top of my list.
Aluminum, carbons and composites are all best cut to length with high speed arrow saws.
Wood arrows. Ahhhh... WOOD! They're my favorite arrows. Verydifficult or very expensive, or both,to get a dozen matched in spine and weight. They're not all that durable, compared to carbon, aluminum or composites. Although, some of the hardwoods like ash and hickory are pretty tough. Problem is you pay for the extra toughness with a lot of extra arrow weight. (Sometimes you might want a very heavy arrow for larger and tougher game animals though.)They'll warpwith changes in humidity, so you're always straightening them.
You've got to have tapering tools to put the nock and point tapers on them, but you can cut them to length with a fine-toothed saw or even score around them with a pocketknife and snap off the excess. You have to orient the wood grain the same on all your arrows when you fletch 'em up and put nocks on them.
But there is no arrow ever made that's as pleasant to shoot as a wood arrow. Very quiet in flight. When you have them made up correctly, they are as accurate as any of the other arrow types. They just reek of history and tradition. You can't really imagine yourself as Robin Hood striding though Sherwood with a quiver full of carbon or aluminum arrows rattling around. [:'(]
And the aroma of a freshlybroken Port Orford cedar arrow is heaven on earth.
It smells so good that you're hardly even upset to be an arrow shorter.Preferring wood is irrational, I know. It's one of those things that can't be explained.
01-09-2006, 06:05 PM
#3
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 34
RE: Carbon vs. Alunimun vs. Wood
Wow! Nice letter! Oh and nice use or smily faces!
Thanks for all of your feedback. what would you rate all of the arrows on a scale of one to ten on durability? Can you put braodheads on wood shafts? if so how? Also do you make your own wooden arrows? Do you have any advice? Sorry for all of the questions!
Nick
_______________
Weapon - Martin recurve X-200
Target - Turkey, small game and upland birds
Favorite hunting sound - Gobble Gobble >-----> zing!
Thanks for all of your feedback. what would you rate all of the arrows on a scale of one to ten on durability? Can you put braodheads on wood shafts? if so how? Also do you make your own wooden arrows? Do you have any advice? Sorry for all of the questions!Nick
_______________
Weapon - Martin recurve X-200
Target - Turkey, small game and upland birds
Favorite hunting sound - Gobble Gobble >-----> zing!
01-09-2006, 06:21 PM
#4
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Inverness, MS
Posts: 3,982
RE: Carbon vs. Alunimun vs. Wood
Yeah you can use broadheads with wood... They glue on just like the field tips......
I like to shoot wood..... I guess b/c of the history around them...... I would say at hunting ranges they can shoot as good as you can....
I've heard it said that aluminums and carbons can outshoot wood by 30pts or so on a NFAA 300 round..... I say all that big talk is hog squat..... Shoot what you want and what you can afford......
Durability wise, you can't beat a carbon/aluminum composite shaft like easton ACC..... But like Arthur said you often have problems getting your weights to proper ranges....
I enjoy the hobby of arrowmaking as well..... And when shooting wood you have plenty of opportunities
I like to shoot wood..... I guess b/c of the history around them...... I would say at hunting ranges they can shoot as good as you can....
I've heard it said that aluminums and carbons can outshoot wood by 30pts or so on a NFAA 300 round..... I say all that big talk is hog squat..... Shoot what you want and what you can afford......
Durability wise, you can't beat a carbon/aluminum composite shaft like easton ACC..... But like Arthur said you often have problems getting your weights to proper ranges....
I enjoy the hobby of arrowmaking as well..... And when shooting wood you have plenty of opportunities
01-09-2006, 06:35 PM
#5
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 34
RE: Carbon vs. Alunimun vs. Wood
Double Creek,
You said that you really enjoy making your own arrows. I myself have thought it would be cool to make my own arrows but I havn't really known how. Do you have any pointers? Thanks!!!
Nick
________________
Weapon - Martin recurve X-200
Target - Turkey, small game and upland birds
Favorite hunting sound - Gobble Gobble >-----> zing!
You said that you really enjoy making your own arrows. I myself have thought it would be cool to make my own arrows but I havn't really known how. Do you have any pointers? Thanks!!!
Nick
________________
Weapon - Martin recurve X-200
Target - Turkey, small game and upland birds
Favorite hunting sound - Gobble Gobble >-----> zing!
01-09-2006, 08:14 PM
#6
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Inverness, MS
Posts: 3,982
RE: Carbon vs. Alunimun vs. Wood
If I can do it, anyone can..... I promise......
When I say "make" I guess technically I don't make my arrows b/c I do buy the shafts first.... Then straighten them, taper them, seal them, fletch them, etc......
It will take some initial cash investment for to required tools.... I bought 550 Ramin Wood dowels and have sorted them by spine..... Half weren't even useable, but for $90 I ended up with 5 dozen hunting arrows, 9 dozen stumping and small game arrows, and another 10 dozen bird/squirrel arrows........ And another 10 dozen or so kid arrows......
The best pointers I can give you is to cruise the traditional archery websites and use the search feature on the forums...... You'll get all the info you want.....
As far as actually cutting a tree down and turning that into arrows, I can't help you.... I don't have the power tools necessary for that.... But the easiest natural shafts would be rivercane.... I have cut 2 dozen of those and am about ready to start playing with them.....
Necessary tools foran arrow maker and prices I paid are:
Spine Tester $70
Grain Scale $40
Arrow Straightener $35
Taper Tool$30
Fletcher$40
Arrow Saw $40
So as you can see the initial investment is high, but over time it more than pays for itself considering custom woodies will cost you $75 or better per dozen on average....
When I say "make" I guess technically I don't make my arrows b/c I do buy the shafts first.... Then straighten them, taper them, seal them, fletch them, etc......
It will take some initial cash investment for to required tools.... I bought 550 Ramin Wood dowels and have sorted them by spine..... Half weren't even useable, but for $90 I ended up with 5 dozen hunting arrows, 9 dozen stumping and small game arrows, and another 10 dozen bird/squirrel arrows........ And another 10 dozen or so kid arrows......
The best pointers I can give you is to cruise the traditional archery websites and use the search feature on the forums...... You'll get all the info you want.....
As far as actually cutting a tree down and turning that into arrows, I can't help you.... I don't have the power tools necessary for that.... But the easiest natural shafts would be rivercane.... I have cut 2 dozen of those and am about ready to start playing with them.....
Necessary tools foran arrow maker and prices I paid are:
Spine Tester $70
Grain Scale $40
Arrow Straightener $35
Taper Tool$30
Fletcher$40
Arrow Saw $40
So as you can see the initial investment is high, but over time it more than pays for itself considering custom woodies will cost you $75 or better per dozen on average....
01-12-2006, 12:10 PM
#7
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 34
RE: Carbon vs. Alunimun vs. Wood
hey I think I'm definitly leaning towards wood arrows and if I do start using wood arrows then I'm going to make them. What do you guys think of the differant woods? And also do you know any good places you can buy them? Thanks!!!!
Nick
________________
Weapon - Martin recurve X-200
Target - Turkey, small game and upland birds
Favorite hunting sound - Gobble Gobble >-----> zing!
Nick
________________
Weapon - Martin recurve X-200
Target - Turkey, small game and upland birds
Favorite hunting sound - Gobble Gobble >-----> zing!
01-12-2006, 12:54 PM
#8
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Inverness, MS
Posts: 3,982
RE: Carbon vs. Alunimun vs. Wood
I bought Ramin b/c they are cheap and you can get a bunch of them...... Most popular is Cedar, but they are high as a cat's back..... You also have Poplar, Hickory, Spruce, Chundoo, and others...... Do some searching around and decide..... Not sure about prices..... I bet Chad could help you there....
01-12-2006, 09:41 PM
#9
Typical Buck
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Humboldt County, California
Posts: 511
RE: Carbon vs. Alunimun vs. Wood
well nick it all depends on what shoots good for you. I grew up shooting a Ben person with 2016 XX75 easton aluminums. I shot these until my fingers were raw, until one day I went into the local archery shop and they had a sale on wooden arrows so I bought a dozen. Needless to say they ended up as fire wood. I got so use to how the aluminum arrows shot so instead of learning the way a wooden arrow shoots I gave up and stuck with what I started with and what I knew would bag me something. Sop I think you should try Carbon, Aluminum, and all arrows for that matter and see what shoots better.
But be advisedwood arrows have week spines so the arrow will flex more causing the arrow to be unaccurate. Carbons being so light weight can be dramatically effected by gusts of wind. so my opinion would be Aluminum is the way to go.
But be advisedwood arrows have week spines so the arrow will flex more causing the arrow to be unaccurate. Carbons being so light weight can be dramatically effected by gusts of wind. so my opinion would be Aluminum is the way to go.
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